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Judge lets key parts of Alabama immigration law stand

It is good to see that people actually care about stopping illegal immigration.
 
AdamT said:
Actually, you've missed the target by about 50%, which I would think casts some doubt on your analysis. The actual number of illegals is now estimated to be about 11 million.
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Only by the Pew Hispanic Center, that has been touting that figure for nearly a decade. The reality is that the government estimated 12 million illegals in the USA more than a decade ago, and agrees that there are between 1.5 and 2.0 million illegals coming into the USA every single year. That means that in the past ten years, at least 15 million illegals have entered, bringing the total to 27 million. If we use the Pew Hispanic Centers 2006 figure of... yep, you've got it... 12 million plus the 1.5 to 2.0 million illegals entering annually, you have an additional 7.5-8.0 million illegals added to the 12 million original figure, which totals 19.5 to 20 million... and that's using the lowest estimate of 1.5 million annually, not the high estimate. Either way, there are at least 20 million illegals in the USA right now, and most likely millions more than that.

Otherwise, you are flailing at a strawman. No one ever claimed that they were all, or mostly, or in any particular amount, farm workers. But it is a fact that many farm workers are illegals, and it is also a fact that Americans are not clamoring to take those low wage agricultural jobs. Why is it that you imagine employers are so eager to face criminal liability by hiring illegal aliens when they could instead hire Americans or legal residents at the same rate? Do they just hate America that much? :rolleyes:
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But it is a fact that there are millions of legal agricultural work visas issued every year. The problem is that farmers using those legal farm workers must pay minimum wage, SSI benefits, workman's comp, and must also regulate the amount of hours they can work along with providing them clean, habitable living quarters. With illegals, however, they don't have to pay any of those pesky benefits, can work them 18 hours a day and house them in deplorable conditions because they know they can't complain. This horrible exploitation of farm workers is exactly what Ceasar Chavez fought against, and won... until now, when illegals have flooded the field, driving out farm workers with legal visas and tax I.D. numbers.

Do they hate America? What kind of silly question is that? They don't hate America. They love profits, just like every other employer in every facet of business that hires illegals. The chances they'll get caught and face a minor fine is miniscule at best, and they know it. Lobbyists for all kinds of corporations have bribed congress for years to look the other way on border and immigration issues. Cheap labor that can't complain about abuse means bigger profits. Duh.

I notice you had no comment to the rest of my post, dealing with the fact that in some areas nearly all entry level jobs are taken by illegals, willing to work for cheap, taking either cash under the table or using somebody else's stolen identification... which adds a whole 'nother level of misery to those who discover that their own social security or green card accounts are irreparably fubar'd by identity theft.
 
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dixiesolutions said:
Now - it the best time for Alabama to set-up road blocks on all main highways leading into neighboring states.
There will be hundreds of thousands of illegals trying to escape.
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I say let the illegals be the problems of the neighboring state.It will motivate those states to crack down on illegal immigration too.
 
DiAnna said:
Only by the Pew Hispanic Center, that has been touting that figure for nearly a decade. The reality is that the government estimated 12 million illegals in the USA more than a decade ago, and agrees that there are between 1.5 and 2.0 million illegals coming into the USA every single year. That means that in the past ten years, at least 15 million illegals have entered, bringing the total to 27 million. If we use the Pew Hispanic Centers 2006 figure of... yep, you've got it... 12 million plus the 1.5 to 2.0 million illegals entering annually, you have an additional 7.5-8.0 million illegals added to the 12 million original figure, which totals 19.5 to 20 million... and that's using the lowest estimate of 1.5 million annually, not the high estimate. Either way, there are at least 20 million illegals in the USA right now, and most likely millions more than that.



But it is a fact that there are millions of legal agricultural work visas issued every year. The problem is that farmers using those legal farm workers must pay minimum wage, SSI benefits, workman's comp, and must also regulate the amount of hours they can work along with providing them clean, habitable living quarters. With illegals, however, they don't have to pay any of those pesky benefits, can work them 18 hours a day and house them in deplorable conditions because they know they can't complain. This horrible exploitation of farm workers is exactly what Ceasar Chavez fought against, and won... until now, when illegals have flooded the field, driving out farm workers with legal visas and tax I.D. numbers.

