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Thread: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    I think for all we know a lot of these much richer people are giving an extra portion to the government and just want to make sure that all rich are giving their share. I think what is more astonishing is these billion dollar corporations that pay zero income tax. They may pay state and what not but so do I. That is the kind of stuff that needs to be stopped.
    "We’re going to close the unproductive tax loopholes that allow some of the truly wealthy to avoid paying their fair share. In theory, some of those loopholes were understandable, but in practice they sometimes made it possible for millionaires to pay nothing, while a bus driver was paying ten percent of his salary, and that’s crazy." -Reagan

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by whysoserious View Post
    In fact, I would guarantee he is talking about those who live solely off interest and capital gains and then say they help they economy. There is no reason for a straw man argument...
    Haymarket stated 'Those who inherit wealth come to mind.' And YOU 'guarantee he is talking about...interest and capital gains'...so inheritance and interest/capital gains are the same? Please explain this guarantee.

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Here's a hint: do the math on the difference between 25 millionaires volunteering to pay $5,000 more in taxes, and 3 million millionaires paying $5,000 more in taxes.

    Which would result in the most revenue, and be the most fair to all millionaires?

    You should be able to figure it out from there.

    Glad I could help!
    Right, so it's all or nothing, eh? "We want to help....but we refuse, unless EVERYONE ELSE in our positions are forced to help as well. It's only fair."

    GREAT ARGUMENT.

    If it looks like a fish, and smells like it, it's probably fishy.
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Reports indicate that everyone knew he was hauling a bunch of guns up there. But, since you brought it up, there's something which should be illegal: guns that breakdown.

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    The balance of wealth in American and around the world is lopsided. There is no denying that. If you don't like the way billionaires are using their money stop bitching about it and do something about it. For starters stop giving them your money. Rather than bitching at the government about jobs, do something about it. Yelling and crying isn't going to change anything. Our economy is failing because the vast majority of Americans would rather buy products made in some sweat shop in Asia rather than products made here in America because the Chinese products are cheaper and their greedy asses are more concerned with getting a deal than the economy of this country. Except when it comes to them of course. The jobs are leaving in this country because no one supports our economy. Instead they cry and whine their being no jobs while waiting in line to send more of our money to China, Mexico and Indonesia. When a companies competitor ships manufacturing to China and cuts costs then every other company there too has to follow suit in order to stay in business. I went down to a anti wall street gathering in Denver last week. Half the people there were sporting Nike, drinking Starbucks, carrying goods in Wal-Mart bags and complaining about big businesses.

    I am ranting a bit. Sorry. My point is if Americans want jobs back in America then we need to be supporting our own economies rather than rewarding companies who utilize slave labor to keep costs down. The government cannot change that it is not profitable to keep employees here. Americans can. People need to stop looking for someone else to blame and have a little bit of accountability. Its the American public who is to blame for the economy. Not businesses, billionaires, or the government.
    We're too far gone for this. The REASON why people shop at wallmart in the first place is because they can't AFFORD the american made stuff. People don't drive a hyundai or a dawoo because they think it's cool. Ask yourself WHY american made goods cost a good deal more than foreign, in SPITE of shipping costs, etc, and THEN you'll be on the correct path.
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Reports indicate that everyone knew he was hauling a bunch of guns up there. But, since you brought it up, there's something which should be illegal: guns that breakdown.

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by EarlzP View Post
    FactCheck.org : Clinton and Economic Growth in the ’90s

    Clinton’s major contribution was pushing through the 1993 budget bill, which began to reduce what had become a chronic string of federal deficits. Republicans denounced it as the "largest tax increase in history," though in fact it was not a record and also contained some cuts in projected spending. Republican Rep. Newt Gingrich predicted: "The tax increase will kill jobs and lead to a recession, and the recession will force people off of work and onto unemployment and will actually increase the deficit." But just the opposite happened. Fears of inflation waned and interest rates fell, making money cheaper to borrow for homes, cars and investment. What had been a slow economic recovery turned into a roaring boom, bringing in so much unanticipated tax revenue from rising incomes and stock-market gains that the government actually was running record surpluses by the time Clinton left office.

    Do you need more or are you ready to admit, finally admit that raising taxes creates jobs

    FactCheck.org : The Budget and Deficit Under Clinton

    Try to get it right for the gazillionth time raising taxes creates jobs and reduces the deficit
    The tax increase was not responsible for the bubble that started in the mid 90's, and popped a couple years ago. OTHER Clinton policies have that honor.
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Reports indicate that everyone knew he was hauling a bunch of guns up there. But, since you brought it up, there's something which should be illegal: guns that breakdown.

