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Thread: Farmers Strain to Hire American in Place of Migrant Labor

  1. #141
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    Re: Farmers Strain to Hire American in Place of Migrant Labor

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    There are approximately 10 million illegals in a country of 300 million. Why do you think that is an issue?
    10-20 million trespassers is a problem for any country regardless of size.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: Farmers Strain to Hire American in Place of Migrant Labor

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    The fact someone is legal means that they can work for honest companies.Meaning they do not have to work for substandard wages and dishonest businesses that hire illegals will just find more illegals just like those in 1986 did after the Reagan Amnesty was passed.
    What you are overlooking here is that the reason a legal worker commands a premium wage over an equally-skilled illegal worker is BECAUSE the government says that they should. If we just got rid of the minimum wage and stopped bothering illegal immigrants, employers could hire whomever they want (citizen, legal immigrant, or illegal immigrant) at whatever wage the market would bear. The unskilled, uneducated segment of the labor market (regardless of immigration status) that was willing to work for $3 per hour in unpleasant conditions would have no problem finding work. The unskilled, uneducated segment that demanded cushy conditions, total job security, and union wages would probably have a bit more trouble finding work. But the solution is to help them get better educated/trained so that they can get the kind of job that they want, not to erect artificial barriers to trade like immigration restrictions and minimum wage laws.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 10-09-11 at 05:22 PM.
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  3. #143
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    Re: Farmers Strain to Hire American in Place of Migrant Labor

    Quote Originally Posted by Animus View Post
    Are you willing to pay more for your food? $5 per pound for apples instead $.99? $8 for a gallon of milk?

    Everything is so simple until your own neck is on the line.
    If that is what food costs, then that's what it costs.
    I wouldn't have said it, not knowing the full implications.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

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    Re: Farmers Strain to Hire American in Place of Migrant Labor

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    10-20 million trespassers is a problem for any country regardless of size.
    Some of them claim it is an invasion. They intend to reconquer the southwest. Or so some of them say.

  5. #145
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    Re: Farmers Strain to Hire American in Place of Migrant Labor

    Quote Originally Posted by hazlnut View Post
    Hey Teabaggers, thanks for the $10.00 apples.

    Well done!!
    You use more energy eating apples, than you gain from eating them.
    I'm not too upset by it.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  6. #146
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    Re: Farmers Strain to Hire American in Place of Migrant Labor

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    What you are overlooking here is that the reason a legal worker commands a premium wage over an equally-skilled illegal worker is BECAUSE the government says that they should. If we just got rid of the minimum wage and stopped bothering illegal immigrants, employers could hire whomever they want (citizen, legal immigrant, or illegal immigrant) at whatever wage the market would bear. The unskilled, uneducated segment of the labor market (regardless of immigration status) that was willing to work for $3 per hour in unpleasant conditions would have no problem finding work. The unskilled, uneducated segment that demanded cushy conditions, total job security, and union wages would probably have a bit more trouble finding work. But the solution is to help them get better educated/trained so that they can get the kind of job that they want, not to erect artificial barriers to trade like immigration restrictions and minimum wage laws.
    Immigration laws are not artificial barriers. Every country in the world employs them for very valid reasons. You have no arguement.
    Last edited by 1Perry; 10-09-11 at 05:33 PM.

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    Re: Farmers Strain to Hire American in Place of Migrant Labor

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    Some of them claim it is an invasion. They intend to reconquer the southwest. Or so some of them say.
    Anyone with at least an ounce of common sense would call 10-20 million trespassers into a single country an invasion.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: Farmers Strain to Hire American in Place of Migrant Labor

    Quote Originally Posted by 1Perry View Post
    Immigration laws are not articicial barriers.
    They are an artificial barrier in the sense that they are an example of the government preventing two consenting parties from engaging in a business transaction. Artificial barriers aren't always necessarily a problem, but immigration restrictions are most certainly an artificial barrier to trade, as any economist would tell you. They prevent the free flow of labor, just as protectionism prevents the free flow of capital.

    Every country in the world employs them for very valid reasons. You have no arguement.
    What would some of those "very valid reasons" be? You keep ranting against illegal activity, but so far you have offered absolutely no reason why it should be illegal in the first place. In fact, when I rephrased (what I thought was) your argument that they drive wages down, you accused me of misrepresenting your view. So if that's not the reason you think it should be illegal, what exactly IS the problem?
    Last edited by Kandahar; 10-09-11 at 05:33 PM.
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    Re: Farmers Strain to Hire American in Place of Migrant Labor

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    They are an artificial barrier in the sense that they are an example of the government preventing two consenting parties from engaging in a business transaction.
    Kind of like they did with Capone.

    What would some of those "very valid reasons" be? You keep ranting against illegal activity, but so far you have offered absolutely no reason why it should be illegal in the first place. In fact, when I rephrased (what I thought was) your argument that they drive wages down, you accused me of misrepresenting your view. So if that's not the reason you think it should be illegal, what exactly IS the problem?
    Any country has the right to decide who gets in and most certainly have a right to turn away those with well established criminal records. They have a right to determine what they right level of increase is. You seem to believe that the problem is people are making more than $3.00 an hour.

  10. #150
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    Re: Farmers Strain to Hire American in Place of Migrant Labor

    Quote Originally Posted by 1Perry View Post
    Kind of like they did with Capone.

    Any country has the right to decide who gets in and most certainly have a right to turn away those with well established criminal records. They have a right to determine what they right level of increase is.
    And once again you don't provide a single reason why it should be illegal. I didn't ask if the government "had the right to decide who gets in," I asked why we should.

    You seem to believe that the problem is people are making more than $3.00 an hour.
    Wait, wasn't I was being horribly unfair when I paraphrased you as saying that they drive down wages? Make up your mind.
    Are you coming to bed?
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