Occupy Oakland: City braces for general strike

Ikari said:

So the police police the police? In certain degrees yes, so long as they don't all start acting out. Ultimately the ones who police the police are the same as the ones who govern the government...We the People.

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"We the People" in the sense of who would investigate the Occupy incident would NOT include ANYONE who is an "Occupier"

I find it sufficient that we can't trust their word as people have been saying dude was shot in the head directly, yet the videos don't show that.

Ikari said:

Yeah, they don't much take kindly to challenges in their authority and sadly many seemed to have forgotten as to where that authority ultimately comes from.

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THE PEOPLE.... not the Pissy, Moaning, Whiney Cry baby ass individual who thinks they have a right that they dont.

Caine said:

"We the People" in the sense of who would investigate the Occupy incident would NOT include ANYONE who is an "Occupier"

I find it sufficient that we can't trust their word as people have been saying dude was shot in the head directly, yet the videos don't show that.

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From my review of the video it would be easy to make that mistake. He went down HARD. An eye-witness could honestly conclude he was shot directly and still be mistaken.

What if...? said:

From my review of the video it would be easy to make that mistake. He went down HARD. An eye-witness could honestly conclude he was shot directly and still be mistaken.

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Like could be said for the police (but shouldn't), the protesters themselves didn't even notice he was hurt for several moments after he lay there on the ground, as evidenced from the same video where you can tell he didn't take a direct hit.

Well the f#$king morons in Oakland met all expectations and started destroying private property and the apologists all over the media are falling all over themselves to try and not report it.

Any expectation that these are peaceful protestors and be treated as such should be gone and they should be seen and treated as a riotous mob.

Caine said:

Like could be said for the police (but shouldn't), the protesters themselves didn't even notice he was hurt for several moments after he lay there on the ground, as evidenced from the same video where you can tell he didn't take a direct hit.

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Well it looked luke they were moving in the direction the police were moving and then turned around and came back when they noticed someone had fallen behind them.

What if...? said:

Well it looked luke they were moving in the direction the police were moving and then turned around and came back when they noticed someone had fallen behind them.

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The problem I have is that the police weren't moving at all, with a downed man 10 ft in front of them.

Im not upset that the accidental injury occurred..... Im mad that none of them on the line bothered to move in to assist the injured man.

One could say they didn't notice it... but I would find that hard to believe....

Caine said:

The problem I have is that the police weren't moving at all, with a downed man 10 ft in front of them.

Im not upset that the accidental injury occurred..... Im mad that none of them on the line bothered to move in to assist the injured man.

One could say they didn't notice it... but I would find that hard to believe....

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The officers on the right were behind a barricade. On station under orders I'm sure.

It happened pretty fast. I don't really fault the officers who didn't throw a flashbang.

DiAnna said:

I didn't realize we were involved in a revolution to free ourselves from a tyrannical government. Silly me, I said the same things about the Tea Party Protests... they've got the absolute right to protest and if they break the law they'll have to accept the consequences. Now that I realize that we are trying to overthrow the government, I shall don my three-sided hat and load my musket and wait to see who the enemy really is.

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Didn't say we were, just said you would have make one hell of a Loyalist.

Caine said:

THE PEOPLE.... not the Pissy, Moaning, Whiney Cry baby ass individual who thinks they have a right that they dont.

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They are of the People, and have the same rights as all the People. Including association and protest. The fact that some cheer government force against such rights I find saddening and dangerous.

tessaesque said:

Why are you being so incredibly rude to everybody who disagrees with you?

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He's caught up in the OWS mindset?

Platypus said:

We are in revolutionary times.

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It's fascinating how the middle east is uprising and we have two different movements in American... TP and OWS, and OWS appears to be a lot more active and motivated than the TP right now. I am fascinated to see what these strikes could exactly lead to, especially if they spread on a massive scale. I am not exactly saying they will, but I am curious to see how much power workers can wield with large scale strikes like this considering their goals involve national policies. I am wondering when the protests for Occupy Congress will start.

Ikari said:

They are of the People, and have the same rights as all the People. Including association and protest. The fact that some cheer government force against such rights I find saddening and dangerous.

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It works both ways then.

If one pissy moaning crybaby ass little turd represents the views of all of the people....

Then the rapists, drug addicts, vandals, and violent anarchists represent all of the Occupy Movement...

Amiright?

Caine said:

It works both ways then.

If one pissy moaning crybaby ass little turd represents the views of all of the people....

Then the rapists, drug addicts, vandals, and violent anarchists represent all of the Occupy Movement...

Amiright?

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Except I didn't say the represented the whole of We the People, but rather that they are of the People.

Ikari said:

So the police police the police? In certain degrees yes, so long as they don't all start acting out. Ultimately the ones who police the police are the same as the ones who govern the government...We the People.

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I kind of addressed that, including how the people are not really given the ability to do it.

Hugh_Akston said:

I find it odd that all this trouble keeps happening in cities that have been liberal bastions for years. Maybe if they turned their anger to those who have caused all of this? No, that would make sense. :roll:

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They DID turn their anger to those who have caused all of this. Banksters got Glass-Steagal evicerated, and then put peoples' money into hedgefunds, and other bad investments, which collapsed. Some people lost their life savings, but banksters gave themselves bonuses for collapsing the American economy. Here is the result:



Chase Bankster to another Chase Bankster: "Circle the wagons, the natives are getting restless."

