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Census shows 1 in 2 people are poor or low-income

TurtleDude said:
Multiple choice question

what is the purpose of a corporation

1) to create a profit for the owners

2) to provide you a job

3) to fund the government with taxes
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2 and 3. The goal of a BUSINESS is to create profits for the owner/owners. Corporations are legal entities that only exist at the behest of governments. They are outside of, and above, the free market. And the reason why governments have made the laws governing these entities what they are, is because of option 2 and 3.
 
1Perry said:
It isn't my theory. I don't have to prove anything.
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Not asking you to. I've given plenty of evidence tax cuts don't create jobs. There is no evidence to tax cuts creating jobs that I know of, but if you claim they do, you do have to present evidence. BTW, that they create jobs is the positive. That is where the burden of proof lies.
 
EarlzP said:
Let me predict the future for you. China and the USA are in an undeclared economic war, eventually China will know that they have drained enough out of the American economy and will take the route that other countries have taken they will nationalize all of the American based companies in China and call in the loans they have made to America. When that happens the golden goose that those who own the companies "the stock holders" will find thier selves holding worthless pieces of paper.

American workers built and worked the companies that have moved over seas, When the Chinese nationalize American manufacturing you may know what the price of greed looks and feels like.
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Is that a long winded way of either refusing to answer an easy question or a concession you have absolutely no clue about why corporations are created?
 
Thunder said:
I don't envy self-hating Americans (corporate CEOs & owners) who move tens of thousands of American jobs overseas.
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self-hating? that appears to be an attribute you made up and applied without any evidence or clue
 
TurtleDude said:
self-hating? that appears to be an attribute you made up and applied without any evidence or clue
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an American citizen, who knowningly and consciously lays off tens of thousands of his fellow Americans, so as to move the jobs overseas to make an extra buck, is self-hating.
 
Boo Radley said:
Not asking you to. I've given plenty of evidence tax cuts don't create jobs. There is no evidence to tax cuts creating jobs that I know of, but if you claim they do, you do have to present evidence. BTW, that they create jobs is the positive. That is where the burden of proof lies.
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I'm not claiming anything. I'm just noting that those with low taxes outside of Florida seem to be doing pretty darn well.
 
1Perry said:
Absolutely WRONG. It's your theory. As you note, there are many reasons and it's foolish to try and claim it's any one thing. 4 out of 5 of the lowest tax rate states have far lower unemployment than the 5 highest.

But go ahead, tell my why that is irrelevant again. Also tell me again why Illinois had to bribe Sears to stay.
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I've been re-reading this.

1) where did you get 4 out of 5?

2) why only look at the extremes?

3) Where did I claim tax rate high or low is linked to unemployment?

As I recall, and feel free to correct me, I've only made one firm claim and one less firm claim: 1) that there is no evidence tax cuts create jobs. That's firm. And that appeasement of business has seen no job creation to speak of and that some have accepted the appeasment and left any way. Perhaps you are debating the author of the one article and not what they all report, that tax cuts don't create jobs.
 
Boo Radley said:
I've been re-reading this.

1) where did you get 4 out of 5?

2) why only look at the extremes?

3) Where did I claim tax rate high or low is linked to unemployment?

As I recall, and feel free to correct me, I've only made one firm claim and one less firm claim: 1) that there is no evidence tax cuts create jobs. That's firm. And that appeasement of business has seen no job creation to speak of and that some have accepted the appeasment and left any way. Perhaps you are debating the author of the one article and not what they all report, that tax cuts don't create jobs.
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There is evidence. Your problem here is argueing classroom theory. Different economic situations call for different solutions.
 
Thunder said:
an American citizen, who knowningly and consciously lays off tens of thousands of his fellow Americans, so as to move the jobs overseas to make an extra buck, is self-hating.
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that is truly devoid of rational thought or empirical evidence
 
1Perry said:
There is evidence. Your problem here is argueing classroom theory. Different economic situations call for different solutions.
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No, I don't think so, while I do agree there is no one solution for everywhere. If there is evidence, provide it. Take the Bush tax cuts. They've been in place awhile. Where are the jobs?

I did ask you three questions.
 
Boo Radley said:
No, I don't think so, while I do agree there is no one solution for everywhere. If there is evidence, provide it. Take the Bush tax cuts. They've been in place awhile. Where are the jobs?

