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Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

OscarB63 said:
as I have repeatedly said, unless the event qualifies as assault (or as you are so fixated upon the subject: rape) a single incident is not harassment. thanks for playing
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Actually, what you said was, "the only way a single comment could ever be considered harassment would be if it was so severe and so egregious that it could be considered a threat. and even then it wouldn't be harassment, it would be assault"

That is simply not true, yes it can be sexual harassment. I don't understand why you can't understand that as it's rather plain English. As the equalrights.org website states, a single severe incident can be sexual harassment as well as violating criminal laws (such as assault).
 
Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

OscarB63 said:
agreed and a "hey baby, nice rack" is not assault and unless repeated is not harassment
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That's probably correct. OTOH, if it was accompanied by a double handful of titty, it might qualify. Or if it was typical of the type of comments made over a period of time, it would qualify.
 
Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

AdamT said:
That's probably correct. OTOH, if it was accompanied by a double handful of titty, it might qualify. Or if it was typical of the type of comments made over a period of time, it would qualify.
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which is my point. but shiek wants to keep crying "rape" for some reason

a single, non-threatening, comment made without any physical contact is not going to be considered harassment by 99.99% of the courts anywhere in this country.
 
Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

Sheik Yerbuti said:
True, I relied on Herman Cain accuser attorney, Joel Bennett ... and you relied on .... Herman Cain accuser attorney, Joel Bennett
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. Nope, I relied on the news article that clearly stated your source, the plaintiffs attorney, was wrong.
 
Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

OscarB63 said:
which is my point. but shiek wants to keep crying "rape" for some reason
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The reason being -- that I'm cutting & pasting the definition of sexual harassment from equalrights.org. I can't decide which is worse for you, that you can't understand their definition or that you can't understand why the word "rape" appears in my posts?

OscarB63 said:
a single, non-threatening, comment made without any physical contact is not going to be considered harassment by 99.99% of the courts anywhere in this country.
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And of course, a single non-threatening comment doesn't qualify as "severe." As equalrights.org defines sexual harassment, a single severe incident can be sexual harassment.
 
Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

Sheik Yerbuti said:

And of course, a single non-threatening comment doesn't qualify as "severe." As equalrights.org defines sexual harassment, a single severe incident can be sexual harassment.
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the only reason you are arguing is that I refuse to call a single severe incident harassment...that is assault. you diminish the severity of the event by calling it harassment. If you commit a "severe" behavior are the cops going to charge you with harassment or are they going to charge you with assault?


compare: you get shot in the arm with a 22 you have a gunshot wound. you get your head blown off with a M2, you do not have a gunshot wound. even though you were shot with a gun, the severity of the damage makes calling it a wound idiotic
 
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Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

conservativeguy said:
Nope, I relied on the news article that clearly stated your source, the plaintiffs attorney, was wrong.
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Umm, the information came from the same guy. :doh

The article I cut & pasted from was quoting Joel Bennett, the plaintiff's attorney. In that article, he incorrectly stated that Cain was still the president of the NRA at the time of the settlement.

The article you cut & pasted from was was also quoting Joel Bennett, the plaintiff's attorney. In that article, he stated the settlement was signed in September, 1999.

But the source from both our articles was the same guy, Joel Bennett, the plaintiff's attorney. I relied on what he said in the article I posted from, so I was wrong.

But it was rather amusing watching you criticize me for relying on statements from the the plaintiff's attorney even as you were relying on statements from the plaintiff's attorney.

:lol:
 
Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

OscarB63 said:
the only difference it that I refuse to call a single severe incident harassment...that is assault. you diminish the severity of the event by calling it harassment.
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Ahh, I see. You have your own definition for "sexual harassment."

Ok, that explains it.
 
Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

Sheik Yerbuti said:
Ahh, I see. You have your own definition for "sexual harassment."

Ok, that explains it.
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I have an "as it is actually applied in real life" definition. there is a difference
 
Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

Generally, for a case to hold, doesn't there need to be a pattern?
 
Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

nota bene said:
Generally, for a case to hold, doesn't there need to be a pattern?
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yeah, that's what shiek refuses to accept. he is caught up in a technicality of someone's online definition.


take me to court for making a single "hey baby, nice rack" comment and see how long it takes for the judge to laugh in your face.
 
Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

OscarB63 said:
I have an "as it is actually applied in real life" definition. there is a difference
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Yes, there's your made up definition and then there's the definition on equalrights.org

A single incident is probably not sexual harassment unless it is severe. ~ equalrights.org

Perhaps you prefer the definition from eeoc.gov?

