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Thread: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

  1. #111
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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by washunut View Post
    Please define "middle class" as this has very different meanings in different parts of the country. Then please tell us what the "effective" versus the marginal rate is for an average person in this middle class.

    I have no problem with the thought that there may need to be an additional bracket for the "super rich" but we should be intellectually honest in the debate. A hotshot trader on wall street who makes millions is probably paying very close to the top marginal rate, especially if he/she rents in NYC as many do. Not to mention that the top rate for a NY state resident is somewhere around 10% and there is a city income tax as well.
    "The report, by the nonpartisan Congressional Research Service, found that when all federal taxes are taken into account — including those on wages, investment income and corporate profits — some households earning more than $1 million a year paid as little as 24 percent of their income to the Internal Revenue Service in 2006.

    That’s substantially less than the share paid by many families making less than $100,000 a year that faced a top effective tax rate exceeding 26.5 percent, the report said.

    All told, 94,500 millionaires paid a smaller share of their income in taxes than 10 million households with moderate incomes, the report found."

    Report: Quarter of millionaires pay lower tax rate than some in middle class - The Washington Post
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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    As an American voter, I have the necessary standing to demand that the rich not be allowed to pay a lower tax rate on their income than the middle class.
    A lower rate, or a smaller tax bill? You may not be thrilled with the actual rate that a rich person pays on their reportable income, after deductions, but it's still a helluva lot larger actual bill than anyone in the middle class.

    If the Leftists weren't so tangled hating people with money, they could get out of the middle class's way, and allow more of them become rich; which would result in...anybody...anybody...anobody...yes, that's right more tax revenue. Yaaaaaay!
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    A lot more than we are currently not receiving due to the tax breaks. How would more revenue effect the budget? It would provide more money to pay the bills equalling less deficit spending, (See the 90's, before the most recent tax breaks for the rich)
    So you have no idea how much money would be involved or how it would effect the annual deficit, correct?

    In fact it wouldn't come close to solving the out of control annual deficit and more money would probably go offshore, the same place many businesses are also heading. There has to be some serious control over spending, though that is unlikely to happen any time soon.

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    So you have no idea how much money would be involved or how it would effect the annual deficit, correct?

    In fact it wouldn't come close to solving the out of control annual deficit and more money would probably go offshore, the same place many businesses are also heading. There has to be some serious control over spending, though that is unlikely to happen any time soon.
    "The fiscal cost of taxing long-term capital gains at a low rate amounts to $38.5 billion in fiscal year 2012 and $256.3 billion over the five-year period from fiscal 2012 through 2016, according to the Office of Management and Budget."
    10 Reasons to Eliminate the Tax Break for Capital Gains - Blog of the Century

    A 5% surtax on millionaire's as proposed by Senate Democrats would generate an additional $447 billion dollars.
    Senate Democrats Propose Millionaire Surtax

    Another $35 billion in tax subsidies to oil companies.
    Turn Off the Oil Subsidy Spigot

    And $20 billion more in direct subsidy payments to agriculture.
    Agricultural subsidy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    A quick tally shows you are already up to about $540 billion a year in additional revenues, without placing further hardship on the working class.

    I agree that we need to make big spending cuts. For the last decade, we have been spending almost as the rest of the world COMBINED on the military industrial complex. Also, we will eventually have to go with some type of UHC to lower health care costs as the rest of the industrialized world has done.
    Last edited by Catawba; 10-31-11 at 04:16 AM.
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  5. #115
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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    /wave Boeing and the military industrial complex for not being "real jobs"....
    Apples and oranges. You forget the Constitution. You are arguing over a duty the government is required to perform.
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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    "The fiscal cost of taxing long-term capital gains at a low rate amounts to $38.5 billion in fiscal year 2012 and $256.3 billion over the five-year period from fiscal 2012 through 2016, according to the Office of Management and Budget."
    10 Reasons to Eliminate the Tax Break for Capital Gains - Blog of the Century

    A 5% surtax on millionaire's as proposed by Senate Democrats would generate an additional $447 billion dollars.
    Senate Democrats Propose Millionaire Surtax

    Another $35 billion in tax subsidies to oil companies.
    Turn Off the Oil Subsidy Spigot

    And $20 billion more in direct subsidy payments to agriculture.
    Agricultural subsidy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    A quick tally shows you are already up to about $540 billion a year in additional revenues, without placing further hardship on the working class.

