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Thread: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

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    Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    As the events that led to Oakland protester Scott Olsen's head injury continue to unfold and investigations begin, we thought it important to offer some perspective. This comment is from a former Marine with special operations in crowd control.
    He points out that shooting canisters such as those that likely hit Scott Olsen is prohibited under rules of engagements in Iraq and Afghanistan.


    Before gas goes into a crowd shield bearers have to be making no progress moving a crowd or crowd must be assaulting the line. Not with sticks and stones but a no bull**** assault. 3 warnings must be given to the crowd in a manner they can hear that force is about to be used. Shield bearers take a knee and CS gas is released in grenade form first to fog out your lines because you have gas masks. You then kick the canisters along in front of your lines. Projectile gas is not used except for longer ranged engagement or trying to steer the crowd ( by steering a crowd I mean firing gas to block a street off ). You also have shotguns with beanbags and various less than lethal rounds for your launchers. These are the rules for a WARZONE!!
    But thats ok because the OWS people are commies and deserve whats coming to them.

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    Re: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    More sensationalist garbage.

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    Re: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    I think this marine makes a very good point.......the ROE's established by BO are BS.
    I love the smell of burning moonbat in the morning.

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    Re: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    If the cops were bombing those turds with willy peter or machine gunning them with explosive bullets he might have a point



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    Re: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    Jesus Christ! There is something screwed up with America when people start saying that brutality is not brutal enough unless people start dying.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    The economy will improve under this bill. If a few people die, it will be for the betterament of this country.

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    Re: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    But thats ok because the OWS people are commies and deserve whats coming to them.
    From your link:

    The Military manual states:
    …have a duty to collect and care for the wounded. Prioritize treatment according to injuries. Make NO treatment distinction based on nationality. All soldiers, enemy or friendly, must be treated the same.
    Not really germaine to your post's intent, but this is a real surprise. I can pretty much guarantee I'm not going to be treating enemy and friendly the same.

    As to your post, **** happens. Accidents happen. This anonymous source says one aims for range and not at people's heads. So. Range requires an arc. I don't for a New York Minute think this copper aimed at someone's head intentionally. If you think so, then you're into conspiracies. We have got to give "our own" the benefit of the doubt. Period.
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

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    Re: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Jesus Christ! There is something screwed up with America when people start saying that brutality is not brutal enough unless people start dying.
    That's not what anyone's saying. Only you.
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

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    Re: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Jesus Christ! There is something screwed up with America when people start saying that brutality is not brutal enough unless people start dying.
    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    That's not what anyone's saying. Only you.
    and TD
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    If the cops were bombing those turds with willy peter or machine gunning them with explosive bullets he might have a point
    willy pete__I - Google Searcht does make one wonder why the treatment of American citizens is not as protected as the treatment of foreigners. At first glance, it would seem that American citizens would be worthy of better treatment.
    But, I am sure there's a very good reason for being an advocate of the USG treating its citizens harshly. Just for thelife of me, I don't know what it is.
    I may be wrong.

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    Re: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by conservativeguy View Post
    I think this marine makes a very good point.......the ROE's established by BO are BS.
    ROE is not established by El Presidente.

    ROE is irrelevant.
    RUF ( rules of the use of force) are pertinent.

    while I understand the Marine's point ( and disagree with him on a few details where he is wrong.. like smoking out you own lines during civil disturbance operations)).. the larger problem is one of basing the reaction of Law Enforcement while utilizing an improper standard.
    he is using "wartime" RUF ( btw, there is no difference between wartime and peacetime RUF in civil disturbance operations...it's a false distinction) to gauge the reaction of civilian law enforcement.
    what he does not mention is the the military bars use of force ( in civil disturbance operations) on unarmed civilians.
    civilian law enforcement are not bound by military regulations or guidelines... they are authorized, by law, to utilize force against unarmed civilians.
    this is a very important distinction between military and civilian law enforcement.... one that the junior Marine in question should know, if ,indeed ,he is properly trained in civil disturbance operations ( which I have my doubts of )

    civilians law enforcement is also not under guidance of military techniques pertaining to the employment of force ...to say that the military utilized 40mm in one fashion is one thing, to say the police are bound to use the same technique is false.

    Military crowd control guideline and techniques are outlined, in boring detail, in FM 3-19.15 ( Civil Disturbance Operations manual)
    ( the Marine Corps utilizes the Army manual for guidance and training)

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    Re: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    From your link:



    Not really germaine to your post's intent, but this is a real surprise. I can pretty much guarantee I'm not going to be treating enemy and friendly the same.

    As to your post, **** happens. Accidents happen. This anonymous source says one aims for range and not at people's heads. So. Range requires an arc. I don't for a New York Minute think this copper aimed at someone's head intentionally. If you think so, then you're into conspiracies. We have got to give "our own" the benefit of the doubt. Period.
    well, it would be nice if they actually stated which "military manual" they were gleaning this information from... but i can attest that it's not in the civil disturbance operations manual.

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