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Thread: Official: U.S. pulling out all troops from Iraq

  1. #281
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    Re: Official: U.S. pulling out all troops from Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Opteron View Post
    I don't see what influence Iran would have...
    How hard have you looked?
    Quote Originally Posted by Opteron View Post
    ...what everyone's talking about Iran's influence other than their ability to commit sporadic acts of terrorism in Iraq and abroad.
    The people who are running some of Iraq's major political parties had their bread buttered for years by Iran while they lived in exile in Iran. Iran has inroads withe some of the most influential people and parties in Iraq.
    I may be wrong.

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    Re: Official: U.S. pulling out all troops from Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Antiderivative View Post
    Bush was a disaster and there is no reason to mimic him.

    Obama is only carrying through with Bush's timeline due to the fact that we mowed down innocent civilians, including women and babies. The Iraqis do not want us there. This failed neocon policy of exporting American values at the barrel of a gun is most evident.

    Obama's platform in 2008 was change, not more of the same. Unfortunately, people like you do not hold Obama to his word. They apologize for it.
    You don't want change; you only wish to critisize then stand on your partisan and count off what you consider to be mounting failures of this President. What most of the anti-Obamaites fail to realize is the depth of our nation's problems both foreign and domestic. Take the state of the economy, for instance. Had TARP included more stringent spending limits, such as not using taxpayer funds to pay bonuses and/or setting conditions that the banks had to modify certain mortgages, maybe our economy would look different today.

    Or how about having to deal with two open-ended wars once he took office?

    Or how about the tax issue? How would our economy look had the Bush tax cuts been allowed to expire on January 1 of this year? Don't you think confidence in the financial markets and private sector would have been more firmly established had tax policy been set then considering that it would have been approximately 5 years before wholesale changes in the tax code would take effect again (re: health care reform)?

    These are the things most people don't talk about because most of have a microview of our national politics. Personally, I try not to get too caught up in the short-term view.

  3. #283
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    Re: Official: U.S. pulling out all troops from Iraq

    Am I the only one here who's confused that this thread is not one big celebration? We're finally coming home, for god's sake! One pointless war down, one to go!
    "A man you can bait with a tweet is not a man we can trust with nuclear weapons." --Hillary Rodham Clinton
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    Re: Official: U.S. pulling out all troops from Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Phys251 View Post
    Am I the only one here who's confused that this thread is not one big celebration? We're finally coming home, for god's sake! One pointless war down, one to go!
    Exactly!

    Let me help those who are still confused or resentful to understand...

    President Obama was just on the Tonight Show and stated the cost of both the Iraq War and our involvement in Libya's civil war:

    Iraq = upwards of $1 trillion; 4,000 American servicemen killed; thousands more wounded.

    Libya = under $1 billion; 0 American servicemen killed; none injured

    We already know from news articles linked in this thread that former President GW Bush arranged to have our troops withdraw from Iraq this year. We acknowledge that President Obama was merely following through on policies as set by his predecessor. If you're pissed off at President Obama for bringing our troops home as scheduled, why then aren't you pissed off at former President Bush for setting the deadline? After all, weren't we suppose to be spreading domacracy, helping to establish a government that was strong enough to lead it's people and do the will of its people, as well as what they believe is in the best interest of their country? Let's get back to this one...

    For those who think it should matter that President Obama publisized the date for withdraw, I ask you why should it? After all, if we're helping to establish a government that believes in democracy, does not democracy involve honoring freedom of speech as well as freedom of the press? And if so, should not our withdraw date already be established information in Iraq since it's information the heads of state from both nations already know? In other words, don't you think Iraq's President informed his countrymen about our eventual withdrawl long ago?

    Getting back to the cost of the war, Tea Partiers are complaining about out of control federal spending. Why then would you be upset about keeping our Armed Forces in Iraq knowing how much it cost? Remember: We had to borrow that money! You bitched about raising the debt limit; you should be jumping for joy - dancing a jig!! - because we're leaving and we won't have to lose...er, um...spend any more money in a war that was declared "Mission Accomplished" SEVEN YEARS AGO!!!

    $1,000,000,000,000 (TRILLION) U.S. DOLLARS OF B-O-R-R-O-W-E-D M-O-N-E-Y!!! Let that sink in for a minute...

    No...it's not quite there yet...imbedded in your cerebelum. You need a reminder of how much more cost effective a Z-E-R-O CASUALTY RATE war really costs our government using the most sophisticated weaponry and the most highly trained Special Operations Force can be: $1,000,000,000 (BILLION).

    One more time...

    $1,000,000,000,000 (Trillion)
    $1,000,000,000 (Billion)

    We claim to want to spread democracy, but when the country we claim to have "liberated" from dictatorship actually exercises its maturity and shows its ability to self-govern, suddenly we don't like that?

    YOU FREAKING HYPERCRITES!!!

