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Thread: Occupy Wall Street protesters refuse to leave for park cleaning

  1. #151
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    Re: Occupy Wall Street protesters refuse to leave for park cleaning

    They cleaned the park last night rather than face eviction due to health concerns. I actually think that is kind of cute.
    (avatar by Thomas Nast)

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    Re: Occupy Wall Street protesters refuse to leave for park cleaning

    I posted this quote in another thread, but I want to put it here too because I think it's important and was wise beyond its years.

    “I apprehend no danger to our country from a foreign foe . . . Our destruction, should it come at all, will be from another quarter. From the inattention of the people to the concerns of their government, from their carelessness and negligence, I must confess that I do apprehend some danger. I fear that they may place too implicit a confidence in their public servants, and fail properly to scrutinize their conduct; that in this way they may be made the dupes of designing men, and become the instruments of their own undoing. Make them intelligent, and they will be vigilant; give them the means of detecting the wrong, and they will apply the remedy.”
    ― Daniel Webster

    What I see in the protest isn't a large group of whiners looking for free handouts. Perhaps there are those in the group whom are like that, but I think the overall has a valid point. Finally we see a large scale group of people stand up and say "NO! I do not want to be made the dupe! I will not become the instrument of my own undoing! This is my Republic damned it, and I'm going to have my say!" Stand up and critique, come forward and dissent! We have closed our eyes for too long towards the concerns of the government. We HAVE placed too much implicit faith in our public servants and we are paying the price. But if you feel that this Republic is worth the fight, if you believe that it's worth keeping, then you HAVE to do SOMETHING. You can no longer sit back watching reality TV and believing that nothing that happens outside has an impact on you. We as a People must teach government who is in charge.

    For too long we have allowed them their way. We let them go, and look at what it has brought us. Wars in every region of the globe, expansive state building and interventionism, a corporate capitalist model which crushes economic mobility and free market principles, a failing economy, huge unemployment. Look what they've done to our shining city on the hill, the beacon and example of freedom and liberty to the world. How they've tarnished it so! And when the **** hit the fan, who did government help out? Us? No, it was the very corporations and banks and hedge funders who caused the problem. The "real" leaders of the government. I'm not the smartest man out there, I'm simply a man who loves his freedom and aim to keep it. I want more protest and more dissent, it warms my heart to see people take a stand. I may not agree with it, but so long as we can protest and dissent, so long as our voices can be heard, so long as we educate ourselves towards the concerns of government and move to protect ourselves from its overreaching grasp, we can remain free. You don't stay free by sitting on your ass, it takes continual energy to keep and maintain, infinite input from day to day, week to week, year to year, decade to decade.

    This is a Republic, if you can keep it.
    Last edited by Ikari; 10-14-11 at 05:06 PM.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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  3. #153
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    Re: Occupy Wall Street protesters refuse to leave for park cleaning

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    I posted this quote in another thread, but I want to put it here too because I think it's important and was wise beyond its years.

    “I apprehend no danger to our country from a foreign foe . . . Our destruction, should it come at all, will be from another quarter. From the inattention of the people to the concerns of their government, from their carelessness and negligence, I must confess that I do apprehend some danger. I fear that they may place too implicit a confidence in their public servants, and fail properly to scrutinize their conduct; that in this way they may be made the dupes of designing men, and become the instruments of their own undoing. Make them intelligent, and they will be vigilant; give them the means of detecting the wrong, and they will apply the remedy.”
    ― Daniel Webster

    What I see in the protest isn't a large group of whiners looking for free handouts. Perhaps there are those in the group whom are like that, but I think the overall has a valid point. Finally we see a large scale group of people stand up and say "NO! I do not want to be made the dupe! I will not become the instrument of my own undoing! This is my Republic damned it, and I'm going to have my say!" Stand up and critique, come forward and dissent! We have closed our eyes for too long towards the concerns of the government. We HAVE placed too much implicit faith in our public servants and we are paying the price. But if you feel that this Republic is worth the fight, if you believe that it's worth keeping, then you HAVE to do SOMETHING. You can no longer sit back watching reality TV and believing that nothing that happens outside has an impact on you. We as a People must teach government who is in charge.

