Page 3 of 13 FirstFirst 12345 ... LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 125

Thread: San Francisco Becomes First U.S. City to Top $10 Minimum Wage

  1. #21
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Last Seen
    03-16-12 @ 11:02 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    7,624

    Re: San Francisco Becomes First U.S. City to Top $10 Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    I would like to point out San Francisco has one of the highest Per Capita incomes in the country. I'm guessing the living costs are pretty high there. If that's what the citizens of San Fran want...why exactly are you up in arms.
    Indeed. I have no stats but I'd guess that making $10 an hour in S.F. still puts you behind those making $7.50 an hour in other places.

  2. #22
    Cynical Optimist
    jambalaya's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Columbia, SC
    Last Seen
    11-28-12 @ 05:19 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    2,481

    Re: San Francisco Becomes First U.S. City to Top $10 Minimum Wage

    The minimum wage shouldn't based on what it takes to make a living or support a family of four. A lot of minmum wage jobs are taken by young people in high school and college who want to make some spending money or people who want to support a very limited lifestyle until they can get another job or get credentialed for another career. Some people don't want to be tied down to responsibility and accept a very limited lifestyle because they just don't want to work very hard. Minimum wage is just a starting point. Many people who are ambitious move up to management and other higher positions to increase their wages if they want to make a living in industries with a lot of minimum wage workers. Supply, demand and hard work should still be the major factor in wages. I don't mind a little boost in minimum wages but let's not be ridiculous.

  3. #23
    Liberal Fascist For Life!


    Redress's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Georgia
    Last Seen
    Today @ 11:06 AM
    Lean
    Very Liberal
    Posts
    93,316
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: San Francisco Becomes First U.S. City to Top $10 Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    You think I should have shot for a minimum wage of $50K a year?

    at what point do you accept that the laws of economics yes apply to people too?
    Your understanding of the laws of economics is flawed, so that is a big part of your problem. Minimum wages serve a purpose.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  4. #24
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 11:06 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,448

    Re: San Francisco Becomes First U.S. City to Top $10 Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by Opteron View Post
    I think this is good. Helps to prevent and reduce a poor class. Businesses can deal with less profits/higher prices, I think a high minimum wage is the way to go.
    Actually, it's going to make things worse for the working poor, because now, businesses are going to raise qualification standards for entry level positions. Some of those working poor won't be able to meet those standards and instead of having a low paying job, won't have any job at all.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  5. #25
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 11:06 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,448

    Re: San Francisco Becomes First U.S. City to Top $10 Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Your understanding of the laws of economics is flawed, so that is a big part of your problem. Minimum wages serve a purpose.
    A minimum wage that is too high will serve the purpose of creating more unemployment.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  6. #26
    Sage
    whysoserious's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Charlotte, NC
    Last Seen
    12-29-16 @ 03:02 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    8,170

    Re: San Francisco Becomes First U.S. City to Top $10 Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Actually, it's going to make things worse for the working poor, because now, businesses are going to raise qualification standards for entry level positions. Some of those working poor won't be able to meet those standards and instead of having a low paying job, won't have any job at all.
    That's a ridiculous statement based on nothing at all. You'd be the first one to say that minimum wage jobs require little to no skill, so I don't see how you can argue that just because the pay grade was raised that all of the sudden the skill level is raised as well. So now, instead of just flipping burgers, they need to know Calculus too?

    Do you really believe this stuff or do you just make it up as you go?
    Ted Cruz is the dumbest person alive.

  7. #27
    Cheese
    Aunt Spiker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Sasnakra
    Last Seen
    09-10-16 @ 06:10 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    28,433

    Re: San Francisco Becomes First U.S. City to Top $10 Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by Opteron View Post
    I think this is good. Helps to prevent and reduce a poor class. Businesses can deal with less profits/higher prices, I think a high minimum wage is the way to go.
    How does it prevent and reduce a poor class?

    The cost of goods, production, living and other expenses is so high that anyone earning min-wage will always be *the* poor - they'll just earn more than *other* poor but it won't be enough.