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnWOlin View Post
    I think what is more astonishing is these billion dollar corporations that pay zero income tax. They may pay state and what not but so do I. That is the kind of stuff that needs to be stopped.
    Where do the profits come from that 'billion dollar corporations' pay zero income tax? That money originates from customers, the 99%ers. Do you really believe that these corporations will not adjust their business model to reflect a larger tax expense? And this 'adjustment' will be on who's shoulders?...Theirs or ours?

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by EarlzP View Post
    What we really want is for those who got rich by stealing from the middle class and the poor to go to jail where they belong

    Chris Hedges made this statement in New York City’s Zuccotti Park on Thursday morning during the People’s Hearing on Goldman Sachs, which he chaired with Dr. Cornel West. The activist and Truthdig columnist then joined a march of several hundred protesters to the nearby corporate headquarters of Goldman Sachs, where he was arrested with 16 others.

    Goldman Sachs, which received more subsidies and bailout-related funds than any other investment bank because the Federal Reserve permitted it to become a bank holding company under its “emergency situation,” has used billions in taxpayer money to enrich itself and reward its top executives. It handed its senior employees a staggering $18 billion in 2009, $16 billion in 2010 and $10 billion in 2011 in mega-bonuses. This massive transfer of wealth upwards by the Bush and Obama administrations, now estimated at $13 trillion to $14 trillion, went into the pockets of those who carried out fraud and criminal activity rather than the victims who lost their jobs, their savings and often their homes.

    Goldman Sachs’ commodities index is the most heavily traded in the world. Goldman Sachs hoards rice, wheat, corn, sugar and livestock and jacks up commodity prices around the globe so that poor families can no longer afford basic staples and literally starve. Goldman Sachs is able to carry out its malfeasance at home and in global markets because it has former officials filtered throughout the government and lavishly funds compliant politicians—including Barack Obama, who received $1 million from employees at Goldman Sachs in 2008 when he ran for president. These politicians, in return, permit Goldman Sachs to ignore security laws that under a functioning judiciary system would see the firm indicted for felony fraud. Or, as in the case of Bill Clinton, these politicians pass laws such as the 2000 Commodity Futures Modernization Act that effectively removed all oversight and outside control over the speculation in commodities, one of the major reasons food prices have soared. In 2008 and again in 2010 prices for crops such as rice, wheat and corn doubled and even tripled, making life precarious for hundreds of millions of people. And it was all done so a few corporate oligarchs, the 1 percent, could make personal fortunes in the tens and hundreds of millions of dollars. Despite a damning 650-page Senate subcommittee investigation report, no individual at Goldman Sachs has been indicted, although the report accuses Goldman of defrauding its clients.

    Most news sources are funded by corporations and investors. Their goal is to drive people to advertisers while pushing the corporate agenda. NationofChange is a 501(c)3 organization funded almost 100% from its readers–you! Our only accountability is to the public.

    When the government in the fall 2008 provided the firm with billions of dollars in the form of cheap loans, FDIC debt guarantees, TARP, AIG make-wholes, and a late-night label-shift from investment bank to bank holding company, giving the firm access to excessive Federal Reserve aid, access [the corporation] still has, it enabled and abetted Goldman’s criminal behavior. Goldman Sachs unloaded billions in worthless securities to its clients, decimating 401(k)s, pension and mutual funds. The firm misled investors about the true nature of these worthless securities, insisted the securities they were pushing on their clients were sound, and hid the material fact that, simultaneously, they were betting against these same securities—$2 billion against just one of their deals. The firm then had the gall to extort from its victims—us—to make good on its bets when the global economy it helped trash lost $40 trillion in worldwide wealth and huge insurance firms were unable to cover their bad debts.
    The Securities Act of 1933, established in the wake of the massive fraud that pervaded the securities market before the 1929 Crash, was written to ensure that “any securities transactions are not based on fraudulent information or practices.” The act “prohibits deceit, misrepresentation, and other fraud in the sale of securities.” The subcommittee report indicates that Goldman Sachs clearly broke security laws.

