Page 4 of 6 FirstFirst ... 23456 LastLast
Results 31 to 40 of 58

Thread: Bin Laden death: 'CIA doctor' accused of treason

  1. #31
    Advisor nijato's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Charm City, USA
    Last Seen
    01-19-12 @ 03:08 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Left
    Posts
    417
    Blog Entries
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    we do need to understand how people become terrorists to cut off the problem at the source, but also deal with these recruiters, the old men hiding behind the Quran, twisting its words to drive men to madness and destruction, they're the real threat.
    That's an insightful point I hadn't considered in that context before, at least not at that level of detail. In that context, I view it this way...

    In any society, there are the disafected youth. What becomes of them is determined in no small way by the adults that take them under their wings. In different cultures, these have been anything from radical Muslim imams to Jesuit monks, Buddhist monks, communist revolutionaries, or punk rockers, to give a few examples...

    Can the angst of youth in Central Asia and elsewhere be diverted away from the Islamist radicals? Perhaps, but drone strikes are not the correct tactic.

    Thanks for making me have a thought
    "A witty saying proves nothing." Voltaire

  2. #32
    Sage

    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 06:36 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    12,460
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Bin Laden death: 'CIA doctor' accused of treason

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    Oh brother.

    Your feeble mind is incapable of grasping my point.

    Obama, Bush, it doesn't matter. Just because I have an opposing viewpoint does not mean I'm all about Obama... but I suppose if you live in the political bizzaro world where you believe only two kind of people exist, conservatives and liberals, then I suppose I can understand where you're coming from

    I should have added my point about how we do need to understand how people become terrorists to cut off the problem at the source, but also deal with these recruiters, the old men hiding behind the Quran, twisting its words to drive men to madness and destruction, they're the real threat.
    From what I understand, the bastards have a PROFILE of the type of kid they seek out to brainwash into dying for Allah.

    Self serving opportunists, sacrificing kids and not themselves.
    Anyone wondering what I'm talking about start here:
    The Psychology of Persuasion

  3. #33
    200M yrs of experience
    Frolicking Dinosaurs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Southeastern USA
    Last Seen
    05-07-12 @ 12:19 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    2,166

    Re: Bin Laden death: 'CIA doctor' accused of treason

    Quote Originally Posted by Frolicking Dinosaurs View Post
    I can't believe I'm saying this, but I think it is time we pulled our troops out of Afghanistan and broke off all support and diplomatic relations with Pakistan. We can't break away while our troops are in Afghanistan because we have go thru Pakistan to get the Afghanistan. No other country in the region would allow use to go overland or use their airspace.
    Quote Originally Posted by Smokified View Post
    So let's discuss our plan on the internet then. That will make it much easier for us to fool the enemy.
    I've looked high and low for any sort of documentation that I'm in charge of military decisions and can't find a shred of evidence. Guess I'm just a citizen discussing my POV on the Internets. I'm absolutely positive that the Pakistani leaders are hanging on my every word and taking them as an indication of what the US government has planned.
    I don't want to see religious bigotry in any form. It would disturb me if there was wedding between the religious fundamentalists and political right. The hard right has no interest in religion except to manipulate it. ~ Billy Graham in Parade magazine February 1, 1981.

  4. #34
    Dungeon Master
    Somewhere in Babylon
    Jetboogieman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Somewhere in Babylon...
    Last Seen
    @
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    24,340
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Bin Laden death: 'CIA doctor' accused of treason

    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    From what I understand, the bastards have a PROFILE of the type of kid they seek out to brainwash into dying for Allah.

    Self serving opportunists, sacrificing kids and not themselves.
    Precisely.

    10 chars.

  5. #35
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:40 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,148

    Re: Bin Laden death: 'CIA doctor' accused of treason

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    If Pakistan didn't have nukes, I'd be with you on that one buddy.

    Pakistan however does have an ally that doesn't really care what it does, and that's China.

    The thing is niether the US nor the Chinese can afford to let Pakistan go failed state.
    truth. the Pakistani Taliban with nukes is a scary scenario

    I really, truly, madly, deeply hope there's a contingency plan in place to invade Pakistan, secure all Nuclear Weapons and ship them out of the country if things go pear shaped.
    that would be logically impossible to accomplish faster than Pakistan would be capable of firing her nukes.

    consider this reason #1,987,543 why the Obama Administration canking the missile shield was dumb, dumb, dumb.

  6. #36
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:40 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,148

    Re: Bin Laden death: 'CIA doctor' accused of treason

    Quote Originally Posted by Frolicking Dinosaurs View Post
    I've looked high and low for any sort of documentation that I'm in charge of military decisions and can't find a shred of evidence. Guess I'm just a citizen discussing my POV on the Internets. I'm absolutely positive that the Pakistani leaders are hanging on my every word and taking them as an indication of what the US government has planned.
    when I was in Fallujah, I remember we had a section of the city we found covered in a particularly interesting propaganda campaign. AQI was warning locals that if they worked with us or cooperated with us or the police, that they would be murdered along with their families when the Americans left. As proof that the Americans were going to leave before AQI was defeated, they quoted Senator Reid and Senator Clinton.

  7. #37
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:40 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,148

    Re: Bin Laden death: 'CIA doctor' accused of treason

    Quote Originally Posted by nijato View Post
    That's an insightful point I hadn't considered in that context before, at least not at that level of detail. In that context, I view it this way...

    In any society, there are the disafected youth. What becomes of them is determined in no small way by the adults that take them under their wings. In different cultures, these have been anything from radical Muslim imams to Jesuit monks, Buddhist monks, communist revolutionaries, or punk rockers, to give a few examples...

    Can the angst of youth in Central Asia and elsewhere be diverted away from the Islamist radicals? Perhaps, but drone strikes are not the correct tactic.

