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House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read more: h

Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

The left loves to calls turds pretty names and then argue that the pretty name is why the turd ought to be passed. They ignore the actual legislative history or the law itself and argue that since "social security" is called "social security" we can use it as a income redistribution scheme in direct contradiction of the legislative history because it SOUNDS GOOD

its like the gun banners who claimed we had to extend the clinton gun ban because it was called the "SAFE STREETS ACT" and if it sunsetted our streets would not longer be SAFE or the clowns who claim that the "General welfare clause" justifies Welfare socialism

What is being ignored here is YOU ignoring what Social Security is and what it means to the citizens of the United States of America both as individuals and as a society.

This will help you and educate you to the original purpose of Social Security, why it is named so, and the perversion of the meaning and intent of the program by the right wing in their battle against it

http://agonist.org/story/2005/1/6/212133/2309

Please read the entire article: here is a very small portion

There are few retirees left who remember the Depression or the stock market crash, and it should be no surprise that Republicans now find the time ripe for attacking Social Security. President Bush's speechwriter Peter H. Wehner recently wrote to Republican officials: "For the first time in six decades, the Social Security battle is one we can win -- and in doing so, we can help transform the political and philosophical landscape of the country. We have it within our grasp to move away from dependency on government and toward giving greater power and responsibility to individuals."

It is the essence of Republican orthodoxy that Social Security is a massive give-away program, enfeebling the fiber of all decent Americans by making them dependent on the federal government. These criticisms of Social Security were muttered sotto voce for many years, and only now - when too few seniors can speak in its defense from their personal experience - are they being proclaimed forcefully.

here is some historical background on the naming of the program

http://www.ssa.gov/history/termorigin.html

This is NOT about guns. The comparison is not an apt one.
 
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Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

Do for big oil and you shall receive. Sounds like the usual in Washington. Although, I guess this company has quite a pipeline spell record (but that's according to Huffington Post) as opposed to rosy faux new stories.

Proposed pipeline cuts right through Nebraska's Sandhills (sometimes called the Last Prairie). It's a very sensitive area. It also covers what is called the Ogallala Aquifier, major source of water for huge area, and important to farming. Possible impact on the sandhills and possible damage to important aquifer is an unknown. A View From a Washichu

I don't blame Obama for not wanting to touch this for a lot of reasons.

Yep, it would be the only underground pipeline, right ??

pic_murdock_121211_A.jpg
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

I have read this and another article and it appears they are only forcing a decision on the pipeline, not forcing the pipeline to be approved. Am I missing something?
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

I have read this and another article and it appears they are only forcing a decision on the pipeline, not forcing the pipeline to be approved. Am I missing something?

No, you are 100% correct. They are forcing a decision, not a yes or a no, just a decision. This is one more example of Obama voting "present" rather than making the type of decision he was hired to do.
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

I have read this and another article and it appears they are only forcing a decision on the pipeline, not forcing the pipeline to be approved. Am I missing something?

You aren't missing anything.
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

Yeah.... a pipeline thousands of miles long will create "negative jobs". That's a good one.. seen any unicorns lately ???

Unicorns? No, but I have seen an independent study. You know, not one produced by the people who have a vested interest in claiming that the project will create tons of jobs?

http://www.ilr.cornell.edu/globallaborinstitute/research/upload/GLI_KeystoneXL_Reportpdf-2.pdf
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

Unicorns? No, but I have seen an independent study. You know, not one produced by the people who have a vested interest in claiming that the project will create tons of jobs?

http://www.ilr.cornell.edu/globallaborinstitute/research/upload/GLI_KeystoneXL_Reportpdf-2.pdf

Ahh yes, the report that claims that IF the pipeline happens to leak, and IF the oil gets into farmland, and IF the soil is tainted, then a loss of some farm jobs could occur.

You keep believing the "sky is falling" scenarios if you like, but the rest of us in the real world will keep laughing at you.

How many jobs has the construction of the thousands of other pipelines cost ???
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

Ahh yes, the report that claims that IF the pipeline happens to leak, and IF the oil gets into farmland, and IF the soil is tainted, then a loss of some farm jobs could occur.

You keep believing the "sky is falling" scenarios if you like, but the rest of us in the real world will keep laughing at you.

How many jobs has the construction of the thousands of other pipelines cost ???

Ah, so you didn't actually bother to read the report? You could at least read the one-page summary. Is that too much to expect?
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

Ah, so you didn't actually bother to read the report? You could at least read the one-page summary. Is that too much to expect?

Oh, I'm very familiar with the report. Do you know who actually wrote it ???? You probably think that high-browed Cornell professors wrote it don't you???