Do they hate America? What kind of silly question is that? They don't hate America. They love profits, just like every other employer in every facet of business that hires illegals. The chances they'll get caught and face a minor fine is miniscule at best, and they know it. Lobbyists for all kinds of corporations have bribed congress for years to look the other way on border and immigration issues. Cheap labor that can't complain about abuse means bigger profits. Duh.

I notice you had no comment to the rest of my post, dealing with the fact that in some areas nearly all entry level jobs are taken by illegals, willing to work for cheap, taking either cash under the table or using somebody else's stolen identification... which adds a whole 'nother level of misery to those who discover that their own social security or green card accounts are irreparably fubar'd by identity theft.
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Your information is dated. We've been having *negative* immigration in recent years as a result of the crappy economy and unemployment situation. Supply < -- > demand. The number I cited is from the Department of Homeland Security -- not the Pew Center.

There are NOT millions of legal agricultural worker visas issued every year. You missed that one by a factor of about 60. :lol: The number is typically well below 50,000. The reason for the low number is that employers have to jump through tons of hoops to get H2A visas, and when they do get them they are only good for a year.

I didn't address your claim about illegals taking nearly all entry level jobs because you failed to support your argument with, you know, facts?

We are never going to be able to control illegal immigration until we establish a realistic number of visas for legal immigration. The total number of visas for temporary agricultrual AND nonagricultural workers comes to around 100,000, which is ridiculously inadequate. It's no differnt than the war on drugs. It has to be addressed from the demand side. There will always be a plentiful supply.
 
jamesrage said:
I say let the illegals be the problems of the neighboring state.It will motivate those states to crack down on illegal immigration too.
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what that guy said. though the example of california leads me to wonder if some states will just choose to collapse instead.
 
As Alabama and Georgia are discovering, the bigger illegal immigrant problem is not having enough of them to do the the scut work that Americans don't want to do.
 
coolwalker said:
I don't need a Gardner, or a maid so as far as I am concerned, this is great news. Now I'm sure all those millionaires might not think the same way, but who cares...they're not paying my mortgage anyway!
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Both of my gardeners and both of my maids are American.
 
AdamT said:
Be careful what you wish for. The private sector is not fond of big-government conservatism.

"An Alabama law to tackle illegal immigration is coming under fire from some business leaders in the state, who say the measure is undermining Alabama's economy even before it takes effect.
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They whine. They were part of the problem. Now the are forced to become part of the solution. Some people are trying to bring back slavery. We are not going to let them.
 
AdamT said:
What's needed is a more realistic quota for low-wage immigrant visas. Republicans need to drop their nonsensical opposition to immigration reform unless we first shut off the flow of illegal immigrants. These are two sides of the same coin.
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Why do liberals love slave labor so much?
 
Councilman said:
It's a step on the right direction but it's not enough solve the problem.

If the laws on the books were enforced and employers were sanctioned as they should be the majority of the problem would solved pronto because if the illegals can't work they have to go back where they came from.
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We now have a law. And the police are working out how to enforce it. It is working already. Illegal aliens are heading to Tennessee. Thank goodness there are magnet states to draw them right out of Alabama now that we have a decent law.
 
AdamT said:
As Alabama and Georgia are discovering, the bigger illegal immigrant problem is not having enough of them to do the the scut work that Americans don't want to do.
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The problem is they can't pay Americans a livable wage and compete with the neighboring states that continue to use super cheap illegal labor. My mom and Aunts grew up in farm areas and worked in tabacco and Watermellon farms. They paid a decent salary then.

One of our biggest problems is jobs that can be moved are being moved to low wage countries and jobs that can't be moved are using illegals. The low skilled uneducated American worker is who is left with no options.
 
AdamT said:
It ain't slave labor if they can pick up and move, which they obviously can.
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But that is what your goal is. You want a permanent underclass of brown people to do the hard work so you can enjoy whatever it is you enjoy. Thank you. But no thank you.
 
AdamT said:
As Alabama and Georgia are discovering, the bigger illegal immigrant problem is not having enough of them to do the the scut work that Americans don't want to do.
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There will be adjustments as farming and construction returns to legal Americans to do the work. Now in addition we also need welfare reform. It is way too easy to live off the work of others. We need to make it much harder.
 
coolwalker said:
I don't need a Gardner, or a maid so as far as I am concerned, this is great news. Now I'm sure all those millionaires might not think the same way, but who cares...they're not paying my mortgage anyway!
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Uh-huh.

 
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