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Thread: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

  1. #421
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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by vvx View Post
    I grew up in low income housing. My mom was on various welfare programs, though she'd never use the word welfare. To me, EIC, food stamps, section 8 housing, etc... it's all welfare. So I benefited by these programs. Am I not allowed to say we should eliminate the earned income credit? Would people respond telling me that you don't have to claim EIC therefore if I don't like it, just don't claim it? My own beliefs, I'd be more qualified than the common person to have an opinion on it, having seen the effects. Has Warren Buffet seen what the reduced taxes do, and what they don't do? Yes, I'd say he sure has.
    I'm not understanding what you are getting at here...are you suggesting that people that can barely afford the things needed to live should buck up and turn down any possible aid, based on principle? If those people want to prove a point so bad, then sure. I'd say the people who would be down with that are those that cry foul with all the social programs you just listed...should THEY themselves ever fall on hard times. I'd expect THEM to also put their money where their mouths are...same as I expect of Warren Buffet.
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Reports indicate that everyone knew he was hauling a bunch of guns up there. But, since you brought it up, there's something which should be illegal: guns that breakdown.

  2. #422
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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    there are many good reasons to cut taxes

    there are almost no good reasons to raise them
    When the country needs revenue, it's a good reason to raise taxes, especially on people that have been able to pay less than their share. If there's almost no good reason to raise taxes then why are your leaders so anxious to raise the payroll tax that only affects the middle-class?



    "I have been thinking that I would make a proposition to my Republican friends... that if they will stop telling lies about the Democrats, we will stop telling the truth about them."
    --Adlai Stevenson, Politician





  3. #423
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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by KevinKohler View Post
    Oh, so they have already willingly paid more in taxes than were due? Show me the link, or it didn't happen.
    No one made that claim exept you. They are saying, as is the majority of the country, that their income class is not being taxed enough to make our consumer based economy work.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by KevinKohler View Post
    Economics is not a zero sum game. There is not a fixed amount of money to be made. The fact that there is a man who has amassed a trillion dollars does not, in any way, reduce my pay, or reduce my ability to make money.

    I believe you've been told this a couple times by now...so you are either obtuse, or you don't believe it, at which point, I invite you to check out these links.

    Economics is not a zero sum game | The Everyday Economist
    Zero-Sum

    The first is a simple overview, while the second involves a little bit of math.
    You are correct there is no top dollar amount of potential wealth. However that is completely beside the point. We have statistics that show that for the last 3 decades there has been more of the country's wealth going to the top 1% than to the remaining 99% which has resulted in a declining middle class who are the consumers that make our economy work.
    Last edited by Catawba; 11-20-11 at 05:55 AM.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  5. #425
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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    No one made that claim exept you. They are saying, as is the majority of the country, that their income class is not being taxed enough to make our consumer based economy work.
    They are not asking anyone to do what they themselves are not willing to do.

    Your words, not mine. Are they able to give more of their income in taxes? Yes. HAVE they given more of their income in taxes? No. If someone is able, but yet doesn't do a thing, I typically think of them as being unwilling. They can have a plethora of reasons, which I care nothing about...maybe they claim they won't till everyone else does because them alone won't be effective...that still means UNWILLING. And in this case, it's because they don't want to be leaders on the issue...they only want to "go with the flow"....so long as that flow is going EXACTLY where they wish it to go.

    You still don't understand yet how fishy it sounds for a group of rich folk who made their fortunes by avoiding taxes to all of a sudden come out in favor of increasing their income tax burden.
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Reports indicate that everyone knew he was hauling a bunch of guns up there. But, since you brought it up, there's something which should be illegal: guns that breakdown.

  6. #426
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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    You are correct there is no top dollar amount of potential wealth. However that is completely beside the point. We have statistics that show that for the last 3 decades there has been more of the country's wealth going to the top 1% than to the remaining 99% which has resulted in a declining middle class who are the consumers that make our economy work.
    Your thought process is flawed. If economics is NOT a zero sum game, which you seem to agree with...then the rich getting richer by the fistful should have no effect on anyone else. The declining middle class is a result of a change of culture, a change in the very meaning of the term, and, more importantly, globalization.
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Reports indicate that everyone knew he was hauling a bunch of guns up there. But, since you brought it up, there's something which should be illegal: guns that breakdown.

  7. #427
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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by KevinKohler View Post
    They are not asking anyone to do what they themselves are not willing to do.

    Your words, not mine. Are they able to give more of their income in taxes? Yes. HAVE they given more of their income in taxes? No. If someone is able, but yet doesn't do a thing, I typically think of them as being unwilling. They can have a plethora of reasons, which I care nothing about...maybe they claim they won't till everyone else does because them alone won't be effective...that still means UNWILLING. And in this case, it's because they don't want to be leaders on the issue...they only want to "go with the flow"....so long as that flow is going EXACTLY where they wish it to go.

    You still don't understand yet how fishy it sounds for a group of rich folk who made their fortunes by avoiding taxes to all of a sudden come out in favor of increasing their income tax burden.
    I give up on trying to explain it to you. I don't think you will ever understand someone wanting a change to make their country better, even though it will increase their taxes too.

    The important thing is that the majority of the country gets it!
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  8. #428
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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by liblady View Post
    so you're saying people who don't have capital gains are losers?
    those who want those with CG to pay higher tax rates because they whine having CG is unfair are losers



  9. #429
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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by mertex View Post
    When the country needs revenue, it's a good reason to raise taxes, especially on people that have been able to pay less than their share. If there's almost no good reason to raise taxes then why are your leaders so anxious to raise the payroll tax that only affects the middle-class?
    your problem is you are in a world of delusion where you think the rich aren't paying their fair share when in reality, the rich are the only group paying a HIGHER SHARE OF THE INCOME TAX burden than their share of the income.



  10. #430
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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    your problem is you are in a world of delusion where you think the rich aren't paying their fair share when in reality, the rich are the only group paying a HIGHER SHARE OF THE INCOME TAX burden than their share of the income.
    Still trying to pretend that federal income taxes are all the taxes people pay???

    "It’s true that the top 1 percent of wage earners paid 38 percent of the federal income taxes in 2008 (the most recent year for which data is available). But people forget that the income tax is less than half of federal taxes and only one-fifth of taxes at all levels of government.

    Social Security, Medicare and unemployment insurance taxes (known as payroll taxes) are paid mostly by the bottom 90 percent of wage earners. That’s because, once you reach $106,800 of income, you pay no more for Social Security, though the much smaller Medicare tax applies to all wages. Warren Buffett pays the exact same amount of Social Security taxes as someone who earns $106,800."

    "The Internal Revenue Service issues an annual report on the 400 highest income-tax payers. In 1961, there were 398 taxpayers who made $1 million or more, so I compared their income tax burdens from that year to 2007.

    Despite skyrocketing incomes, the federal tax burden on the richest 400 has been slashed, thanks to a variety of loopholes, allowable deductions and other tools. The actual share of their income paid in taxes, according to the IRS, is 16.6 percent. Adding payroll taxes barely nudges that number.

    Compare that to the vast majority of Americans, whose share of their income going to federal taxes increased from 13.1 percent in 1961 to 22.5 percent in 2007."


    http://www.wweek.com/portland/articl...out_taxes.html


    Despite that you think you are, you are not fooling the American people, the great majority agree its time to eliminate the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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