    Thanks for making me have a thought
    Drone Strikes can be part of the proper strategy. You have to A) publicly demonstrate that the leadership is not invulnerable and B) keep enemy organizations disorganized and ineffective while your main push occurs on the ground.

  8. #38
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Where they have FOX on in bars and restaurants
    Last Seen
    09-14-14 @ 02:09 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    14,700

    Re: Bin Laden death: 'CIA doctor' accused of treason

    Quote Originally Posted by nijato View Post
    Every freedom fighter is a terrorist to someone else. Don't get stuck in the 2d flatland paradigm of us and them- it's a complex world.
    Here is where I think some of you just donít get it. This Wahabe cult of Islam is in no way shape or form about fighting for freedom and they never even profess or proclaim that. You try to put your morals and viewpoints on a group that hates Christians in particular and Western society in general. You need to wake up; this is an entirely different thing than people fighting for their country or to retain their religion. It is about be like them or be dead. NaÔve is the only word to describe you and that is being polite.

  9. #39
    Dungeon Master
    Somewhere in Babylon
    Jetboogieman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Somewhere in Babylon...
    Last Seen
    @
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    24,340
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Bin Laden death: 'CIA doctor' accused of treason

    Quote Originally Posted by sawyerloggingon View Post
    Here is where I think some of you just donít get it. This Wahabe cult of Islam is in no way shape or form about fighting for freedom and they never even profess or proclaim that. You try to put your morals and viewpoints on a group that hates Christians in particular and Western society in general. You need to wake up; this is an entirely different thing than people fighting for their country or to retain their religion. It is about be like them or be dead. NaÔve is the only word to describe you and that is being polite.
    Once again you utterly fail in every way possible to understand our point.

    You don't get it and you never will.

    Jesus you don't even get that the Term "freedom fighter" doesn't nessecarily mean a person who fights for freedom, except within a defined context that is done by the person who's defining it.

    If you see the Americans as a foreign occupier, then anyone who opposes them is a "Freedom Fighter" not nessecarily because they're fighting for "freedom" or your "freedom" but fighting for the country to be free of theforeigners.

    Again no one is saying what a terrorist does is acceptable, no one is condoning the mass killings of soldiers or civilians, but what we're trying to get through your trogdoloyte one size fits all viewpoint of the world is that people don't just wake up in the morning and decide "Hey, today I'd like to be a terrorist and kill a bunch of people because I'm evil".

    There's a process that gets people to these places, it's complex, and it's sometimes the consequence of decisions made loooooooooooooong ago.

  10. #40
    Sage
    EagleAye's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Austin, TX
    Last Seen
    03-28-13 @ 09:08 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    5,697

    Re: Bin Laden death: 'CIA doctor' accused of treason

    Perhaps I can mediate here. While I agree with what Jetboogieman is saying, I think I understand what sawyerloggingon is saying.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by sawyerloggingon View Post
    Here is where I think some of you just donít get it. This Wahabe cult of Islam is in no way shape or form about fighting for freedom and they never even profess or proclaim that. You try to put your morals and viewpoints on a group that hates Christians in particular and Western society in general. You need to wake up; this is an entirely different thing than people fighting for their country or to retain their religion. It is about be like them or be dead. NaÔve is the only word to describe you and that is being polite.
    Once again you utterly fail in every way possible to understand our point.

    [...]

    Again no one is saying what a terrorist does is acceptable, no one is condoning the mass killings of soldiers or civilians, but what we're trying to get through your trogdoloyte one size fits all viewpoint of the world is that people don't just wake up in the morning and decide "Hey, today I'd like to be a terrorist and kill a bunch of people because I'm evil".

    There's a process that gets people to these places, it's complex, and it's sometimes the consequence of decisions made loooooooooooooong ago.
    I think a Freedom Fighter would be someone who feels his country is overwhelmed by foreign forces and fights against them in a war of attrition to persuade them to leave. Once the foreign forces leave, he will be sated and go back to farming or whatever he did before.

    But if the freedom fighter is NOT sated once foreign forces leave, and he fully intends to spread his ideology/religion to other nations, then I think he cannot be described as a Freedom Fighter. When you plan attacks in other nations, and your nation is not under attack, you are not a freedom fighter, you are simply a terrorist. So the revolutionaries of Egypt and Libya were freedom fighters. Once the tyrants were pushed out of their country, they stopped fighting. Al-Queda, are NOT freedom fighters. They move from country to country pushing their own brand of Muslim faith on everyone else, not just the US or the Western nations. The Taliban, had they stayed in Afghanistan could call themselves freedom fighters, but they expanded into Pakistan (Swat Valley) and to some degree, into China. So the Taliban are not freedom fighters after all.

    That being said, I found this link about the Wahabi sect:
    Wahhabi - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Here's an excerpt:
    The militant Islam of Osama bin Laden did not have its origins in the teachings of Ibn Abd-al-Wahhab and was not representative of Wahhabi Islam as it is practiced in contemporary Saudi Arabia, yet for the media it came to define Wahhabi Islam during the later years of bin Laden's lifetime. However "unrepresentative" bin Laden's global jihad was of Islam in general and Wahhabi Islam in particular, its prominence in headline news took Wahhabi Islam across the spectrum from revival and reform to global jihad.
    Frankly, I don't think there is anything militant about the Muslim faith at all. What we see are people who use it as a tool for conquest. When someone spreads a religion through the use of violence, they aren't trying to make anyone's life or afterlife any better. They are trying to establish a "power base" for their own personal benefit.
    Last edited by EagleAye; 10-08-11 at 12:33 PM.

Page 4 of 6 FirstFirst ... 23456 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •