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Thread: Troy Davis execution: Georgia pardons board denies plea for clemency

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    Re: Troy Davis execution: Georgia pardons board denies plea for clemency

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post

    It can, if all cases that previously would have involved the death penalty were simply replaced by the sentence of life without parole.
    ????????????????

    If everyone that is on death row were to suddenly be resentenced to life without parole, and integrated into the mainstream prison population, there would more than likely be a number of inmates and C.O.s murdered.

    Your idea makes no sense whatsoever, unless your only concern is for the inmates on death row, most of whom are pathologically violent, extremely dangerous individuals who will undoubtedly put the lives of a great many other inmates--most of whom were not convicted of first degree murder and do not deserve to be killed by someone who was--in very serious danger.


    Regardless of whether or not the death penalty is implemented, why would a defendant who "looks pretty damn guilty" be exonerated in the first place?
    Ahhhh... For all the same reasons that an an innocent defendant might be wrongfully convicted?

    Believe it or not, the guilty are often exonerated or allowed to plea bargain to a much lesser charge. And just so you know, the guilty go free a lot more often than the innocent are convicted.

    Ever heard of O.J. Simpson?

    How about Arthur Bomar?

    Man Paroled from a life sentence kills college student

    Why would he be released back into society in the first place?
    Because the CJS makes mistakes on both sides the scales of guilt and innocence.
    Last edited by Sig; 09-23-11 at 07:46 PM.

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    Re: Troy Davis execution: Georgia pardons board denies plea for clemency

    Quote Originally Posted by Sig View Post
    ????????????????

    If everyone that is on death row were to suddenly be resentenced to life without parole, and integrated into the mainstream prison population, there would more than likely be a number of inmates and C.O.s murdered.

    Your idea makes no sense whatsoever, unless your only concern is for the inmates on death row, most of whom are pathologically violent, extremely dangerous individuals who will undoubtedly put the lives of a great many other inmates--most of whom were not convicted of first degree murder and do not deserve to be killed by someone who has--in very serious danger.




    Ahhhh... For all the same reasons that an an innocent defendant might be wrongfully convicted?

    Believe it or not, the guilty are often exonerated or allowed to plea bargain to a much lesser charge. And just so you know, the guilty go free a lot more often than the innocent are convicted.

    Ever heard of O.J. Simpson?

    How about Arthur Bomar?

    Man Paroled from a life sentence kills college student



    Because the CJS makes mistakes on both sides the scales of guilt and innocence.
    I think someone may have posted this quote earlier but here goes...

    "Better one hundred guilty men go free than one innocent man be condemned." - Thomas Jefferson
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    The sad fact is that having a pedophile win is better than having a Democrat in office. I'm all for a solution where a Republican gets in that isn't Moore.

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    Re: Troy Davis execution: Georgia pardons board denies plea for clemency

    Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
    I think someone may have posted this quote earlier but here goes...
    Wonderful, but what has it to do with the issue at hand?

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    Re: Troy Davis execution: Georgia pardons board denies plea for clemency

    Quote Originally Posted by Sig View Post
    Wonderful, but what has it to do with the issue at hand?
    well you posted:

    Man Paroled from a life sentence kills college student
    and I posted:

    "Better one hundred guilty men go free than one innocent man be condemned." - Thomas Jefferson
    Kind of seemed to be pertinent. if not... meh. My bad.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    The sad fact is that having a pedophile win is better than having a Democrat in office. I'm all for a solution where a Republican gets in that isn't Moore.

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    Re: Troy Davis execution: Georgia pardons board denies plea for clemency

    Quote Originally Posted by Fishstyx View Post
    Don't know if this is been posted yet but this is the decision from the Aug 2010 Federal District Court, Judge Moore was presiding over the hearing. Breaks down the recantations towards the end (pg 128 to the end) and includes the judge's summary

    http://multimedia.savannahnow.com/me...ling082410.pdf

    I didn't know much about this case but after reading the breakdown of the recantations during the hearing, the guy was guilty.
    I don't think anybody here cares about the facts of this case.

    They want to use it to argue their side for or against the death penalty.

    The law says if he was there, even if he didn't pull the trigger, he is just as guilty as the man who did pull the trigger.

