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Thread: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Quote Originally Posted by Antiderivative View Post
    Ron Paul is a crazy. He believes in American concepts like the rule of law and habeas corpus.

    It is unfortunate that I live in a day and age where many Americans are hostile to concepts like due process and habeas corpus. They believe that the executive branch does not have to uphold these ideals and are exempt from them in order to act in a rogue manner.
    These are unprecedented times. Or do you know some other time in American history when radical stateless terrorists have declared war on the US? Those nations/individuals who can not (or choose not to) adapt to change will not survive. I am sure this mission was a close call. I'd rather close calls go to our side.
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    These are unprecedented times. Or do you know some other time in American history when radical stateless terrorists have declared war on the US? Those nations/individuals who can not (or choose not to) adapt to change will not survive. I am sure this mission was a close call. I'd rather close calls go to our side.
    This is a cop out statement in order to wage unjustified wars. Most of the terrorists came from Saudi Arabia, yet we attack Iraq and Afghanistan.

    These are not unprecedented times. History is replete with examples of aggressive states eroding individual freedoms in order to wage asinine wars.

    You either believe in concepts like habeas corpus and due process or you do not. Obviously, you are hostile to these concepts.
    Last edited by Antiderivative; 09-30-11 at 08:17 PM.

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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    So where precisely is the dividing line between crime and war? If, as a hypothetical, an American citizen joins a foreign army and takes up arms against his own country, he is in my eyes an enemy combatant and a legitimate military target. I'd say that's pretty close to what Aulaqi did.
    If he is on the front line holding a gun and fighting and gets killed that's his problem. As I stated, this is somthing that needs brought up and whether or not we come to a solution that Paul didn't agree with, it needs asked.

    Standing on the front line fighting with the enemy and getting killed is different than the government stating that they want someone dead, go do it.

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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    prove it.

    ....
    Afroyim v. Rusk, 387 U.S. 253 (1967), was a United States Supreme Court decision that set an important legal precedent that a person born or naturalized in the United States cannot be deprived of his or her citizenship involuntarily.

    Afroyim v. Rusk - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    While I understand your viewpoint, I don't agree.

    #1, we took this guy out with a drone in a foreign country where he'd set up shop to wreak havoc. I'd call that a traitor.
    As far as a discussion goes, I would not agree. I would have deemed McVeigh a murderer also but I wouldn't accept the government killing him (forgetting for a moment I don't agree with that anyway) without a trial.

    #2, he was killed during a drone strike, no doubt targetting him. We are not obliged to send in troops and put dozens of lives in danger in order to "arrest" someone who has gone over to the other side.
    No, we should only require a trial before ordering an American citizen dead.

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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Quote Originally Posted by Antiderivative View Post
    This is a cop out statement in order to wage unjustified wars. Most of the terrorists came from Saudi Arabia, yet we attack Iraq and Afghanistan.

    These are not unprecedented times. History is replete with examples of aggressive states eroding individual freedoms in order to wage asinine wars.

    You either believe in concepts like habeas corpus and due process or you do not. Obviously, you are hostile to these concepts.
    We are not discussing Iraq and Afghanistan. We are discussing taking out a known terrorist with a drone. If these times are not unprecedented in modern history, please cite examples. I am not hostile to due process. The war on terrorism is being fought by different rules by necessity.
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    Why do you believe he was killed without oversight? I suspect there were lots of lawyers arguing the fine points of killing an American unlawful combatant in this very unusual war. The war against Islamofascism will not look like any of our recent past wars.
    Then what would have made it so difficult to have done this in a court of law?

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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    We are not discussing Iraq and Afghanistan. We are discussing taking out a known terrorist with a drone. If these times are not unprecedented in modern history, please cite examples. I am not hostile to due process. The war on terrorism is being fought by different rules by necessity.
    What makes these times so unprecedented that a trial could not have been held?

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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Quote Originally Posted by 1Perry View Post
    As far as a discussion goes, I would not agree. I would have deemed McVeigh a murderer also but I wouldn't accept the government killing him (forgetting for a moment I don't agree with that anyway) without a trial.
    Sorry, I don't see McVeigh as being a realistic comparison.

    If you are right and I am wrong, there will be an investigation.
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Quote Originally Posted by 1Perry View Post
    Then what would have made it so difficult to have done this in a court of law?
    That's an easy one, first you have to find him and hold him them you have to extradite him to Clubgetmo, where he will sit forever. Obama's way is to shoot first and ask questions later. Which I like, of course those on the left will hate him for it, but won't say anything. Just imagine the uproar from the left if Bush did what Obama just did.
    Liberals - Punish the Successful, Reward the Unsuccessful
    Liberals - Tax, Borrow, Spend, and Give Free Stuff
    Obama's legacy - President Donald Trump

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