Although the law doesn’t prohibit simple teasing, offhand comments, or isolated incidents that are not very serious, harassment is illegal when it is so frequent or severe that it creates a hostile or offensive work environment or when it results in an adverse employment decision (such as the victim being fired or demoted). ~ eeoc.gov
 
Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

OscarB63 said:
yeah, that's what shiek refuses to accept. he is caught up in a technicality of someone's online definition.

take me to court for making a single "hey baby, nice rack" comment and see how long it takes for the judge to laugh in your face.
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You certainly are addicted to strawman arguments, I'll grant you that. No one, including myself, ever claimed a single "he baby, nice rack" comment was a severe incident.
 
Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

mike2810 said:
so they let it "fester" for 10+ years?
What has been reported also does not prove Cain is lying or did what he is accused of.

I am not a Cain supporter, I do have a question, Bill Clinton survived the sh claims, what makes this different?
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Some victims of incest let it fester a lifetime...Im surprised you dont know that occurs...and the difference between Clinton and Cain is that at least clintons was consensual....but I dont condone what clinton did one iota....that was then this is now...
To think cain didnt do any of this...you have to call 5 women utter total liars...One more thing Clinton like Cain called all the women liars too...even Monica
 
Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

Sheik Yerbuti said:
the law doesn’t prohibit simple teasing, offhand comments, or isolated incidents that are not very serious
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case closed
 
Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

OscarB63 said:
case closed
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So shoving a woman's face in your crotch & putting your hand up her skirt = simple teasing???

You live in an interesting version of reality.
 
Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

rocket88 said:
So shoving a woman's face in your crotch & putting your hand up her skirt = simple teasing???

You live in an interesting version of reality.
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as I said, this is not harassment. shoving a woman's face in your crotch and putting your hand up her skirt is assault. do try to keep up and thanks for playing
 
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Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

Sheik Yerbuti said:
Exactly what part of "or severe" don't you understand?
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what part of any offense that is "severe" is going to be prosecuted as assault, not harassment don't you understand? thanks for playing
 
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Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

Sheik Yerbuti said:
Umm, the information came from the same guy. :doh

The article I cut & pasted from was quoting Joel Bennett, the plaintiff's attorney. In that article, he incorrectly stated that Cain was still the president of the NRA at the time of the settlement.

The article you cut & pasted from was was also quoting Joel Bennett, the plaintiff's attorney. In that article, he stated the settlement was signed in September, 1999.

But the source from both our articles was the same guy, Joel Bennett, the plaintiff's attorney. I relied on what he said in the article I posted from, so I was wrong.

But it was rather amusing watching you criticize me for relying on statements from the the plaintiff's attorney even as you were relying on statements from the plaintiff's attorney.

:lol:
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I relied upon the article. They didn't quote this Bennett fellow when they wrote this ....

Cain had already left the organization by then, before his three-year term was up, as my colleagues reported last night.
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Look, at the end of the day Cain didn't sign any agreements. We both agree on this so let's move on.
 
Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

OscarB63 said:
what part of any offense that is "severe" is going to be prosecuted as assault, not harassment don't you understand? thanks for playing
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the part where you exclude sexual harassment charges as though the two charges, "sexual harassment" and "sexual assault" are mutually exclusive.

They're not and the definition I gave you said as much.
 
Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

Sheik Yerbuti said:
the part where you exclude sexual harassment charges as though the two charges, "sexual harassment" and "sexual assault" are mutually exclusive.

They're not and the definition I gave you said as much.
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sorry that you just can't understand there is the "book definition" and then there is the "as applied definition". but....thanks for playing
 
From equalrights.org -- ERA: Sexual Harassment at Work -- Sexual Harassment in the Workplace:

What is sexual harassment?
Sexual harassment is a form of sex discrimination.The legal definition of sexual harassment is “unwelcome verbal, visual, or physical conduct of a sexual nature that is severe or pervasive and affects working conditions or creates a hostile work environment.”
Unwelcome

Conduct is not sexual harassment if it is welcome.For this reason, it is important to communicate (either verbally, in writing, or by your own actions) to the harasser that the conduct makes you uncomfortable and that you want it to stop.

Conduct Of A Sexual Nature
Many different kinds of conduct—verbal, visual or physical—that is of a sexual nature may be sexual harassment, if the behavior is unwelcome and if it is severe or pervasive. Here are some more examples:
Verbal or written: Comments about clothing, personal behavior, or a person’s body; sexual or sex-based jokes; requesting sexual favors or repeatedly asking a person out; sexual innuendoes; telling rumors about a person’s personal or sexual life; threatening a person
​
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There's plenty more examples at the link.

If Cain did what this lady says he did, he was guilty of sexual assault. Maybe. Big maybe.
 
Re: Lawyer: Cain accuser wants to tell her side of story

OscarB63 said:
as I said, this is not harassment. shoving a woman's face in your crotch and putting your hand up her skirt is assault. do try to keep up and thanks for playing
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Oh, it's "assault." Well then it's okay, isn't it?

I guess it depends on what your definition of "is" is.
 
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