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Thread: Census shows 1 in 2 people are poor or low-income

  1. #501
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    Re: Census shows 1 in 2 people are poor or low-income

    Quote Originally Posted by Mach View Post
    Why should it be treated the same? There is no correct or incorrect way, to suggest it (again) is as absurd as it was in prior posts.

    1. There is no "should" on an issue like taxation, with regards to what policies are actually in place. You should know this already, that you are still questioning it leads me to believe you have motiations other than seeking the truth.

    2. Again, income is widely differentiated on a lot more than simply long-term cap gains, check the IRS:
    Tax Topics - Topic 400 Types of Income

    For any one of these, say, pensions (you have a nice public pension, do you not?), is treated differently, than other income sources, depending on the state, how it was contributed to, and in some part, the whim of whatever government officials set up whatever laws relate to it.

    If you don't understand this, and really just want to learn more about capital gains, here, I'll wiki it for you.
    Capital gains tax in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



    Of course, simplifying the tax code is a good thing that a number of candidates have as part of their rhetoric. We know from other posts you oppose flat taxes though (correct?), seems odd to someone I'm sure.
    ie. Trickle-down economics which does not work. We should reward the income that requires the most work - earned salary or wages. Why do reward earnings that come from transactions and inaction?
    Ted Cruz is the dumbest person alive.

  2. #502
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    Re: Census shows 1 in 2 people are poor or low-income

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    There is a very good reason to treat all income the same. Quite simply, if you create a tax preference for one type of income over another you are distorting the market. You are creating a PREFERENCE for investment income versus earned income.
    The problem with taxing investment income higher, is that middle class retired people also get taxed at a higher rate than others who earn the same.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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    Re: Census shows 1 in 2 people are poor or low-income

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    The problem with taxing investment income higher, is that middle class retired people also get taxed at a higher rate than others who earn the same.
    Except middle class seniors receive very little of their income from Capital investments:

    Who Receives Capital Gains?

    Advocates of capital gains tax cuts frequently point out that a growing

    number of middle-class Americans now own stock. Yet only 7 percent

    of Americans reported net capital gains income on their fed¬eral tax

    returns in 2008 —and the vast majority of these gains were realized by

    the very wealthiest Americans. In particular:



    Taxpayers with federal adjusted gross incomes (AGI) in excess of

    $500,000 reported close to 80 percent of taxable capital gains,


    even though they accounted for less than one percent of all returns

    filed."
    https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q...0763GdoVDtVe6A
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    Re: Census shows 1 in 2 people are poor or low-income

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Except middle class seniors receive very little of their income from Capital investments:

    Who Receives Capital Gains?

    Advocates of capital gains tax cuts frequently point out that a growing

    number of middle-class Americans now own stock. Yet only 7 percent

    of Americans reported net capital gains income on their fed¬eral tax

    returns in 2008 —and the vast majority of these gains were realized by

    the very wealthiest Americans. In particular:



    Taxpayers with federal adjusted gross incomes (AGI) in excess of

    $500,000 reported close to 80 percent of taxable capital gains,


    even though they accounted for less than one percent of all returns

    filed."
    https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q...0763GdoVDtVe6A
    So what?
    Those seniors who do, should get taxed more?

    You're arguing that the government should incentivize people spending all their money now, instead of incurring additional costs through saving and investing.

    It's a catch 22, sure the government will incur more revenue now, from taxing capital gains at a higher rate.
    On the flip side, they are encouraging people to save less, requiring more government expenditure, when those same people reach retirement age.

    That doesn't even address the fact that many capital gains, are earned through selling a small business, where the owner is still middle class, except for that one year.
    Last edited by Harry Guerrilla; 12-22-11 at 07:59 PM.
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    Re: Census shows 1 in 2 people are poor or low-income

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    So what?
    Those seniors who do, should get taxed more?

    You're arguing that the government should incentivize people spending all their money now, instead of incurring additional costs through saving and investing.

    It's a catch 22, sure the government will incur more revenue now, from taxing capital gains at a higher rate.
    On the flip side, they are encouraging people to save less, requiring more government expenditure, when those same people reach retirement age.

    That doesn't even address the fact that many capital gains, are earned through selling a small business, where the owner is still middle class, except for that one year.
    A 5% increase capital gains on the handful of wealthy seniors will have a negligible effect. What problems did it cause under the Clinton Administration when capital gain tax rates were 5% higher, and please cite your documentation?
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Census shows 1 in 2 people are poor or low-income

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    A 5% increase capital gains on the handful of wealthy seniors will have a negligible effect. What problems did it cause under the Clinton Administration when capital gain tax rates were 5% higher, and please cite your documentation?
    I didn't say it caused problems.
    You said that your reasoning was that only a minor percent of senior citizens had any significant capital gains, instead of answering what I wrote, you inserted your loaded language and didn't address any of the points I brought up.

    Here's a tip, respond to what people write, then ask your own questions.
    You're completely and purposely avoiding the points and instead are mired in your quandary of, only wealthy people earn capital gains.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

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    Re: Census shows 1 in 2 people are poor or low-income

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    I didn't say it caused problems.
    You said that your reasoning was that only a minor percent of senior citizens had any significant capital gains, instead of answering what I wrote, you inserted your loaded language and didn't address any of the points I brought up.

    Here's a tip, respond to what people write, then ask your own questions.
    You're completely and purposely avoiding the points and instead are mired in your quandary of, only wealthy people earn capital gains.
    I've posted the statistics to show there are just a handful of wealthy middle class this will affect in any way. You have not refuted the statistics or provided any evidence of a negative for the middle class by raising the capital gains tax rate 5%.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Census shows 1 in 2 people are poor or low-income

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    I've posted the statistics to show there are just a handful of wealthy middle class this will affect in any way. You have not refuted the statistics or provided any evidence of a negative for the middle class by raising the capital gains tax rate 5%.
    Precisely what I expected from you.
    What's next, the "30 years of Reaganomics" rant?

    Own up to the fact that you consistently dodge arguments that contradict yours.

    A whole lot of stuff on capital gains taxes.
    Capital Gains Taxes: The Concise Encyclopedia of Economics | Library of Economics and Liberty
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

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    Re: Census shows 1 in 2 people are poor or low-income

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    Precisely what I expected from you.
    What's next, the "30 years of Reaganomics" rant?

    Own up to the fact that you consistently dodge arguments that contradict yours.

    A whole lot of stuff on capital gains taxes.
    Capital Gains Taxes: The Concise Encyclopedia of Economics | Library of Economics and Liberty
    Nothing in your far-right blog to refute the statistics I provided.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  10. #510
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    Re: Census shows 1 in 2 people are poor or low-income

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Nothing in your far-right blog to refute the statistics I provided.
    Geesh, never would of expected that response.....
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

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