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Thread: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires (Continued)

  1. #171
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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires (Continued)

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbuti View Post
    Wrong, Con, that is not my opinion ... it's what happened. Within the first 3 months of 2006, we had hit a historic high foreclosure rate ...

    Foreclosure Rate Hits Historic High

    The percentage of U.S. mortgages entering foreclosure in the first three months of the year was the highest in more than 50 years, according to the Mortgage Bankers Association.

    As the association released its numbers, the Federal Reserve held a hearing to determine whether regulators could do anything to crack down on abusive lending practices, which have exacerbated the problem

    The problems arose last year as the housing market softened, driving down home prices and making it more difficult for cash-strapped borrowers to sell their homes or refinance their way out of trouble.

    The most dramatic fallout took place in the subprime market, which caters to people with blemished credit or other factors that make them a risk to lenders.

    You can't blame that on Obama. You can't blame that on Democrats. Where's your outrage at Bush? Where's your outrage at Republicans?

    "Thanks to our policies, home ownership in America is at an all-time high." ~ George Bush, 9.2.2004, RNC acceptance speech


    In case you didn't notice, you didn't answer the question ... how much of the FY2009 debt do you attribute to Obama?


    Umm, he's lost fewer jobs than Bush and Reagan lost by this point and they both had experience.



    Actually, you lied about that too. You claimed you voted for Kennedy until I pointed out you aren't old enough to have voted for him. And since you turned into a Conservative, you have voted strictly for Republican presidents, so yes, all that matters to you is that the candidate put an "R" after their name.
    Obama isn't going to get my vote so maybe you ought to work on the other 55% or so that have stated that say he isn't doing a good job.

    As for the 2009 deficit, since it was a Democratic budget and Obama had his department heads in charge, all of it will be charged to him. When you accept responsibility for the job, you accept responsibility for the results. That is how leadership works.

    Never said I voted for Kennedy, I played Kennedy in the 1960 Civics class. Did you ever take civics? I did vote for Humphrey in 1968, Carter in 1976.

  2. #172
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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires (Continued)

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbuti View Post
    Again, why are you comparing 1988 dollars with 2011 dollars? You "claim" to be business savyy but I fail to see the evidence in such a claim when you can't even understand the difference between nominal figures and real figures.
    Because we pay debt service on the 1.7 trillion dollars not the value of that dollar today.

  3. #173
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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires (Continued)

    Obama isn't going to get my vote so maybe you ought to work on the other 55% or so that have stated that say he isn't doing a good job.
    You haven't made a very compelling argument as to why he isn't getting your vote...

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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires (Continued)

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    So 1.7 trillion is more than 4 trillion because it is a 300% increase? That must be liberal logic
    I don't know what kind of logic you are trying to use but it is hilarious watching ya squirm around.

    Again, riddle me this where would the debt be should Obama TRIPLE the debt?

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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires (Continued)

    Quote Originally Posted by Jryan View Post
    You haven't made a very compelling argument as to why he isn't getting your vote...
    Doubt that I could ever make a valid argument to the brainwashed but the economic results and massive attempts at redistribution of wealth along with class warfare certainly have made my decision for me. I won't vote for a leftwing radical that doesn't have a clue how to manage anything. When he learns to accept responsibility for his own failures then that will be the first step towards gaining support.

    Obama economic results in 2011, .4% GDP and 1.3% GDP growth in 2011, 25+ million unemployed or under employed Americans in 2011, 4 trillion added to the debt in less than 3 years, and a downgrade of the U.S. credit rating. Rising Misery index 7.83 to 12.67. 38-41% JAR and well over 50-55% disapproval ratings.

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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires (Continued)

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Doubt that I could ever make a valid argument to the brainwashed but the economic results and massive attempts at redistribution of wealth along with class warfare certainly have made my decision for me. I won't vote for a leftwing radical that doesn't have a clue how to manage anything. When he learns to accept responsibility for his own failures then that will be the first step towards gaining support.

    Obama economic results in 2011, .4% GDP and 1.3% GDP growth in 2011, 25+ million unemployed or under employed Americans in 2011, 4 trillion added to the debt in less than 3 years, and a downgrade of the U.S. credit rating. Rising Misery index 7.83 to 12.67. 38-41% JAR and well over 50-55% disapproval ratings.
    You have successfully ignored our LOGIC on the data presented once again.

  7. #177
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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires (Continued)

    I have a question for both the conservatives, and the liberals here. The subject is simple...the US can't afford to pay it's bills. So, where are we going to get the money?

    Are we going to get that money by slashing services offered, but NOT slashing the taxes to go to pay for those services, thereby forcing citizens to pay for services they neither can, nor will, ever receive? Is THAT you're answer? That's what cutting spending alone amounts to, without a corresponding cut in taxes and fees.

    Or do we instead increase the taxes levied on all the people of this country, without increasing the goods and services we receive? If MY taxes go up, I want something for it. My car payments don't suddenly rise, with nothing to show. If MY taxes go up, i want foodstamps, free child care programs, SOMETHING. Make no mistake, a tax on one group is a tax on all. If MY taxes go up, as a middle classer, I can no longer afford the lifestyle I have, and will cut back on my spending. Multiply that across the board, and what you have, is less purchasing power in the hands of americans. So, we tax the rich, instead, right? They've got plenty to give. But they are going to do the same thing I would, plus one. They are going to protect themselves from that additional cost of living in this country, believe me. It's going to come in the form of increases in products and services offered by the companies those people own, and it's going to come in the form of, if rich guy brings home 400,000 less this year, he's not going to be buying that sweet Porsche GT3 this year. Less money in the market always means a poorer market. There is no escaping this.