    I agree that we need to make big spending cuts. For the last decade, we have been spending almost as the rest of the world COMBINED on the military industrial complex. Also, we will eventually have to go with some type of UHC to lower health care costs as the rest of the industrialized world has done.
    That all sounds nice and looks good on paper, but what is the plan in the event that capital gains decrease, because the new taxes suddenly took the profit out of it and you end up with less tax revenue?

    BTW, what oil and gas subsidies? Seems to me that the, "we need more tax revenue", crowd would be more concerned about the $115 billion a year that's been lost because of the drilling bans.

    Ya know, at the end of the day, I don't disagree with the government earning more tax revenue. What bothers me, is that the Libbos don't have the first damn clue how to generate it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    /wave Boeing and the military industrial complex for not being "real jobs"....
    How much actual profit does the government see from that investment? Just give us a round number.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I know exactly what I'm talking about and it's common sense. Taxes that are paid by government employees do not create a net profit for the government. It's just common sense.
    But that's NOT what you said. You said:

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst
    You can't pay tax money with tax money and claim your paying taxes.
    Your commentary did NOT address the argument you're attempting to levy now, i.e. public employee taxation does not create a net profit for government entities. To which, I ask "how do you know this to be a fact"?

    Are you taking into consideration local, state and property taxes? Can you link to any report that supports your claim that all taxes paid by public (or federal) employees is tax neutral or comes at a lose in state/federal revenue?

    Ok. I never said any of that, anyway, so I don't know what your point is.
    Ummm...yes, you did. From your post #59 on page 6 to this thread...

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    The only way the government can see any kind of actual revenue, is when the private sector creates wealth and pays a portion of it in taxes.
    To which I responded with the sell of savings bonds by the Treasury as a way the federal government generates revenue after you went off on yet another wild tangent claiming that the "stealfromus bill" :roll raised taxes which has been proven to be false countless times. Do you still claim you never made such statements?

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    How much actual profit does the government see from that investment? Just give us a round number.
    If you really want to know, I'd suggest you ask Boeing, Rytheon, Lockhead/Martin and other such companies that accepts federal contracts for their federal tax records and see if they either paid any federal taxes or if they receive a federal tax refund. It's the only way to be sure.

    I'm just saying...

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    Re: ABC's "20/20 - Lessons from Billionaires: Tax ME to create jobs IN AMERICA!"

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    That all sounds nice and looks good on paper, but what is the plan in the event that capital gains decrease, because the new taxes suddenly took the profit out of it and you end up with less tax revenue?

    BTW, what oil and gas subsidies? Seems to me that the, "we need more tax revenue", crowd would be more concerned about the $115 billion a year that's been lost because of the drilling bans.

    Ya know, at the end of the day, I don't disagree with the government earning more tax revenue. What bothers me, is that the Libbos don't have the first damn clue how to generate it.
    I'm curious, apdst, who do you think set most of the tax policies the nation is following today? Moreover, whose tax plan is the nation following today?

    Here's a clue: They're not called "the Bush tax cuts" for nothing.

    And since Clinton didn't raise taxes nor initiate any significant changes in tax policy that I'm aware of during his tenure but both Reagan, Bush-I and Bush-II did, who do you think is/are the main drivers of our nation's current tax policy? Remember: Aside from the Bush tax cuts, our tax code has remained largely the same since...what...1986? And who was in office at the time?

    C'mon, man...stop with the talking heads rhetoric and think before you post!
    Last edited by Objective Voice; 10-31-11 at 11:55 AM.

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