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Thread: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Link for Yaser posted earlier is wrong. This is the correct link: http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/03-6696.ZO.html
    Last edited by Frolicking Dinosaurs; 10-01-11 at 04:34 PM.
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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Quote Originally Posted by 1Perry View Post
    Why did they keep their rights? Because labeling them enemy combatants did not remove their rights to due process.
    Both majority opinions state clearly that because the US had them in custody and they were citizens, the US had a responsibility to afford them access to counsel and due process - that the extended detainment of a US citizen without access to legal counsel or any charges being brought was unconstitutional.

    The wording in Yaser -
    We hold that although Congress authorized the detention of combatants in the narrow circumstances alleged here, due process demands that a citizen held in the United States as an enemy combatant be given a meaningful opportunity to contest the factual basis for that detention before a neutral decisionmaker.
    The wording in Padilla:
    Consistent with the judgment of the Court of Appeals, I believe that the Non-Detention Act, 18 U. S. C. §4001(a), prohibits—and the Authorization for Use of Military Force Joint Resolution, 115Stat. 224, adopted on September 18, 2001, does not authorize—the protracted, incommunicado detention of American citizens arrested in the United States
    I don't want to see religious bigotry in any form. It would disturb me if there was wedding between the religious fundamentalists and political right. The hard right has no interest in religion except to manipulate it. ~ Billy Graham in Parade magazine February 1, 1981.

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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Quote Originally Posted by Frolicking Dinosaurs View Post
    Both majority opinions state clearly that because the US had them in custody and they were citizens, the US had a responsibility to afford them access to counsel and due process - that the extended detainment of a US citizen without access to legal counsel or any charges being brought was unconstitutional.
    His rights were not applicable because he was held in detainment. They were applicable because he is a U.S. citizen.

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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Quote Originally Posted by Antiderivative View Post

    You either believe in concepts like habeas corpus and due process or you do not. Obviously, you are hostile to these concepts.
    I like where your heart is at but not your head. We can do both. When it comes to waging war if you re in the enemy's camp you are a legitimate target, American or not.

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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Quote Originally Posted by 1Perry View Post
    As far as a discussion goes, I would not agree. I would have deemed McVeigh a murderer also but I wouldn't accept the government killing him (forgetting for a moment I don't agree with that anyway) without a trial.

    No, we should only require a trial before ordering an American citizen dead.
    We were not in a war with the Branch Davidians in Waco, Texas. Yet the American government, under Bill Clinton killed those people. I considered it manslaughter.

    We are in a war with Islamofascists. If an American is in an organization we are at war with, in this case a part of the enemy leadership, then we have an obligation to kill him if we can find him. There is no trial necessary. In my opinion this is a war, not a crime.

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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Quote Originally Posted by Councilman View Post
    I am no fan of Obama under any circumstances, or by any stretch, because I think he's been useless and the king of all liars, but I will admit that since he has decided that killing the terrorists as I have been saying all along I support killing OBL and now Anwar al-Awlaki and those with him.

    In these cases Obama is doing the right thing.
    I also have to say that I now have eliminated the first GOP candidate from any consideration and that is Ron Paul.
    I think he could not be more wrong. You don't give a poisonous snake a break you kill it.

    Al-Qaida understands death and nothing else because they are all crazy as hell.
    Yet another reason why Ron Paul will never win the nomination.

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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Quote Originally Posted by 1Perry View Post
    Then what would have made it so difficult to have done this in a court of law?
    During this war, we have had lawyers review specific applications of the rules of engagement. I don't see this as any different than in cases where we receive incoming fires and intend to return indirect fire.

    We do not bring the enemy leadership into court to determine guilt or innocence. We kill them. Or if possible, we capture them.

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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Invisible View Post
    The problem with this situation isn't that al-Awlaki was killed, rather it was the fact that he was a US citizen at the time of his death and thus still subject to US laws, such as due process.
    Sorry, baby...you dont get to disavow your country, join a terrorist organization, plot violent crimes against the country, then pretend you have the right to constitutional protections while playing terrorist in Yemen. You DO however get to die. Choice and consequence.

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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Quote Originally Posted by 1Perry View Post
    What makes these times so unprecedented that a trial could not have been held?
    I think the difference between our opinions is that you view him as a criminal who should be apprehended and tried. I view him as an unlawful combatant on the enemy side in a shooting war. This is a huge difference. i do not believe we can bridge it.

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    Re: Ron Paul: US-born al-Qaida cleric 'assassinated'

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Sorry, baby...you dont get to disavow your country, join a terrorist organization, plot violent crimes against the country, then pretend you have the right to constitutional protections while playing terrorist in Yemen. You DO however get to die. Choice and consequence.
    oh, one can try....but I'd still blow their head off.

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