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Thread: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

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    Re: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    If the cops were bombing those turds with willy peter or machine gunning them with explosive bullets he might have a point
    So only going a little overboard is ok, it's not until it is mass murder that you will object?
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

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    Re: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    ROE is not established by El Presidente.

    ROE is irrelevant.
    RUF ( rules of the use of force) are pertinent.
    Send a letter to the marine in the OP and tell him to get his story correct.

    I am laughing at your comment regarding the President having no input in the ROE's.
    I love the smell of burning moonbat in the morning.

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    Re: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by conservativeguy View Post
    Send a letter to the marine in the OP and tell him to get his story correct.

    I am laughing at your comment regarding the President having no input in the ROE's.
    He did not say "no input", he said "not established by".
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    Re: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by conservativeguy View Post
    Send a letter to the marine in the OP and tell him to get his story correct.

    I am laughing at your comment regarding the President having no input in the ROE's.
    my 24 years as a Marine tells me that I don't give a ratf*ck what you laugh at.

    if i sent a letter to this Marine.. it won't be to tell him he is wrong on anything.. it will be to congratulate him on taking an interest in civics and to thank him for exercising the very rights both me and him have served to protect.

    if i give him any advice at all .. it would be advising him to quit being a sissy, rub some dirt on his wounds, and to get back in the fight.... and maybe to duck the next time projectiles start flying.

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    Re: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    If the cops were bombing those turds with willy peter or machine gunning them with explosive bullets he might have a point
    I think your reaction exemplifies the fear that begins to take root in the "them that has" class. You know, it's like saying, "we should just kill those worthless handjobs." You know, put the fear of God in them and they'll stop. The enforcers for the 1% could find themselves outnumbered, don't you think?

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    Re: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    my 24 years as a Marine tells me that I don't give a ratf*ck what you laugh at.

    if i sent a letter to this Marine.. it won't be to tell him he is wrong on anything.. it will be to congratulate him on taking an interest in civics and to thank him for exercising the very rights both me and him have served to protect.

    if i give him any advice at all .. it would be advising him to quit being a sissy, rub some dirt on his wounds, and to get back in the fight.... and maybe to duck the next time projectiles start flying.
    Whatever else we may agree or disagree on, I sincerely appreciate your 24 years of service in the Marines. Thank you.
    I love the smell of burning moonbat in the morning.

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    Re: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    ROE is not established by El Presidente.

    ROE is irrelevant.
    RUF ( rules of the use of force) are pertinent.

    while I understand the Marine's point ( and disagree with him on a few details where he is wrong.. like smoking out you own lines during civil disturbance operations)).. the larger problem is one of basing the reaction of Law Enforcement while utilizing an improper standard.
    he is using "wartime" RUF ( btw, there is no difference between wartime and peacetime RUF in civil disturbance operations...it's a false distinction) to gauge the reaction of civilian law enforcement.
    what he does not mention is the the military bars use of force ( in civil disturbance operations) on unarmed civilians.
    civilian law enforcement are not bound by military regulations or guidelines... they are authorized, by law, to utilize force against unarmed civilians.
    this is a very important distinction between military and civilian law enforcement.... one that the junior Marine in question should know, if ,indeed ,he is properly trained in civil disturbance operations ( which I have my doubts of )

    civilians law enforcement is also not under guidance of military techniques pertaining to the employment of force ...to say that the military utilized 40mm in one fashion is one thing, to say the police are bound to use the same technique is false.

    Military crowd control guideline and techniques are outlined, in boring detail, in FM 3-19.15 ( Civil Disturbance Operations manual)
    ( the Marine Corps utilizes the Army manual for guidance and training)
    That's not the point. Nobody is saying military rules are actually applicable here. What we're suggesting is that maybe applying more force to our own civilians than we are willing to apply to civilians in other countries is ****ed up.
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    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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    Re: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones



    But thats ok because the OWS people are commies and deserve whats coming to them.
    1) I thought there were administrative rules against military personnel participating in political protests while in uniform. Does anyone have any insight on that?

    2) Police are humans just like the rest of us. They get twitchy and nervous, makes mistakes and overreact just like everyone else. It's really a high-stress job, and when you combine that stress with a volatile situation w/ demonstrators, and a lack of experience with regard to riot/crowd control tactics, **** just happens sometimes.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
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    Re: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    But thats ok because the OWS people are commies and deserve whats coming to them.
    Actually, I think it's more like our Congressmen and Senators get more cutbacks for pouring money into the Pentagon than they do for ensuring our police forces are able to spend money on the proper training they need for such situations.
    Also, we need to legalize recreational drugs and prostitution.

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    Re: Marine Says Oakland Used Crowd Control Methods That Are Prohibited In War Zones

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    Not really germaine to your post's intent, but this is a real surprise. I can pretty much guarantee I'm not going to be treating enemy and friendly the same.
    The reason why the U.S. Army prioritizes providing medical care based on the seriousness of the injury as opposed to the nationality of the soldier is to help ensure that the formal militaries we go to war with do the same for our soldiers. After all, we don't want to lose good soldiers and officers to die of a sucking chest wound on the battleground where a medic from the enemy side can help him, but that medic chooses not to because he's busy helping a soldier from his own side dealing with a hangnail.

    Remember - in warfare, the servicemen you're at war with will treat you with the same respect, dignity, and care that you treat their servicemen. So if you act too cold-blooded to the other side don't be surprised when they act the same way to your own side.

    Just wanted to point out the Army's reasoning for stating that. I'm sure that there are members of our military who can go into finer detail on that point.
    Also, we need to legalize recreational drugs and prostitution.

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