Ikari said:

Didn't say we were, just said you would have make one hell of a Loyalist.

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Actually, you were trying to insult me by implying I am traitor material because I don't believe protestors, liberal or conservative, have the right to break laws.

DiAnna said:

Actually, you were trying to insult me by implying I am traitor material because I don't believe protestors, liberal or conservative, have the right to break laws.

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No, I was implying you have a large penchant for blindly following the authority and defining power through it instead of The People. But whatever.

Ikari said:

No, I was implying you have a large penchant for blindly following the authority and defining power through it instead of The People. But whatever.

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Disagreement is not blindness.

SheWolf said:

It's fascinating how the middle east is uprising and we have two different movements in American... TP and OWS, and OWS appears to be a lot more active and motivated than the TP right now. I am fascinated to see what these strikes could exactly lead to, especially if they spread on a massive scale. I am not exactly saying they will, but I am curious to see how much power workers can wield with large scale strikes like this considering their goals involve national policies. I am wondering when the protests for Occupy Congress will start.

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The middle east uprisings included assassinations and the total ousting of the government, right? Is that what you're looking forward to here?

danarhea said:

They DID turn their anger to those who have caused all of this. Banksters got Glass-Steagal evicerated, and then put peoples' money into hedgefunds, and other bad investments, which collapsed. Some people lost their life savings, but banksters gave themselves bonuses for collapsing the American economy. Here is the result:

Chase Bankster to another Chase Bankster: "Circle the wagons, the natives are getting restless."

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Hmmm...So when I invest I should always expect to profit, and never loose money. And if I do loose money, then I have the right to throw a temper tantrum and go after the people I invested with? Funny, I never saw that in any of the disclaimers....


j-mac

j-mac said:

Hmmm...So when I invest I should always expect to profit, and never loose money. And if I do loose money, then I have the right to throw a temper tantrum and go after the people I invested with?

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No, you got the scam wrong. You invest and leverage too high in a system that is obviously going to pop. When it pops and you lose everything because of the high level to which you are leveraged, you run to government claiming that you are too big to fail or something equally stupid. Then the government takes a **** ton of tax payer money and gives it to you, thus removing the natural market consequence of failure replaced with tax payer backed, consequence free action.

Ikari said:

No, you got the scam wrong. You invest and leverage too high in a system that is obviously going to pop. When it pops and you lose everything because of the high level to which you are leveraged, you run to government claiming that you are too big to fail or something equally stupid. Then the government takes a **** ton of tax payer money and gives it to you, thus removing the natural market consequence of failure replaced with tax payer backed, consequence free action.

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About the only thing I think we all agree on in here is the 'too big to fail crap.' However, if I were that savvy investor, hedging, and leveraging then I also knew that I was gambling, probably due to the fact that government put pressure to lend to people that I knew were bad risk, and when they all started going up, they told me to unload it on Fannie, and let the dumb ass tax payer take the fall, meanwhile, congresscritters ran blocker for the biggest scam in history. Thanks man, your backing the wrong group.

j-mac

j-mac said:

About the only thing I think we all agree on in here is the 'too big to fail crap.' However, if I were that savvy investor, hedging, and leveraging then I also knew that I was gambling, probably due to the fact that government put pressure to lend to people that I knew were bad risk, and when they all started going up, they told me to unload it on Fannie, and let the dumb ass tax payer take the fall, meanwhile, congresscritters ran blocker for the biggest scam in history. Thanks man, your backing the wrong group.

j-mac

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No, that thing about "government forced to make bad loans". Not true. I think it's been debunked several times. Fact of the matter was that no bank was holding onto those mortgages long enough to make a difference. They all got bundled and sold off elsewhere and risks were then hedged and sold off as well. The problem came with the removal of regulation on the banks which had capped what they could leverage at. Well ok, that one was just the straw that broke the camels back. There was a long string of causes supported by every administration from the 80's forward. Regardless, there was a housing bubble, people knew about it. But in their zeal to make the money the European banks were making because they were allowed to leverage high, banks requested and finally got a raise on their leverage caps. Now we all know what leverage does, yes? You can make a lot of money...so long as everything runs well. As soon as anything starts going wrong, however, your losses are multiplied by your leverage; the higher you're leveraged the more you lose. And that was the case. The housing bubble finally broke. Because of the deceptive behavior and lack of regulation over the banks and wall street, the system was severely entangled. The high leverage rate meant that those who had these loans out legitimately should have lost their shirts and ended up on the street. That's capitalism (free market anyway).

However, they were "too big to fail" (not true, we have bankruptcy court and the government could have broken up the pieces, gotten rid of the rotten parts, and sold off anything of value to others), so instead we reward their bad behavior and ill made choices by ensuring they did not lose their shirts. Meanwhile the people get hit over the head, banks tried foreclosing on houses on which they were not sure if they even held the mortgage.

It's this further entanglement of government and corporate entity which is pushing a major problem in this country. We need to restore free market capitalism, for the health of the Republic.

Ikari said:

No, you got the scam wrong. You invest and leverage too high in a system that is obviously going to pop. When it pops and you lose everything because of the high level to which you are leveraged, you run to government claiming that you are too big to fail or something equally stupid. Then the government takes a **** ton of tax payer money and gives it to you, thus removing the natural market consequence of failure replaced with tax payer backed, consequence free action.

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I don't think you have a good grasp on the OWS argument. They're not pissed because the banks got government goodies. they're pissed because they didn't.