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Thread: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    More taxes have never created jobs.

    Yup, and the 10 years of bush tax cuts created how many net jobs? Don't look like cutting taxes create jobs either.
    Last edited by barbarian_style; 11-16-11 at 11:33 PM.

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    I'll tell you what is truly confounding, and that is that someone can come in here and tag themselves a "moderate", and proceed to regurgitate the most vile, insulting, and ill informed crap they can spew and not one person has a honest moment to say to themselves that maybe, just maybe they should start telling the truth, and start with their own lean.

    This post is reprehensible.

    j-mac
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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by barbarian_style View Post
    Yup, and the 10 years of bush tax cuts created how many net jobs? Don't look like cutting taxes create jobs either.
    It's amazing how they can keep insisting that tax cuts create jobs. The tax cuts have been in effect since 2001 - so where are the jobs? Maybe they need a tax cut every year to create more jobs?



    "I have been thinking that I would make a proposition to my Republican friends... that if they will stop telling lies about the Democrats, we will stop telling the truth about them."
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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by mertex View Post
    It's amazing how they can keep insisting that tax cuts create jobs. The tax cuts have been in effect since 2001 - so where are the jobs? Maybe they need a tax cut every year to create more jobs?
    there are many good reasons to cut taxes

    there are almost no good reasons to raise them



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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    there are many good reasons to cut taxes

    there are almost no good reasons to raise them
    Atleast this acknowledges that there ARE some legitimate reasons for raising taxes, the obvious being "to raise revenue in order to pay down debt". Of course, cutting spending works as well, but with a debt as large as ours is there's just no way to draw it down in any significant timeframe using spending cuts alone.

    If this country is to avert stagflation and remain competitive with the global economy - in particular compete with our newest world economic/military power, China (...not a super power yet, but gaining; and mind you, Russia is returning to prominence fast!) - we will need to do a combination of both spending cuts AND increase taxes. Otherwise, the cuts being proposed will force this country to lag behind for years...perhaps decades...while the rest of the world surpasses us in technology, commerce (exports through manufacturing) and possibly military supremacy.

    If you "cut-throats" out there believe that cutting spending and only cutting spending is the right way to go (pun intended), be my guess and stand by your position. But when Russia regains their global footing and China begins to really reign supreme, don't say the libbos didn't warn you.
    Last edited by Objective Voice; 11-17-11 at 06:29 PM.

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Is there a law that prohibits paying more in taxes than what is legally owed?
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Reports indicate that everyone knew he was hauling a bunch of guns up there. But, since you brought it up, there's something which should be illegal: guns that breakdown.

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by KevinKohler View Post
    Is there a law that prohibits paying more in taxes than what is legally owed?
    Because you think more tax revenue from 200 millionaires = more tax revenue from 6 million millionaires????
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    This may be the closest we have ever come to agreement J. It seems we both generally think both revenues and spending will have to be addressed over the long haul.

    I am not an unreasonable person. However, the details can be the sticking point can't they....Such as....

    Our main area of difference is who's tax rates should be increased. Since the tax rates have gone down for the rich over the last 30 years for the rich, and increased for the middle class
    This part, although a good sound byte, is not factual. For instance my personal bracket covering the median income levels of this country would see a projected $3700.00 rise in my real tax with just the failure to keep the current tax rates in place.

    and we now have for the first time since the Great Depression 80% of the wealth at the top
    Well, since wealth in this country is a fluid thing, in order for your meme here to be true you'd have to show where the wealth you are talking about is static.

    and since this doesn't allow enough to trickle down to the lower consumer classes to enable them to be consumers, which is necessary for a strong economy,
    'trickle down' is a narrative constructed by the liberal left in this country. It implies a class structure to success so that the liberal can continually count on class warfare to divide into groups. Which is in the end the only way that the liberal can maintain any hope of political success.

    The 47% you speak of are the unemployed, underemployed, seniors, and the poor. Jobs that pay a living wage are required to provide taxable incomes.
    Some are sure, and those that truly need societal aid absolutely should receive such, but only under the strictest of circumstances. And not with unlimited incentive to remain on the dole. Those that are able to work, need to be trained and get to it rather than bleed me for my earned income.

    it seems obvious to the majority of the country that some of the progressiveness needs to be restored to our tax system.
    The problem with what we have now is a progressive system that also breeds class jealousy, and division. For as much as libs love to promote fairness, and justice, how is it either that some pay all while others pay nothing?

