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Thread: 'Waterboarding is torture,' says Obama

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    Re: 'Waterboarding is torture,' says Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by Simon W. Moon View Post
    I think a number of them involved trickery, deduction, mind games and things like that.
    Quite true.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: 'Waterboarding is torture,' says Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by jasonxe View Post
    cookies give you more intel then torture. I'll talk if they gave me cookies or give me a option between the two. The again, im a cookie whore.
    I thought I heard you had blue fur.
    I may be wrong.

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    Re: 'Waterboarding is torture,' says Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    There is no evidence that it's unrealiable. Quite the contrary.

    Every single prisoner that served at the Hanoi Hilton signed a confession admitting to comitting war crimes against the North Vietnamese, so don't insult our intelligence by saying that torture doesn't work.
    Did they commit war crimes against the NV?
    Cause I don't think its being said the torture is unreliable in getting people to say what you think you want to hear. AfaIct, the issue about whether or not it's the best method for finding out information.
    I may be wrong.

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    Re: 'Waterboarding is torture,' says Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by jasonxe View Post
    cookies give you more intel then torture. I'll talk if they gave me cookies or give me a option between the two. The again, im a cookie whore.
    You made me think of this:


    A former FBI interrogator told a Canadian radio show that cookies are more effective than torture in getting information from terrorists. Torture sessions only take longer and it get more useless information

    Read more: FBI interrogator says cookies more effective than torture

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: 'Waterboarding is torture,' says Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Yes, generally psychological methods are the most effective form of interrogation - playing a mental chess game with the prisoner. In most cases of physical torture, the individual will simply say whatever it takes to get you to stop torturing him, which is why it's so notoriously unreliable. That's what most CIA case officers will tell you.
    Can you give me something more concrete than psychological methods? Run through an example for me. I am ready to believe that other forms of interrogation that work but how effective are they as a percentage to something like water boarding? Water boarding has worked but I am sure that it is only reliable to a certain degree. Is there something else more reliable to a greater degree? I am all for a better way but I don't see anything working in most cases. A lot of these guys are just not going to talk.

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    Re: 'Waterboarding is torture,' says Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    The UN thinks global warming is real, too.
    As do 97% of climatologists and anyone who doesn't have an agenda.
    Ted Cruz is the dumbest person alive.

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    Re: 'Waterboarding is torture,' says Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by jambalaya View Post
    Can you give me something more concrete than psychological methods? Run through an example for me. I am ready to believe that other forms of interrogation that work but how effective are they as a percentage to something like water boarding? Water boarding has worked but I am sure that it is only reliable to a certain degree. Is there something else more reliable to a greater degree? I am all for a better way but I don't see anything working in most cases. A lot of these guys are just not going to talk.
    how do you know waterboarding has worked? al Libi gave misinformation. What the WH gave as examples of success proved not to be what they said they were. So, what makes you say it worked?

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: 'Waterboarding is torture,' says Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    how do you know waterboarding has worked? al Libi gave misinformation. What the WH gave as examples of success proved not to be what they said they were. So, what makes you say it worked?
    Just google and you'll find claims like this one: 'Waterboarding worked' says former MI5 head - Telegraph

    And this is from a person who is against using the technique. If you don't want to believe it EVER worked that is your perogative. If you think you can debunk every claim that vital intelligence was obtained from waterboarding go ahead. But I don't think you can definitively do so.

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    Re: 'Waterboarding is torture,' says Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst, replying to another View Post
    I guess that's why it's [torture] been practice for the past few thousand years; because it's so ineffective.
    It's been in practice because:

    1. Those practicing it enjoy hurting others (sadists), and

    2. It can provide whatever false confession that the practitioner desires (which pretty much explains the Bush regime's use of it).

    Time and time again, people with actual experience with interrogating terror suspects and actual experience and knowledge about the effectiveness of torture techniques have come out to explain that they are ineffective and that their use threatens national security more than it helps.

    An FBI Interrogator on the Effectiveness of Torture

    So, based upon an intellectual analysis of the issue, the only reason one could support torture is either ignorance, or numbers 1 or 2 above.

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    Re: 'Waterboarding is torture,' says Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst, replying to another View Post
    You're right and torture shouldn't be the first option, however it shouldn't ruled out as an option, either.
    Indeed. If the prisoner will not willingly provide the false information you need, then you'll probably have to torture him to get it.

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