    As part of the political theater that has come to replace the legislative and judicial process, the Securities and Exchange Commission agreed to a $550 million settlement whereby Goldman Sachs admitted it showed “incomplete” information in marketing materials and that it was a “mistake” to not disclose the nature of its portfolio selection committee. This fine was a payoff to the SEC by Goldman Sachs of about four days’ worth of revenue, and in return they avoided going to court. CEO Lloyd Blankfein apparently not only lied to clients, but to the subcommittee itself on April 27, 2010, when he told lawmakers: “We didn’t have a massive short against the housing market, and we certainly did not bet against our clients.” Yet, they did.
    And yet nothing has been done. No Goldman Sachs officials have gone to trial. This is because there is no way within the corporate state to vote against the interests of Goldman Sachs. There is no way through the formal mechanisms of power to restore the rule of law. There is no way to protect the ordinary citizen and the poor around the globe from the predatory activity of financial institutions such as Goldman Sachs. Since our courts refuse to put on trial the senior executives at Goldman Sachs, including Blankfein, who carried out these crimes and lied to cover them up, we will. Speculators like those in Goldman Sachs—who in the 17th century when speculation was a crime would have been hanged—must be prevented by law from again destroying our economy, preying on ordinary citizens, hoarding food so the poor starve and running our political process. We are paying for these crimes—not those who orchestrated perhaps the most massive fraud in human history. Our teachers, police, firefighters and public employees are losing their jobs so speculators like Blankfein can make an estimated $250,000 a day. Working men and women are losing their homes and going into personal bankruptcy because they cannot pay their medical bills. Our unemployed, far closer to 20 percent than the official 9 percent, are in deep distress all so a criminal class, a few blocks from where I speak, can wallow in luxury with mansions and yachts and swollen bank accounts.

    What we are asking for today is simple—it is a return to the rule of law. And since the formal mechanisms of power refuse to restore the rule of law, then we, the 99 percent, will have to see that justice is done.
    This article was originally posted on Truthdig.
    Great post. I'm quoting it some it won't get lost. Maybe....just maybe....someone else will read it. It's long though, so most of the meat sack partisan hacks in here likely won't give it a second glance...
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Reports indicate that everyone knew he was hauling a bunch of guns up there. But, since you brought it up, there's something which should be illegal: guns that breakdown.

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by whysoserious View Post
    Doubt he said that. I doubt he was referring to those who inherit capital assets like land that require actual work for a return in investment. In fact, I would guarantee he is talking about those who live solely off interest and capital gains and then say they help they economy. There is no reason for a straw man argument - we can have this discussion without asinine assertions like that.
    Anyone who spends money helps the economy. In fact, the MORE they spend, the MORE they help. And since they don't WORK for their money, that's one less person to compete with a job over.
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Reports indicate that everyone knew he was hauling a bunch of guns up there. But, since you brought it up, there's something which should be illegal: guns that breakdown.

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    I know the stardard rhetorical argument from Conservatives/Republicans "why do you hate the rich?, why do you want to take money from wealthy people? all poor people want are hand-outs" and all the other "redistribution of wealth" arguments, but I've got news for you people. It's no longers just Warren Buffet saying "tax me! I'm good for it" to create jobs in America.

    These promonent BILLIONAIRES are also saying "TAX ME! We want to create jobs IN AMERICA because the People want...NEED to work!" Watch these video interviews given by Barbara Walters on ABC's "20/20" of BILLIONAIRES who are saying "TAX ME! CREATE JOBS IN AMERICA!" Even they agree with the Occupiers need to put America back to work!!

    Again, the Occupy Movement IS NOT anti-capitalism. It IS anti-corruption. The People just want a job and for AMERICA to get back to work!!!
    What needs to be stopped are these propaganda statements based on false assumptions. It assumes, as I'm sure has been said over and over in this thread, that more money to the government will equal more jobs. This is simply not true. The government does not create jobs- the best they can do is support the business climate by considering the best interests of the companies that CAN create jobs. They are not doing that. These spending bills are not creating jobs; they are stifling them.

    The only thing the government needs more money for is to pay the bills we already owe. When they stop the additional spending, and develop a plan to get this debt paid off, that is the only time I will support a revenue hike. And, btw, the debt can be paid off without ever raising taxes. It can be done by helping to increase the volume of business (the GDP). More customers and more sales equals more money; and more money equals more dollars paid in taxes which can then be used to reduce the deficit. The only real reason to raise taxes would be to pay the debt down faster. I would support a dedicated tax for that- as long as everyone has to pay it.

    As for these billionaires, they are well within their rights to contribute additional money. That is their choice. Don't use the opionions of a few to dictate policy or to use as a basis for your argument. My response to that argument is that I will support the right of those billionaires to pay extra. Just don't expect everyone to make that same choice.

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnWOlin View Post
    I think for all we know a lot of these much richer people are giving an extra portion to the government and just want to make sure that all rich are giving their share. I think what is more astonishing is these billion dollar corporations that pay zero income tax. They may pay state and what not but so do I. That is the kind of stuff that needs to be stopped.
    If a billion dollar corporation loses $100m in a fiscal year, should it be forced to pay taxes on its negative earnings?
    I love the smell of burning moonbat in the morning.

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