    This is why President Obama will get my vote. Because he completed the mission! We meet our ultimate objective: to remove Saddam Hussein from power. We overstayed our welcome because Bush did not have an effective exit strategy. He failed to follow the advice of his former Secretary of Defense, Collen Powell to "security the [population] people". Because of this, the insurgency insued and we've spent the last seven years fighting against that instead of leaving when Bush proclaimed the job was over. Not only that, but we never did find those weapons of mass destruction Bush said Saddam was hidding.

    To those who are so concerned about more insurgency or Iraq being influenced by another Muslim/Islamist nation, let me ask you this: What does that say about the part of the war on terror in general? One of the underlying reasons we went to Iraq was to keep terrorist from working with Saddam's government. If you really think that little of the newly elected government Bush helped to usher in, what does that say about his ability to "spread domacracy"? Should Iraq rapidly fall into alliance with an unfriendly nation to the U.S., wouldn't that mean former President Bush failed us? Who then is more a failure at being President?

    THINK PEOPLE!!!

    It's beyond time for our men and women to come home. You should be applauding this President for completing the job, not critizing him. And if Iraq doesn't want the continued protection of our military, if it has determined that part of demostrating a show of democracy in action is to obey the wishes of the democratic government you helped set in place, then you leave. To his credit, President Obama tried to negotiate keeping our troops there longer, but Iraq said no deal. So, why should we stay?
    Last edited by Objective Voice; 10-26-11 at 03:21 AM.

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    Re: Official: U.S. pulling out all troops from Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    Iran has a population of around 70 million, Iraq, the Gulf state, Turkey, Egypt combined have around triple that. Saudi Arabia has a far higher military budget, far more modern equipment (jets, and tanks), so does Turkey.

    Iran is not going to take over the middle east. It doesnt have the military capacity to do so. It cant stop the PJAK/PKK terrorists or the Balochi terrorists within its own country, imagine the difficulty it will face if it invade Iraq. At most Iran will follow the same policies it has of supporting local groups as proxies and have influence rather then control
    Iran doesn't need to invade Iraq to take control, nor does it need to invade Libya, Egypt or any ME country. Using the military is a rather old fashioned way to win a war. They will soon have nukes and that threat, along with acts of terrorism and assassinations, will be sufficient.

    The United States has the most powerful military and the greatest stockpile of weapons in the world and yet few fear them because everyone knows they lack the resolve to win. Their bragging rights in Libya (and Qaddafi had become a friend of the US in recent years) is that no American got hurt. They now fight a war where, like politically correct sports teams, no one keeps score.

    The Death of the Grown-Up | Diana West > Home - Qaddafi's Death Leaves Me Cold: Why?

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    Re: Official: U.S. pulling out all troops from Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Exactly!

    Let me help those who are still confused or resentful to understand...

    President Obama was just on the Tonight Show and stated the cost of both the Iraq War and our involvement in Libya's civil war:

    Iraq = upwards of $1 trillion; 4,000 American servicemen killed; thousands more wounded.

    Libya = under $1 billion; 0 American servicemen killed; none injured

    We already know from news articles linked in this thread that former President GW Bush arranged to have our troops withdraw from Iraq this year. We acknowledge that President Obama was merely following through on policies as set by his predecessor. If you're pissed off at President Obama for bringing our troops home as scheduled, why then aren't you pissed off at former President Bush for setting the deadline? After all, weren't we suppose to be spreading domacracy, helping to establish a government that was strong enough to lead it's people and do the will of its people, as well as what they believe is in the best interest of their country? Let's get back to this one...

    For those who think it should matter that President Obama publisized the date for withdraw, I ask you why should it? After all, if we're helping to establish a government that believes in democracy, does not democracy involve honoring freedom of speech as well as freedom of the press? And if so, should not our withdraw date already be established information in Iraq since it's information the heads of state from both nations already know? In other words, don't you think Iraq's President informed his countrymen about our eventual withdrawl long ago?

    Getting back to the cost of the war, Tea Partiers are complaining about out of control federal spending. Why then would you be upset about keeping our Armed Forces in Iraq knowing how much it cost? Remember: We had to borrow that money! You bitched about raising the debt limit; you should be jumping for joy - dancing a jig!! - because we're leaving and we won't have to lose...er, um...spend any more money in a war that was declared "Mission Accomplished" SEVEN YEARS AGO!!!

    $1,000,000,000,000 (TRILLION) U.S. DOLLARS OF B-O-R-R-O-W-E-D M-O-N-E-Y!!! Let that sink in for a minute...

    No...it's not quite there yet...imbedded in your cerebelum. You need a reminder of how much more cost effective a Z-E-R-O CASUALTY RATE war really costs our government using the most sophisticated weaponry and the most highly trained Special Operations Force can be: $1,000,000,000 (BILLION).

    One more time...

    $1,000,000,000,000 (Trillion)
    $1,000,000,000 (Billion)

    We claim to want to spread democracy, but when the country we claim to have "liberated" from dictatorship actually exercises its maturity and shows its ability to self-govern, suddenly we don't like that?

    YOU FREAKING HYPERCRITES!!!