    For too long we have allowed them their way. We let them go, and look at what it has brought us. Wars in every region of the globe, expansive state building and interventionism, a corporate capitalist model which crushes economic mobility and free market principles, a failing economy, huge unemployment. And when the **** hit the fan, who did government help out? Us? No, it was the very corporations and banks and hedge funders who caused the problem. The "real" leaders of the government. I'm not the smartest man out there, I'm simply a man who loves his freedom and aim to keep it. I want more protest and more dissent, it warms my heart to see people take a stand. I may not agree with it, but so long as we can protest and dissent, so long as our voices can be heard, so long as we educate ourselves towards the concerns of government and move to protect ourselves from its overreaching grasp, we can remain free. You don't stay free by sitting on your ass, it takes continual energy to keep and maintain, infinite input from day to day, week to week, year to year, decade to decade.

    This is a Republic, if you can keep it.
    Except that this group is not protesting government. Not trying to show government "who is in charge". This group actually advocates larger government. This group advocates a larger government that will redistribute more wealth .......... from others to them. Their claim about corporations and "the rich" having too much money or influence is only so as to raise already highly progressive tax rates even higher. They do not advoacate the repeal of all the Bush Tax Cuts, but only those on the high end.

    The Tea Party is the group taking government back. Tangible and measureable results were scene in Nov 2010. These OWS folks are all phoney baloney astro-turf free-loaders. I suggest they find work.

  4. #154
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    Re: Occupy Wall Street protesters refuse to leave for park cleaning

    Quote Originally Posted by Eighty Deuce View Post
    Actually, I suspect more along the lines of tresspassing, obstruction of traffic, vandalism, destruction of property, and actual assault ..... etc.

    I do not see those as lines drawn against excesses in freedom of speech. To put it as you did is too noble IMMHO.
    The first two could certainly represent a reasonable limitation on speech.

    The other three represent simple criminality.

    Time will tell.
    Anyone wondering what I'm talking about start here:
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  5. #155
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    Re: Occupy Wall Street protesters refuse to leave for park cleaning

    Quote Originally Posted by Eighty Deuce View Post
    Except that this group is not protesting government. Not trying to show government "who is in charge". This group actually advocates larger government. This group advocates a larger government that will redistribute more wealth .......... from others to them. Their claim about corporations and "the rich" having too much money or influence is only so as to raise already highly progressive tax rates even higher. They do not advoacate the repeal of all the Bush Tax Cuts, but only those on the high end.

    The Tea Party is the group taking government back. Tangible and measureable results were scene in Nov 2010. These OWS folks are all phoney baloney astro-turf free-loaders. I suggest they find work.
    The tea party wants less government where it doesn't like it, more where it likes it. They ain't so different. But I like to see them protest too. I like protest and dissent, it's a necessary exercise to maintain and keep the Republic. Even OWS serves that purpose. They may not call for the direction I would call for, which would be the restoration of free market. But they are out there and they are making their presence known, and they are rallying against the entanglement of government and market.

    This is what's necessary to keep the Republic. Dissent and protest are good and healthy and must be allowed.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  6. #156
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    Re: Occupy Wall Street protesters refuse to leave for park cleaning

    Quote Originally Posted by Krhazy View Post
    They cleaned the park last night rather than face eviction due to health concerns. I actually think that is kind of cute.
    It also shows that they are more than the mindless mob that many here want to portray them as.

  7. #157
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    Re: Occupy Wall Street protesters refuse to leave for park cleaning

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    It also shows that they are more than the mindless mob that many here want to portray them as.
    Its actually kind of funny that there are two contradictory memes coming out of the conservative media stream.

    One that they are an irrelevant mob of ignorant kids who want handouts.

    And a second where its a secret astroturf operation to a) get Obama re-elected or b) destroy our government and install communism in its place or c) insert nefarious left wing plot of choice.

    I'm sure cognitive dissonance is resulting in profits for the makers of Motrin.
    Anyone wondering what I'm talking about start here:
    The Psychology of Persuasion

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    Re: Occupy Wall Street protesters refuse to leave for park cleaning

    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    Its actually kind of funny that there are two contradictory memes coming out of the conservative media stream.

    One that they are an irrelevant mob of ignorant kids who want handouts.

    And a second where its a secret astroturf operation to a) get Obama re-elected or b) destroy our government and install communism in its place or c) insert nefarious left wing plot of choice.

    I'm sure cognitive dissonance is resulting in profits for the makers of Motrin.
    Someone should create a poll on this question!

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    Re: Occupy Wall Street protesters refuse to leave for park cleaning

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    someone should create a poll on this question!
    Agreed!

    I pick b!

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    Re: Occupy Wall Street protesters refuse to leave for park cleaning

    Quote Originally Posted by Free For All View Post
    Agreed!

    I pick b!
    Well here is a poll for you young man

    http://www.debatepolitics.com/polls/...rotestors.html

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