It was actually written by the Global Labor Institute, a consortium of labor unions and environmental groups. Not exactly disinterested parties are they?

A few examples of their "partners":

Blue-Green Alliance
Center for American Progress
Center on Wisconsin Strategy (COWS)
Environmental Defense Fund (EDF)
European Trade Union Confederation
Food and Water Watch
Friedrich Ebert Stiftung (FES)
Global Coalition for Climate Action (GCCA)
Global Labor Strategies
Institute for Policy Studies
International Transport Workers' Federation
Jobs with Justice
Labor Network for Sustainability
Natural Resources Defense Council (NRDC)
Public Services International Research Unit
Realizing Rights: The Ethical Globalization Iniative
Red Vida

And you continually whine that Fox News is biased, but don't hesitate to post this kind of crap.
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

The Governor was praising the rerouting of the pipeline, but nice try.

His exact words, 5 days after the decision to delay:

Third, I want to thank the U.S. Department of State for their cooperation and willingness to work with us. The meetings that the Legislature and I have had with the State Department were useful and productive.

Source: Gov. Heineman News: Gov. Heineman: Pipeline Re-Routing is Nebraska Common Sensen

Nice try, but facts trump lies.
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

No, you are 100% correct. They are forcing a decision, not a yes or a no, just a decision. This is one more example of Obama voting "present" rather than making the type of decision he was hired to do.

Because it is always good to leap before you look. Gad damn that Obama for wanting to consider all the facts before jumping to a decision, how very unrepublican of him!
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

Did you actually read what you posted? Even within that presentation , it stated that between 2500 and 4600 jobs would be directly created. All of their negative job claims have the same flaws as what they claim that the Perryman study have - no dat, no facts, only suppositions based upon assumptions that they make in order to put forth their own spiel. Cornell university global labor institute is hardly an independent organization considering how much it supports the "green job" movement.
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

Oh, I'm very familiar with the report. Do you know who actually wrote it ???? You probably think that high-browed Cornell professors wrote it don't you???

It was actually written by the Global Labor Institute, a consortium of labor unions and environmental groups. Not exactly disinterested parties are they?

A few examples of their "partners":

Blue-Green Alliance
Center for American Progress
Center on Wisconsin Strategy (COWS)
Environmental Defense Fund (EDF)
European Trade Union Confederation
Food and Water Watch
Friedrich Ebert Stiftung (FES)
Global Coalition for Climate Action (GCCA)
Global Labor Strategies
Institute for Policy Studies
International Transport Workers' Federation
Jobs with Justice
Labor Network for Sustainability
Natural Resources Defense Council (NRDC)
Public Services International Research Unit
Realizing Rights: The Ethical Globalization Iniative
Red Vida

And you continually whine that Fox News is biased, but don't hesitate to post this kind of crap.

Yes, the report was obviously authored by Cornell's labor institute. So why, exactly, would an organization concerned with labor be against a project that would allegedly employ tens of thousands of skilled laborers?

And of cours there's no bias on Transcanada's part! What possible motive could they have for distorting the jobs numbers?!
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

Did you actually read what you posted? Even within that presentation , it stated that between 2500 and 4600 jobs would be directly created. All of their negative job claims have the same flaws as what they claim that the Perryman study have - no dat, no facts, only suppositions based upon assumptions that they make in order to put forth their own spiel. Cornell university global labor institute is hardly an independent organization considering how much it supports the "green job" movement.

So you have 3,500 jobs (roughly the median number) versus 20,000 jobs. Obviously that changes the balance when you consider whether or not the project is a good idea, because of course jobs creation isn't the only factor.
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

His exact words, 5 days after the decision to delay:



Source: Gov. Heineman News: Gov. Heineman: Pipeline Re-Routing is Nebraska Common Sensen

Nice try, but facts trump lies.

Really?? Sounds to me like he was thanking them for the help in getting the pipeline rerouted. Don't see a word that he was in favor of killing or delaying the construction permanently. In fact, he is very clear that he supports construction.

Yep, those facts can be pesky can't they, especially when you selectively quote the governor and try to claim he is saying something 180 degrees from what he actually said.

“Just a few days ago, I said that the U.S. Department of State decision to undertake an “in-depth assessment of potential alternative routes” was an opportunity for a common sense solution. Today, we stand here having reached a common sense solution.”

