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Thread: Windmills stopped at night after bat death

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    Re: Windmills stopped at night after bat death

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Beats all the other scams we invest in. At least this one gets us clean power. Better that than, say, another $300 million fighter plane built for a war that will never be fought.
    And you know this how?
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
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    Re: Windmills stopped at night after bat death

    I see it now. Windmills, soon to be an endangered species.

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    Re: Windmills stopped at night after bat death

    Quote Originally Posted by bicycleman View Post
    I see it now. Windmills, soon to be an endangered species.
    They must be protected.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

  4. #44
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    Re: Windmills stopped at night after bat death

    Other than the slicing and dicing of endangered species not to mention all the regular birds, windmills can make lots of clean electricity. Catch is though, the wind doesn't always blow so you need the old reliable fossil fuel power plants right beside them ready to go. Catch with this is these things can't sit idly by unmanned and unpowered ready to go at a moments notice. They have to be up and running 24-7 so the windmills are basically just expensive and unreliable extra electricity. The fossil fuel plants need to be able to provide 100% of the power needed when the winds not blowing so the windmills become rather redundant.

  5. #45
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    Re: Windmills stopped at night after bat death

    Quote Originally Posted by Reg View Post
    It's a scam. It's been an underachiever in every country it's been tried.
    "Underachiever" how? Because one windmill plant or one solar plant didn't solve the WHOLE problem? C'mon man!

    Quote Originally Posted by Reg View Post
    Build a bunch with your own money and get back to us.
    Part of the reason I know about this stuff is I'm researching how to EXACTLY THAT, but on a seriously limited budget. I want in on this goldmine before the "big guys" wake up and get their thumb out of their a**.

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtpoorchris View Post
    I wonder if this method is legit or a scam

    Seems better than burning garbage for steam power. :p
    [...]
    (no this isnt free energy, over-unity or whatever you call it)
    You're right, it's not free. There's no such thing as free energy. You always gotta spend energy to get energy. But this is certainly better than throwing it all in a hole and covering it up. This kind of forward thinking is what I expect from the US, what we're famous for. That's why I have no patience for those communist pansies who are always crying, "oh wee wee, it can't be done. It's too hard." Bull****! Americans CAN DO it and Americans WILL DO it. Mark my word.
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  6. #46
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    Re: Windmills stopped at night after bat death

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtpoorchris View Post
    I wonder how many people would be willing to shutdown a major freeway because of a dead animal.
    Stop with the logic already.

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    Re: Windmills stopped at night after bat death

    Quote Originally Posted by sawyerloggingon View Post
    Other than the slicing and dicing of endangered species not to mention all the regular birds, windmills can make lots of clean electricity. Catch is though, the wind doesn't always blow so you need the old reliable fossil fuel power plants right beside them ready to go. Catch with this is these things can't sit idly by unmanned and unpowered ready to go at a moments notice. They have to be up and running 24-7 so the windmills are basically just expensive and unreliable extra electricity. The fossil fuel plants need to be able to provide 100% of the power needed when the winds not blowing so the windmills become rather redundant.
    Not exacty redundant because although we still need 100% capacity for when the wind power is not available we don't provide 100% of the power all of the time and therefore save fuel which is what this is all about anyway. Though I agree it is not nearly the savings that make it viable economically.

    As an electrical engineer alternative energy has always fascinated me. Love the idea of harnessing the wind or the sun to provide power. But I am well aware of the practicality of doing so. Technology and necessity have to evolve. I don't mind a few grand experiments to prove or disprove the worth of wind power. Hell, look at the money we used to explore space. The use of wind power will grow but I don't see it ever being a major contributor. If it got up to 10% I think that would be amazing. A big country like the U.S. needs a big power source. Nuclear seems to be the only viable source to replace coal, oil and natural gas. I think we can only use wind a solar as a supplement to that and we should.

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    Re: Windmills stopped at night after bat death

    Quote Originally Posted by jambalaya View Post
    The use of wind power will grow but I don't see it ever being a major contributor. If it got up to 10% I think that would be amazing. A big country like the U.S. needs a big power source. Nuclear seems to be the only viable source to replace coal, oil and natural gas. I think we can only use wind a solar as a supplement to that and we should.
    I believe the opposite. Wind, Solar, Tidal should be the primary supplier with oil and natural gas and Thorium nuclear as the backup. When AE (Alternative Energy) is unable to meet the load demand, more traditional systems can take up the slack. Traditional energy relies on depletable energy sources, so these sources should be used sparingly and only when really needed. That's why traditional energy should be the backup, not the other way around.

    The big issue with AE is storage, which more than one person has pointed out in this thread. Folks are right to bring it up. Well there's many ways to handle that problem. The kneejerk solution people suggest is batteries. I think that's fine for cars, but I hate it as a grid solution. The best battery tech we have requires Lithium, and that's another finite resource, which puts us back where we started. So I say, leave the Lithium for cars (until we find a better idea) and apply different solutions for grid storage. Here's some ideas:

    First, battery solutions are getting better all the time:
    Battery Technology - Galvanic cells that store chemical energy

    Next, here's a top-level "executive view" of many AE storage solutions (settle in, there's LOTS of them):
    Energy storage - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Here's another one:
    Energy Storage Industry Grows To Integrate Wind, Solar | Renewable Energy News Article

    My favorites are:

    Hydro-electric storage (Water):
    Grid energy storage - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Pumped-storage hydroelectricity - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Since the best wind is in the mid-west and most of the mid-west is flatter than a pancake, hydro-electric may not be the best solution.

    So then you use...Air (compressed that is):
    Compressed air energy storage - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Last edited by EagleAye; 10-20-11 at 02:05 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by spud_meister View Post
    Nuclear does.
    Not when you include the energy embedded in the massive amounts of concrete and steel needed for a reactor and the energy costs of uranium extraction and isotopic fractionation.

    Not that I am anti-nuke mind you. It makes a hell of a lot more sense than hare-brained corn ethanol, for example.
    Last edited by nijato; 10-20-11 at 03:47 PM.
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  10. #50
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    Re: Windmills stopped at night after bat death

    Quote Originally Posted by EagleAye View Post

    You're right, it's not free. There's no such thing as free energy. You always gotta spend energy to get energy. But this is certainly better than throwing it all in a hole and covering it up. This kind of forward thinking is what I expect from the US, what we're famous for. That's why I have no patience for those communist pansies who are always crying, "oh wee wee, it can't be done. It's too hard." Bull****! Americans CAN DO it and Americans WILL DO it. Mark my word.
    My thoughts exactly. Why have landfills and such when we could be super compressing and seperating fuel from almost ANY waste? Aside from recyclables.

    Supposedly the energy made from this process is self sufficiant and this plant could completely run itself on trash. Ive seen people stick trash into gaint furnaces and harness steam power. But this seems far better than that. (BTW, inspecting metal integrity inside a gaint burnt trash furnace IS NOT FUN)
    Last edited by dirtpoorchris; 10-20-11 at 04:05 PM.
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