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Thread: Fukushima fuel rods may have completely melted

  1. #31
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    Re: Fukushima fuel rods may have completely melted

    Quote Originally Posted by rocket88 View Post
    That's the quandary. 98% of the time, nuclear is relatively safe. But that other 2% of the time is a real bitch. (Percentages are estimates, but you get the point.)
    Your percentages are way off.....
    Nobody in the USA has died due to a nuclear related accident at any commercial power plant...
    Flying in an airplane is safe nearly all the time, but when one crashes, it kills hundreds. Yet, we have not banned flying yet...
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    Re: Fukushima fuel rods may have completely melted

    Quote Originally Posted by Khayembii Communique View Post
    There have been two catastrophic nuclear disasters regarding the nuclear power industry thoughout all of history. There have been countless catastrophes involving other power generation industries. The reason that nuclear gets a bad rap is the same reason that people think airplanes are unsafe - it's so safe that the disasters are focused on disproportionately.
    some years ago the Phoenix paper reported deaths at the Four Corners coal fired plant as a nuclear accident. An old steam pipe ruptured, operators were killed.
    The media are even dumber than our politicians...
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    Re: Fukushima fuel rods may have completely melted

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill
    some years ago the Phoenix paper reported deaths at the Four Corners coal fired plant as a nuclear accident. An old steam pipe ruptured, operators were killed.
    Well consider the total number of deaths from mining and processing coal alone. Consider the amount of disasters at other sorts of power plants. Consider the countless oil disasters that have happened in the past decade alone. These all far outweigh Fukushima and Chernobyl combined.
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    Re: Fukushima fuel rods may have completely melted

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    The russians built cheap, and they paid for it. The Japanese disregarded the very real potential of a tsunami, and they are paying for it.
    The odds of either of those 2 scenarios in the USA are slim to none. Where it might be possible, you can bet that some changes are being made to mitigate the potential occurrence.
    TMI was our meltdown, and nobody died or had to move away....and if the operators had left the controls alone and let the protection circuits do what they were doing, there would not have been a meltdown. The operators didn't believe their instruments and turned off the safety system designed to provide emergency cooling. You guys can rant all you want, it won't change anything. Long story short, we would be far better off teaching the next generations how to use less energy....the current generation is too addicted to want to change their habits.


    NRC: Backgrounder on Chernobyl Nuclear Power Plant Accident

    The NRC has some info on how many cancers actually occurred....
    Ya, the "ODDS" were in the favor of both of those disasters as well. Then there was Three Mile Island. Then there was that canadian nuke plant that had to dump radioactivity into the great lakes...

    I'm sorry, but nuclear as it is is only viable because of the nuclear weapons aspect. Thorium is a much better and safer and less wasteful process, but because the process is not suitable to nuclear weaponry it is highly unlikely that this type of change will happen.

    And take the example of the airplane, yes, when planes DO occasionally crash it usually kills hundreds of people. However, when a nuclear plant goes up, it might kill a small handful initially, but then it takes a good 20 years before you can really begin to track the cancer clusters that result.

    Now, ESPECIALLY for the AGW alarmists claiming that CO2 will destroy the world, nuclear is appalling in this respect because it DOES TRULY MAKE the land virtually uninhabitable for generations, and potentially MILLIONS of years.

    It's harder to notice though because you can't feel radiation, or sense it, so you can't know just how or even IF you are being impacted immediately (except for truly high dosages). Just makes it easier to ignore the problems.

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    Re: Fukushima fuel rods may have completely melted

    Quote Originally Posted by BmanMcfly

    And take the example of the airplane, yes, when planes DO occasionally crash it usually kills hundreds of people. However, when a nuclear plant goes up, it might kill a small handful initially, but then it takes a good 20 years before you can really begin to track the cancer clusters that result.
    The point. It went right over your head.
    "I do not claim that every incident in the history of empire can be explained in directly economic terms. Economic interests are filtered through a political process, policies are implemented by a complex state apparatus, and the whole system generates its own momentum."

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    Re: Fukushima fuel rods may have completely melted

    Quote Originally Posted by BmanMcfly View Post
    Ya, the "ODDS" were in the favor of both of those disasters as well. Then there was Three Mile Island. Then there was that canadian nuke plant that had to dump radioactivity into the great lakes...

    I'm sorry, but nuclear as it is is only viable because of the nuclear weapons aspect. Thorium is a much better and safer and less wasteful process, but because the process is not suitable to nuclear weaponry it is highly unlikely that this type of change will happen.

    And take the example of the airplane, yes, when planes DO occasionally crash it usually kills hundreds of people. However, when a nuclear plant goes up, it might kill a small handful initially, but then it takes a good 20 years before you can really begin to track the cancer clusters that result.

    Now, ESPECIALLY for the AGW alarmists claiming that CO2 will destroy the world, nuclear is appalling in this respect because it DOES TRULY MAKE the land virtually uninhabitable for generations, and potentially MILLIONS of years.

    It's harder to notice though because you can't feel radiation, or sense it, so you can't know just how or even IF you are being impacted immediately (except for truly high dosages). Just makes it easier to ignore the problems.
    We already have plenty of nuclear weapons on hand. Weaponry is pretty much off the table.
    We are more exposed to danger from our household chemicals. Risk is part of life. The rest of the world willingly accepts that. They won't go without power for any idealism on anybody's part.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Khayembii Communique View Post
    The point. It went right over your head.
    Your point was about the safety of nuclear, and my point is that even though the odds are slim, the results when the slim chance occurs is far more detrimental than the smaller scale problems and accidents that do occur more frequently with other energy generation methods.

    You do know, that according to recent analysis there was around 800000 people that have developed cancers and died as a result of Chernobyl... So, it's rare, but one major nuclear disaster every 30 years is FAR TOO MUCH RISK.

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    Re: Fukushima fuel rods may have completely melted

    Quote Originally Posted by BmanMcfly
    Your point was about the safety of nuclear, and my point is that even though the odds are slim, the results when the slim chance occurs is far more detrimental than the smaller scale problems and accidents that do occur more frequently with other energy generation methods.
    If you are in a plane crash the chances of dying are much higher than if you are in a car crash. This doesn't alter the fact that the chances of a plane crash are exponentially lower than that of a car crash and that therefore it is overall much safer.

    You do know, that according to recent analysis there was around 800000 people that have developed cancers and died as a result of Chernobyl... So, it's rare, but one major nuclear disaster every 30 years is FAR TOO MUCH RISK.
    You'd have a point if the nuclear power industry still built plants like Chernobyl. And if governments used the same disaster response protocols as the Soviets did with Chernobyl. But they don't, for very obvious reasons.

    Talking about Chernobyl nowadays as evidence of the danger of nuclear power is like talking about Model T's as evidence of the danger of automobiles.

    EDIT: Also, if you want to talk about cancer rates, why don't you talk about the cancer rates in populations surrounding coal plants that are supposedly operating properly? In terms of deaths there is no comparison whatsoever; the only real nuclear disaster of which we can speak in modern terms is Fukushima, and the deaths due to the Fukushima disaster pale in comparison to the massive amount of death and destruction surrounding the coal/oil industries (even including all of the deaths from the Tsunami/earthquake).

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill
    We already have plenty of nuclear weapons on hand. Weaponry is pretty much off the table.
    Not to mention the fact that the nuclear power industry has almost nothing to do with nuclear weapons manufacture.
    Last edited by Khayembii Communique; 12-05-11 at 01:20 PM.
    "I do not claim that every incident in the history of empire can be explained in directly economic terms. Economic interests are filtered through a political process, policies are implemented by a complex state apparatus, and the whole system generates its own momentum."

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    Re: Fukushima fuel rods may have completely melted

    No one is talking about the aging fleet of US Navy Nuclear vessels. Japan has given equipment for decommissioning nuclear vessels to Russia, to encuarage careful decommissioning. What other countries have neclear powered vessels in need of repair?




    Japan seeks Russian help to end nuclear crisis(ship for decommissioning nuke sub)



    "The United States and France have built nuclear aircraft carriers. By 1990 there were more nuclear reactors powering ships (mostly naval) than there were generating electric power in commercial power plants worldwide.[11] Many of these submarines and other vessels were decommissioned in the 1990s."



    Nuclear marine propulsion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Nuclear decommissioning - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    //
    Last edited by Gladiator; 12-05-11 at 02:07 PM.
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    Re: Fukushima fuel rods may have completely melted

    Quote Originally Posted by Gladiator View Post
    No one is talking about the aging fleet of US Navy Nuclear vessels. Japan has given equipment for decommissioning nuclear vessels to Russia, to encuarage careful decommissioning. What other countries have neclear powered vessels in need of repair?




    Japan seeks Russian help to end nuclear crisis(ship for decommissioning nuke sub)



    "The United States and France have built nuclear aircraft carriers. By 1990 there were more nuclear reactors powering ships (mostly naval) than there were generating electric power in commercial power plants worldwide.[11] Many of these submarines and other vessels were decommissioned in the 1990s."



    Nuclear marine propulsion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Nuclear decommissioning - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    //
    Maybe because a) the US has never had a nuclear incident with any of its nuclear powered ships/subs and b) even if any country had a major issue with those nuclear powered crafts, it is not likely to cause problems for the general public, since most of those reactors are quite small compared to commercial plants and likely to be easily moved to the middle of the ocean without severely affecting many people.
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