“While there have been a number of factors that have brought us to this point, the catalyst for this extraordinary series of events was the calling of the Special Session. For months, Nebraskans have been clear about our position on the pipeline - we support the pipeline. However, we’re opposed to a route through the environmentally sensitive Sand Hills. Citizens voiced their opinions at public hearings in Atkinson and Lincoln and at the Legislature’s three public hearings. Through our persistence and determination, the State Department heard our concerns. Additionally, TransCanada has heard our concerns and has voluntarily agreed to change the route.”

Want to try one more time ?
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

Yes, the report was obviously authored by Cornell's labor institute. So why, exactly, would an organization concerned with labor be against a project that would allegedly employ tens of thousands of skilled laborers?

And of cours there's no bias on Transcanada's part! What possible motive could they have for distorting the jobs numbers?!

They are more concerned with perceived environmental affects than job creation.

Why are most unions in favor of the pipeline ??
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

They are more concerned with perceived environmental affects than job creation.

Why are most unions in favor of the pipeline ??

The environmental effects are more than just perceived.

Why is this institute dedicated to labor studies more concerned with the environment than they are with the impact on labor? It's the Global Labor Institute -- not the Global Environment Institute, right?

But it is amusing to see Republicans getting behind the labor movement.
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

The environmental effects are more than just perceived.

Why is this institute dedicated to labor studies more concerned with the environment than they are with the impact on labor? It's the Global Labor Institute -- not the Global Environment Institute, right?

But it is amusing to see Republicans getting behind the labor movement.

No, they are perceived since the dubious claims made by GLI have little basis in fact.

Perhaps you should try reading their mission statement and you might answer your own question. Look up some of their sponsors from the list I posted. Some are very radical environmental organizations.

Republicans are always on the side of labor............when labor is doing the right thing.
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

No, they are perceived since the dubious claims made by GLI have little basis in fact.

Perhaps you should try reading their mission statement and you might answer your own question. Look up some of their sponsors from the list I posted. Some are very radical environmental organizations.

Republicans are always on the side of labor............when labor is doing the right thing.

There is no dispute as to whether tar sands oil is dirtier than other types of oil.
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

whether we build the pipeline or not, we need to allocate resources to build a lot more electrical infrastructure. our grid is insufficient for the inevitable transition from oil to whatever is next. this should be done publicly, as waiting for it to become profitable is not a viable option.
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

Really?? Sounds to me like he was thanking them for the help in getting the pipeline rerouted. Don't see a word that he was in favor of killing or delaying the construction permanently. In fact, he is very clear that he supports construction.

Yep, those facts can be pesky can't they, especially when you selectively quote the governor and try to claim he is saying something 180 degrees from what he actually said.



Want to try one more time ?

till 2013 is permanently delayed now? Anymore stupid hyperbole?

The state department was not the one negotiating with TransCanada, Nebraska was.

As is customary in our state, we have found a Nebraska common sense solution that moves the route of the pipeline out of the Sand Hills. This exceptional and unusual series of events has allowed us to arrive at this solution because of Nebraskans’ ability to work in a cooperative manner

Nice try, but once again the facts speak. That is why one of us actually linked to a source, while the other just made stuff up. And again...the conspiracy "permanently delay" stuff is hilarious. Thanks for the laugh.
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

We should just give a huge tax cut the the rich, and raise taxes on everyone else, that will stimulate the economy and create jobs, and then we can pass laws to send those jobs overseas, so business's can be more profitable and hire more people...
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

the FICA contributions are to pay for social security. if those who expect to benefit from social security don't pay into it it won't have enough. and the dems scheme of trying to make the rich pay for other peoples' insurance contributions is both idiotic and violates the entire premise of the ponzi scheme that the dems are so proud of

Well....excluding your partisan attacks I agree with you in the sentiment that FICA should not be cut!
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

till 2013 is permanently delayed now? Anymore stupid hyperbole?

The state department was not the one negotiating with TransCanada, Nebraska was.



Nice try, but once again the facts speak. That is why one of us actually linked to a source, while the other just made stuff up. And again...the conspiracy "permanently delay" stuff is hilarious. Thanks for the laugh.

Ahhh, so now it is acceptable for mods to call people stupid ???

In case you didn't figure it out, I quoted from YOUR link, that clearly said that the Republican Nebraska governor, as well as the people there were in favor of the pipeline. Even though you now attempt to switch your position, it is clear to all that followed your little diatribe that you were completely wrong, but too stubborn to admit it.

Who said the State Department was negotiating with TransCanada and what the hell does that have to do with anything ??
 
Re: House Passes Payroll Tax Cut Extension With Keystone Pipeline Provision Read mor

Ahhh, so now it is acceptable for mods to call people stupid ???

Actually he called what you said stupid.

Not you stupid.

Which is acceptable as your inability to make the distinction is stupid.
 
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