    This is why President Obama will get my vote. Because he completed the mission! We meet our ultimate objective: to remove Saddam Hussein from power. We overstayed our welcome because Bush did not have an effective exit strategy. He failed to follow the advice of his former Secretary of Defense, Collen Powell to "security the [population] people". Because of this, the insurgency insued and we've spent the last seven years fighting against that instead of leaving when Bush proclaimed the job was over. Not only that, but we never did find those weapons of mass destruction Bush said Saddam was hidding.

    To those who are so concerned about more insurgency or Iraq being influenced by another Muslim/Islamist nation, let me ask you this: What does that say about the part of the war on terror in general? One of the underlying reasons we went to Iraq was to keep terrorist from working with Saddam's government. If you really think that little of the newly elected government Bush helped to usher in, what does that say about his ability to "spread domacracy"? Should Iraq rapidly fall into alliance with an unfriendly nation to the U.S., wouldn't that mean former President Bush failed us? Who then is more a failure at being President?

    THINK PEOPLE!!!

    It's beyond time for our men and women to come home. You should be applauding this President for completing the job, not critizing him. And if Iraq doesn't want the continued protection of our military, if it has determined that part of demostrating a show of democracy in action is to obey the wishes of the democratic government you helped set in place, then you leave. To his credit, President Obama tried to negotiate keeping our troops there longer, but Iraq said no deal. So, why should we stay?
    It seems the cost eight years of the Iraq War was equal to Barrack Obama's stimulus package, or the money given to useless solar energy companies. And while Obama is sticking to the George Bush timetable we do not know if George Bush would have left while the country was still under threat.

    It seems that all this money and worse, all the lives sacrificed, have been in vain. This is no "exit strategy". It is just an exit.

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    Re: Official: U.S. pulling out all troops from Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    It seems the cost eight years of the Iraq War was equal to Barrack Obama's stimulus package, or the money given to useless solar energy companies. And while Obama is sticking to the George Bush timetable we do not know if George Bush would have left while the country was still under threat.

    It seems that all this money and worse, all the lives sacrificed, have been in vain. This is no "exit strategy". It is just an exit.
    He did accept the agreement. Remember, this is largely what Iraqis want. Why would we impose ourself on them? Isn't it kind of arrogant on our part?

    Bottom line, this is the agreement. Iraq never could ahve ever really been worth what was paid for it, not by us, not by the coalition, and damn sure not what was apid by the Iraqis. So I agree we shoudl be celebrating that that many will be coming home. Amen. God bless them all.

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  8. #288
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    Re: Official: U.S. pulling out all troops from Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    He did accept the agreement. Remember, this is largely what Iraqis want. Why would we impose ourself on them? Isn't it kind of arrogant on our part?
    We seem to like imposing ourselves over others. We do it a lot. Look at all the freedom and democracy we've brought places (though I'm still not sure as to where in the Constitution our government was charged with bringing "freedom and democracy" to the rest of the world...and can we get paid for it? This ****'s expensive.)!

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Bottom line, this is the agreement. Iraq never could ahve ever really been worth what was paid for it, not by us, not by the coalition, and damn sure not what was apid by the Iraqis. So I agree we shoudl be celebrating that that many will be coming home. Amen. God bless them all.
    So long as they aren't being redeployed elsewhere. It's time to stop expensive Forever War; we're broke bitches.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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    Re: Official: U.S. pulling out all troops from Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    He did accept the agreement. Remember, this is largely what Iraqis want. Why would we impose ourself on them? Isn't it kind of arrogant on our part?

    Bottom line, this is the agreement. Iraq never could ahve ever really been worth what was paid for it, not by us, not by the coalition, and damn sure not what was apid by the Iraqis. So I agree we shoudl be celebrating that that many will be coming home. Amen. God bless them all.
    Are the Americans leaving Iraq because they may appear "arrogant" to the Iraqi people? They don;t appear concerned about the charge of "arrogance" with their trrops stationed in other far less troubled areas of the world.

    Iraq is not ready to stand on its own against external threats. That should be clear. This will be just another war where, because of political posturing, American lives have been sacrificed for nothing.

    Yes, God bless the troops, all of them. But this was a political decision, not a military or strategic decision. Bush made a foolish decision in announcing when troops would leave and Obama made an ever worse decision by following through with this, knowing what will probably follow.

    That handshake of Obama with Gadaffi should become as popular as the one with Rumsfeld and Saddam Hussein.


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    Re: Official: U.S. pulling out all troops from Iraq

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    We seem to like imposing ourselves over others. We do it a lot. Look at all the freedom and democracy we've brought places (though I'm still not sure as to where in the Constitution our government was charged with bringing "freedom and democracy" to the rest of the world...and can we get paid for it? This ****'s expensive.)!

    So long as they aren't being redeployed elsewhere. It's time to stop expensive Forever War; we're broke bitches.
    There's a good argument for American isolationism because too many American lives and much American treasure have been lost protecting often unworthy allies, and long after they are no longer necessary. But in order to move toward isolationism, national borders should first be protected. One policy appears to contradict the other.

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