    It perpetuates a psychological fallacy of security
    A screaming comes across the sky.
    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
    Pynchon - Gravity's Rainbow

  8. #28
    On Vacation
    joko104's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Last Seen
    Today @ 10:41 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    31,568
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: San Francisco Becomes First U.S. City to Top $10 Minimum Wage

    The ideas behind the actions by San Francisco's city government are examples of why the economy of California is so excellent, why homes are so afforable there for working people and for the low unemployment rates in California. Right?

    Candidly, I see it a a very clever way for San Francisco to try to keep poor people from moving there. To keep poor people away you just make everything unavoidable to them.
    Last edited by joko104; 12-13-11 at 10:57 AM.

  9. #29
    Educator
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Last Seen
    01-17-15 @ 02:59 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    629

    Re: San Francisco Becomes First U.S. City to Top $10 Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    well, it depends on your goals. the people who instituted the minimum wage, for example, had very clear intentions for it. however, the "let's mandate that workers earn more so they will be better off" plan is a fallacy.


    if by "no regulation" you mean "no minimum wage", then it is not stupid, such a move would, in fact, be wise.
    No, without a minimum wage you would be guarantee an underclass of workers. Supply would dictate a ridiculously low wage, the workers would have to work because they have no alternative, and a group would be overpowered by the rich, because those who have would be at the mercy of those who have for a job. This is not a symmetrical situation here that's what you're neglecting. Those who don't have don't have the ability to hold out for more while those who have can always pass an employee opportunity and wait them out.

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    actually as far as i am aware, none of these exist on a supply/demand curve. I think you have the supply/demand curve confused with the free market, and I think you have a pretty false notion of how it operates. competition is death to monopolies, which historically have had to rely on government subsidy in one form or another in order to maintain.

    that is correct - it generally results in the best possible outcome.

    no, they do not. monopolies can exist in a market; but unless they are externally supported they tend to rapidly fall.

    if they raise prices really high, then competition will eviscerate them. heck, even if they don't raise their prices at all, but stand still, competition will eviscerate them, just slower.
    You are failing to realize how powerful monopolies work. The can sign exclusive contracts with suppliers which prevents any other business from entering the market. Those suppliers that don't cooperate can be dumped against and put out of business. Free markets tend to aggregate into monopolies, because ideally, anything a small business can do, a larger business can do more efficiently ideally. Free markets do not result in the best possible outcome, what they do is maximize profit for a certain business. The goal of a free market is to maximize profit, not to provide the best possible outcome.

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    no, it doesn't. but let's walk through the prototypical example: Henry Ford famously offered that he paid his workers higher wages so that they could afford to purchase his cars. This was a great advertising technique, but a poor economic one. Because the wages of his workers made up part of the price of the car, and so every time the wages were increased, so was the price of the vehicle.

    When you artificially jack up the price of labor, business owners have generally three choices: A) raise prices B) make do with fewer employees, or C) close up shop and move elsewhere.

    You are describing the effects of many business owners performing A, given California's unemployment rate it seems many have chosen B, and given the rate at which businesses and business owners are fleeing the state, it seems that many are also choosing C.

    well done.
    Ok you are completely wrong here because high prices in cities are a result of property demand/demand to be in the city, not labor costs. Ok, I understand you're example, you left one choice out: D) deal with less profit. Most likely businesses will raise prices to recover the cost of labor and what this amounts to is a tax on everybody so that the poorest laborers can make a living wage. I'm ok with that. It amounts to a tax on consumers, or businesses making less profits, but either way it should be acceptable.

  10. #30
    Educator
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Last Seen
    01-17-15 @ 02:59 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    629

    Re: San Francisco Becomes First U.S. City to Top $10 Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    The ideas behind the actions by San Francisco's city government are examples of why the economy of California is so excellent, why homes are so afforable there for working people and for the low unemployment rates in California. Right?

    Candidly, I see it a a very clever way for San Francisco to try to keep poor people from moving there. To keep poor people away you just make everything unavoidable to them.
    That's a result of other policies which I don't wholly support, not because the minimum wage is high. I'm not sure but I think still that median wages are relatively higher in California than other states, but I don't have the statistics.
    Last edited by Opteron; 12-13-11 at 04:09 PM.

Page 3 of 13 FirstFirst 12345 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •