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Thread: Pepper spray: US campus police suspended

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    Re: UC Berkley: Police use excessive force

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    If the protesters got physical while the police were removing them then it would it have been okay for the police to use pepper spray on them.
    From what the video showed it looked like the protesters were just sitting refusing to move, not something that should be responded to with pepper spray. Two or two police could have picked each protester up and tossed them in the back of the paddy wagon.

    Well, I think that the liberal supporters of this OWS stuff are turning this into a no win for law enforcement. And I am no cop, but I do believe that law enforcement would say that use of non lethal force such as pepper spray is not only meant to subdue threat, which IMHO surrounding police is a threat, but also to force people to submit without risk of injury. Is it pleasant? Hell no, it isn't supposed to be. But, The dept, has offered that they entered the quad to enforce a no tent rule, and were trying to leave when surrounded, and people sat and locked arms blocking the walkway. When officers told those blocking the walkway, which is clearly seen on video earlier the one officer tells them to clear the sidewalk or they'd be sprayed, and arrested. They refused, and they got what was told was coming. If they would have just cleared the sidewalk, then no one would have even been arrested, or harmed in any way. The protesters provoked this, and IMHO got what they deserved.

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    Re: UC Berkley: Police use excessive force

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    If you choose to condemn only one side, that says something right there doesn't it?
    Actually no because you are twisting what I said.
    "And in the end, we were all just humans, drunk on the idea that love, only love, could heal our brokenness."

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    Re: UC Berkley: Police use excessive force

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Well, I think that the liberal supporters of this OWS stuff are turning this into a no win for law enforcement. And I am no cop, but I do believe that law enforcement would say that use of non lethal force such as pepper spray is not only meant to subdue threat, which IMHO surrounding police is a threat, but also to force people to submit without risk of injury. Is it pleasant? Hell no, it isn't supposed to be. But, The dept, has offered that they entered the quad to enforce a no tent rule, and were trying to leave when surrounded, and people sat and locked arms blocking the walkway. When officers told those blocking the walkway, which is clearly seen on video earlier the one officer tells them to clear the sidewalk or they'd be sprayed, and arrested. They refused, and they got what was told was coming. If they would have just cleared the sidewalk, then no one would have even been arrested, or harmed in any way. The protesters provoked this, and IMHO got what they deserved.

    j-mac
    yes, do exactly as the government says, when it says so and you can practice you "rights". Is protest pleasant? Hell no, not all the time, and it isn't supposed to be. It's supposed to disrupt and clamor and make noise and get people to listen. The way you want people to "protest" leaves no room for actual protest. Line up nice, go stand in that corner where no one will see you, and you can do your thing. Else, we'll release government force upon you.

    The real reason I dislike many of these sorts of authoritarian arguments isn't to say that we can't find reasonable medium. But rather that your authoritative arguments leave NO RESTRICTION upon the government force in ways and means through which it can infringe upon OUR RIGHTS, our free exercise there of. If forced to choose between the Government and the People, I will more times than not line up with the People. I find it sad when others defer immediately to State.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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    Re: UC Berkley: Police use excessive force

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Well, I think that the liberal supporters of this OWS stuff are turning this into a no win for law enforcement. And I am no cop, but I do believe that law enforcement would say that use of non lethal force such as pepper spray is not only meant to subdue threat, which IMHO surrounding police is a threat, but also to force people to submit without risk of injury. Is it pleasant? Hell no, it isn't supposed to be. But, The dept, has offered that they entered the quad to enforce a no tent rule, and were trying to leave when surrounded, and people sat and locked arms blocking the walkway. When officers told those blocking the walkway, which is clearly seen on video earlier the one officer tells them to clear the sidewalk or they'd be sprayed, and arrested. They refused, and they got what was told was coming. If they would have just cleared the sidewalk, then no one would have even been arrested, or harmed in any way. The protesters provoked this, and IMHO got what they deserved.

    j-mac
    You nailed that one, brother! No matter what the cops did--short of doing nothing--the hand-wringers would have been screaming, "poweese bwutalwity".
    Last edited by apdst; 11-21-11 at 07:53 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: UC Berkley: Police use excessive force

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    yes, do exactly as the government says, when it says so and you can practice you "rights". Is protest pleasant? Hell no, not all the time, and it isn't supposed to be. It's supposed to disrupt and clamor and make noise and get people to listen. The way you want people to "protest" leaves no room for actual protest. Line up nice, go stand in that corner where no one will see you, and you can do your thing. Else, we'll release government force upon you.

    The real reason I dislike many of these sorts of authoritarian arguments isn't to say that we can't find reasonable medium. But rather that your authoritative arguments leave NO RESTRICTION upon the government force in ways and means through which it can infringe upon OUR RIGHTS, our free exercise there of. If forced to choose between the Government and the People, I will more times than not line up with the People. I find it sad when others defer immediately to State.
    I bet if government scientists told you to do/not do something, because it would help prevent global warming, you would give them your 100% support.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: UC Berkley: Police use excessive force

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    You DO believe the protesters should have been cuffed and dragged...forcibly...without the use of teargas, right?
    Why tear gas? And they were still cuffed and dragged forcefully... that's how police officers are trained to handcuff people. You believe they could only have handcuffed these individuals with the help of non-lethal weapons?
    Ted Cruz is the dumbest person alive.

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    Re: UC Berkley: Police use excessive force

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I bet if government scientists told you to do/not do something, because it would help prevent global warming, you would give them your 100% support.
    How do you get to just troll this forum with uselessness like that? Un****ingreal. You crack me up, man.
    Ted Cruz is the dumbest person alive.

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    Re: UC Berkley: Police use excessive force

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I bet if government scientists told you to do/not do something, because it would help prevent global warming, you would give them your 100% support.
    Of course I would. They told me that ripping the air box off of my motorcycle was good for the environment, which is why I did it. Oh....wait.

    You done with asinine assumption that cannot be supported with measurement? Or is this just the tip of the "idiot" iceberg we're going for here?
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  9. #209
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    Re: UC Berkley: Police use excessive force

    Suspended with pay, aka vacation! Can't get time off for that cruise just pepper spray some defenseless kid in the face! Problem solved!
    "I do not claim that every incident in the history of empire can be explained in directly economic terms. Economic interests are filtered through a political process, policies are implemented by a complex state apparatus, and the whole system generates its own momentum."

  10. #210
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    Re: UC Berkley: Police use excessive force

    I'm glad to hear that the officer that did it was suspended. Hopefully that's in intermediate step on the road to him getting fired.
    If you build a man a fire, he'll be warm for a day.

    If you set a man on fire, he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

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