    So then, you have to have a combo of both tax hikes, AND slash the budget. What you have there is, we pay more, and get less. Keep doing that, and you might just find people leaving this country for other places, even though those taxes are likely the same, or higher. But at least there, you get stuff for your money.

    And NONE of these solutions addresses the real problem. The REAL PROBLEM IS, we spend more than we make. I would say that is the case for most all americans today. Show me debt free americans, and I'll show you people that haven't left their mother's house yet. Our elected officials to do the same, only there's no credit agency hanging over their head, hounding them with phone calls for bills unpaid. Hell, when they max THEIR credit out, all the gotta do is get together, take a vote, and increase their credit limit again. Wish I could do that with MY card. Ask yourselves, all of you...when did that happen? When did it become OK for congress to spend more than they take in? We look at our private sector businesses that did that these past 10 years with frowns, and say "She's a WITCH, BURN HER!!!", but at the end of the day, they were only ever following the lead of the highest offices in the land. A boss leads by example, and who is the president and his/her staff, if not the boss?

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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires (Continued)

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Obama economic results in 2011, .4% GDP and 1.3% GDP growth in 2011, 25+ million unemployed or under employed Americans in 2011, 4 trillion added to the debt in less than 3 years, and a downgrade of the U.S. credit rating. Rising Misery index 7.83 to 12.67. 38-41% JAR and well over 50-55% disapproval ratings.
    Woooo Hoo we got the copy and paste going again

    Jryan expect to see this a few more times tonight from con.

  9. #179
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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires (Continued)

    Quote Originally Posted by Jryan View Post
    You have successfully ignored our LOGIC on the data presented once again.

    Apparently they don't teach logic in school these dayss. You have offered no logic at all.

  10. #180
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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires (Continued)

    KevinKohler;1059864379]I have a question for both the conservatives, and the liberals here. The subject is simple...the US can't afford to pay it's bills. So, where are we going to get the money?
    I will take a crack at that. Since we have a 14.8 trillion dollar debt there isn't enough money in the country to pay that off so the best way to solve the problem is to grow your way out of this debt

    Are we going to get that money by slashing services offered, but NOT slashing the taxes to go to pay for those services, thereby forcing citizens to pay for services they neither can, nor will, ever receive? Is THAT you're answer? That's what cutting spending alone amounts to, without a corresponding cut in taxes and fees.
    Cutting services? What services are the role of the Federal Govt? Why do we have so many duplicated expenses then at the state level if all those so called services are handled by the Federal Govt. Next we need to explain to everyone what the various taxes go for and then get the Federal Govt. down to the level it belongs, about 1.5 trillion a year not the current 3.7 trillion dollar budget. Take SS off budget and put it back where it belongs, intergovt. holdings and keep it there. Raise the retirement age to 67 and then start repaying the IOU's in that account with the surplus that increased retirement age will generate. I have posted here what the budget would look like but you need to start with 2008 budget and start cutting from there.

    Or do we instead increase the taxes levied on all the people of this country, without increasing the goods and services we receive? If MY taxes go up, I want something for it. My car payments don't suddenly rise, with nothing to show. If MY taxes go up, i want foodstamps, free child care programs, SOMETHING. Make no mistake, a tax on one group is a tax on all. If MY taxes go up, as a middle classer, I can no longer afford the lifestyle I have, and will cut back on my spending. Multiply that across the board, and what you have, is less purchasing power in the hands of americans. So, we tax the rich, instead, right? They've got plenty to give. But they are going to do the same thing I would, plus one. They are going to protect themselves from that additional cost of living in this country, believe me. It's going to come in the form of increases in products and services offered by the companies those people own, and it's going to come in the form of, if rich guy brings home 400,000 less this year, he's not going to be buying that sweet Porsche GT3 this year. Less money in the market always means a poorer market. There is no escaping this.
    Much of the revenue problem today comes from the fact that there are over 65 million WORKING Americans that are paying ZERO Federal Income taxes because of loopholes and there are another 25 plus million unemployed and under employed Americans paying little if any FIT. That has to be addressed. The way to do that is with a flat tax and a consumption tax. Everybody pays something. That isn't happening today.

    So then, you have to have a combo of both tax hikes, AND slash the budget. What you have there is, we pay more, and get less. Keep doing that, and you might just find people leaving this country for other places, even though those taxes are likely the same, or higher. But at least there, you get stuff for your money.
    Let's go with the spending cuts first, Reagan made a deal with the Democrat controlled House to cut spending $3 for every dollar of tax increases. Guess what we got, the tax increases without spending cuts. GHW Bush tried the same thing and guess what we got, tax increases without the spending cuts. I have no faith in bureaucrats ever cutting anything.

    And NONE of these solutions addresses the real problem. The REAL PROBLEM IS, we spend more than we make. I would say that is the case for most all americans today. Show me debt free americans, and I'll show you people that haven't left their mother's house yet. Our elected officials to do the same, only there's no credit agency hanging over their head, hounding them with phone calls for bills unpaid. Hell, when they max THEIR credit out, all the gotta do is get together, take a vote, and increase their credit limit again. Wish I could do that with MY card. Ask yourselves, all of you...when did that happen? When did it become OK for congress to spend more than they take in? We look at our private sector businesses that did that these past 10 years with frowns, and say "She's a WITCH, BURN HER!!!", but at the end of the day, they were only ever following the lead of the highest offices in the land. A boss leads by example, and who is the president and his/her staff, if not the boss?
    The answer to that is term limits. I was against them before but this is out of hand. Politicians have figured out that when you keep people dependent you keep the politicians employed. Only in the liberal world do you increase your credit limit and expect politicians not to spend the money.

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