I did ask you three questions.
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There isn't any demand from business to be creating jobs right now. So no, if you enact a business tax cut right now, business's aren't going to hire because they have no need to. As I said earlier, I dismiss the idea of allowing people to keep more of their money only when we feel there is something in it for us though.
 
1Perry said:
There isn't any demand from business to be creating jobs right now. So no, if you enact a business tax cut right now, business's aren't going to hire because they have no need to. As I said earlier, I dismiss the idea of allowing people to keep more of their money only when we feel there is something in it for us though.
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Your discounting is neither here nor there. The issue I was addressing was whether tax cuts create jobs. The evidence says no. I did also mention that we've appeased business a lot, and they've left anyway, be it for overseas, or to another state dispite being appeased and getting the breaks they asked for. Not every business, but enough to suggest that other factors play a role. So appeasement may not make a difference.

But the key claim is that there is no evidence that tax cuts create jobs. I mean over all as opposed to an absolute, but a starting place to counter act my claim would be to present a clear causal link between a tax cut and jobs created.
 
TurtleDude said:
Is that a long winded way of either refusing to answer an easy question or a concession you have absolutely no clue about why corporations are created?
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It doe not matter to me what you think my plumber will still be in business and does not work for stock options.
 
EarlzP said:
It doe not matter to me what you think my plumber will still be in business and does not work for stock options.
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that's really a strange answer
 
Boo Radley said:
Your discounting is neither here nor there. The issue I was addressing was whether tax cuts create jobs. The evidence says no. I did also mention that we've appeased business a lot, and they've left anyway, be it for overseas, or to another state dispite being appeased and getting the breaks they asked for. Not every business, but enough to suggest that other factors play a role. So appeasement may not make a difference.
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Opinion noted.

But the key claim is that there is no evidence that tax cuts create jobs. I mean over all as opposed to an absolute, but a starting place to counter act my claim would be to present a clear causal link between a tax cut and jobs created.
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I'll try to be clear. It matters none to me if they do or do not. That is not an arguement for allowing people to keep more of their money IMO.
 
1Perry said:
Opinion noted.



I'll try to be clear. It matters none to me if they do or do not. That is not an arguement for allowing people to keep more of their money IMO.
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OK, so Im unsure why you jumped in. But ok. Still, why pay any taxes at all?
 
1Perry said:
Opinion noted.



I'll try to be clear. It matters none to me if they do or do not. That is not an arguement for allowing people to keep more of their money IMO.
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there are no good arguments that exist now for raising taxes on 1 or 2 percent of the population that already pay close to half the federal income tax burden.

the only possible argument for raising taxes is to provide feedback to those who don't think government costs money and that certainly is not the rich
 
TurtleDude said:
there are no good arguments that exist now for raising taxes on 1 or 2 percent of the population that already pay close to half the federal income tax burden...
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they iz the only ones who can afford to pay more taxes. and more taxes will not influence their spending.
 
Thunder said:
they iz the only ones who can afford to pay more taxes. and more taxes will not influence their spending.
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sorry you miss the point

affording more-which you really are in no position to say for others-is not a valid argument

and taxing the rich more will only encourage the middle class to continue to demand more and more spending
 
TurtleDude said:
sorry you miss the point

affording more-which you really are in no position to say for others-is not a valid argument

and taxing the rich more will only encourage the middle class to continue to demand more and more spending
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For a minute there I thought you were going to point out a weakness in taxing the rich.
 
haymarket said:
For a minute there I thought you were going to point out a weakness in taxing the rich.
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I did, most people understand that its the middle class that drives most of the spending in this country by the politicians and taxing the rich does nothing to give the middle class a reminder that its desire for more spending is destructive and requires more and more taxes. when the middle class is taxed for what they want, I suspect they will curb their appetite

of course if one is envious of the rich or sees many of the rich as one's enemies and taxation as a way of punishing the rich, no rational argument against taxation will be persuasive
 
TurtleDude said:
sorry you miss the point

affording more-which you really are in no position to say for others-is not a valid argument

and taxing the rich more will only encourage the middle class to continue to demand more and more spending
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which you really are in no position to say
 
Thunder said:
which you really are in no position to say
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silly diversions. do you deny that people who want stuff want more of it when they don't have to pay for it?
 
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