    Why do we still give tax breaks to companies for outsourcing American jobs? Don't you think that is a tax break that should be eliminated? The Democrats put up a bill to eliminate it this year and the Republicans voted it down.
    And yet another liberal talking point. I'll have to hand it to ya Cat, you sure know your pap. Look, it is clear that your particular vision of what this country should be would not be something that would prosper, or give opportunity to anyone other than those chosen to be the bourgeois by the political class. The rest can grovel in the streets for the scraps of bread when available...I thought the world tried that once.


    It failed.


    j-mac
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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Because you think more tax revenue from 200 millionaires = more tax revenue from 6 million millionaires????
    "Millionaires" are going to pay very little more in income tax if the Bush tax cuts go away. As it has been pointed out many times, a good portion of them make their money with capital gains, not income.

    Warren Buffet makes a little more than I (my wife and I combined) in income. Disregarding for a moment the tax breaks he will be able to take tax advantage of that i won't, who is going to get hit the hardest by ending the Bush tax cuts? The family making $100 K all in income or Buffet making millions upon millions with very little in income?

    No, the "rich" are playing you big time and you are gleefully singing along on the choruses.

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    I am not an unreasonable person. However, the details can be the sticking point can't they....Such as....

    This part, although a good sound byte, is not factual.
    It is absolutely factual, Reagan raised tax rates for the middle class and lowered tax rates for the top income class:

    "KRUGMAN: I’m referring to the Social Security Reform Act of 1983, which followed the recommendations of a commission led by Alan Greenspan. Its key provision was an increase in the payroll tax that pays for Social Security and Medicare hospital insurance.

    For many middle- and low-income families, this tax increase more than undid any gains from Mr. Reagan's income tax cuts. In 1980, according to Congressional Budget Office estimates, middle-income families with children paid 8.2 percent of their income in income taxes, and 9.5 percent in payroll taxes. By 1988 the income tax share was down to 6.6 percent—but the payroll tax share was up to 11.8 percent, and the combined burden was up, not down.

    For those who don’t want to do the math, Krugman’s “middle-income families with children” were paying a combined burden of 18.4 percent by 1988, up from 17.7 percent in 1980. For these middle-class families, Reagan—who did reduce taxes overall—had actually raised their tax burden."
    Krugman offers a useful point, counteracting a decade of spinning

    This was followed by W. cutting taxes, but cut more for the wealthy than the middle class.

    "Families earning more than $1 million a year saw their federal tax rates drop more sharply than any group in the country as a result of President Bush’s tax cuts, according to a new Congressional study."
    Tax Cuts Offer Most for Very Rich, Study Says - New York Times


    Well, since wealth in this country is a fluid thing, in order for your meme here to be true you'd have to show where the wealth you are talking about is static.
    Wealth has been getting more and more concentrated at the top over the last 3 decades. Most of us have noticed the pattern. Have you notice the 20 or so polls since January where a majority of Americans think the tax breaks for the rich should be eliminated? Have you noticed people protesting in the streets?



    'trickle down' is a narrative constructed by the liberal left in this country. It implies a class structure to success so that the liberal can continually count on class warfare to divide into groups. Which is in the end the only way that the liberal can maintain any hope of political success.
    Trickle down economics has been the policy the GOP has promoted for the last 30 years, and still promotes to this day, despite its failure! It worked well for those at the top but didn't trickle down to the middle class.



    Some are sure, and those that truly need societal aid absolutely should receive such, but only under the strictest of circumstances. And not with unlimited incentive to remain on the dole. Those that are able to work, need to be trained and get to it rather than bleed me for my earned income.
    A third of the 47% are seniors, the remainder don't make enough money to pay a great deal in taxes. If you want them to pay more taxes, they will need to be paid a living wage for full time work, which most conservatives seemed to be opposed to.


    The problem with what we have now is a progressive system that also breeds class jealousy, and division. For as much as libs love to promote fairness, and justice, how is it either that some pay all while others pay nothing?
    You need to study history. Our tax system is now less progressive than it was under Republican presidents Eisenhower, Nixon, and Ford.



    And yet another liberal talking point. I'll have to hand it to ya Cat, you sure know your pap.
    History, its available for all that take the time to look.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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