    You want to argue if he pulled the trigger or not, if he was there, he was guilty.

    You have to look at why somebody would recant their story after 20 years. They had nothing to lose, no consequence for them. They can say anything the defense wants them to say. If you believe they recanted their stories, that makes 7 of those witnesses liars.

    I don't believe that the cops could coerce 7 witnesses to lie. Maybe one or two scumbags had something hanging over their heads, but 7?

    What about the other three? Why didn't they change their story?

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    Re: Troy Davis execution: Georgia pardons board denies plea for clemency

    Hadn't he used the same gun in a crime earlier that night? Weren't some of those who ID'd him his friends, including his now-deceased girlfriend? Didn't multiple courts refuse to to overturn or give him a new trial, including the Supreme Court?

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    Re: Troy Davis execution: Georgia pardons board denies plea for clemency

    Quote Originally Posted by Mason66 View Post
    I don't think anybody here cares about the facts of this case.

    They want to use it to argue their side for or against the death penalty.

    The law says if he was there, even if he didn't pull the trigger, he is just as guilty as the man who did pull the trigger.

    You want to argue if he pulled the trigger or not, if he was there, he was guilty.

    You have to look at why somebody would recant their story after 20 years. They had nothing to lose, no consequence for them. They can say anything the defense wants them to say. If you believe they recanted their stories, that makes 7 of those witnesses liars.

    I don't believe that the cops could coerce 7 witnesses to lie. Maybe one or two scumbags had something hanging over their heads, but 7?

    What about the other three? Why didn't they change their story?
    Well thats the thing, those claiming an innocent man was put to death cite the recantations as proof of innocence. When clearly, the recantations were tested during the hearing and deemed not credible during cross examination. Funny, the one recantation that would have done the most, Davis refused to allow her to testify at the hearing and solely submitted her affidavit. As the judge clearly states in his decision, an affidavit holds very little evidentiary weight without cross examination to determine credibility.

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    Re: Troy Davis execution: Georgia pardons board denies plea for clemency

    I apologize for posting without reading the thread. I have no problem with the death penality when the crime is especially heinous, and guilt is proven beyond doubt by actual physical evidence, i.e. murder weapon with fingerprints, dna, bodies buried in the backyard, caught in the act, etc. We're talking Bundy, Gacy, Dalhmer kind of evidence.

    However, I have misgivings about the Troy Davis case. Not one iota of physical evidence. No weapon, no fingerprints, no hairs or fibers, no dna... nothing but eyewitness accounts, which have been proven to be the flimsiest "evidence" there is. How many "rapists" have spent years in prison based only on identification by their alleged victim, only to dna exhonerate them? Too many to count, that's how many. Davis' alleged victim was a police officer. There was immense pressure to convict someone of this crime. Dispite the lack of physical evidence, that's exactly what was done.

    The death penalty is over used, in my opinion, utilized more as a heavy hammer to bang out a plea agreement from a terrified defendent willing to take the advice of an underpaid public defender and plead guilty with life in prison as an option to execution. I'm sure all too many innocents have been executed over the years. That's unacceptable. And I fear Troy Davis might have been one of them.

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    Re: Troy Davis execution: Georgia pardons board denies plea for clemency

    @Sig

    Yeah...so the CJS makes mistakes...I think that I've already pointed that out. Again, I would rather err on the side of letting a killer live, than putting an innocent man to death. This isn't an unusual or unreasonable position.

    As for guilty who are exonerated - they are, most of the time if not all, exonerated only after new evidence comes to light that exonerates them. And hence they no longer look "pretty damn guilty." And as for plea bargaining to lesser charges and eventually getting released, that happens regardless of whether or not the death penalty is in place. And, correct me if I'm wrong, but plea bargaining doesn't happen AFTER you're sentenced.

    I really don't understand what argument you're trying to make here.
    Last edited by StillBallin75; 09-24-11 at 12:03 PM.

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    Re: Troy Davis execution: Georgia pardons board denies plea for clemency

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    @Sig

    Yeah...so the CJS makes mistakes...I think that I've already pointed that out. Again, I would rather err on the side of letting a killer live, than putting an innocent man to death. This isn't an unusual or unreasonable position.
    Again, I will point out that by letting a killer live amongst non-killers in a prison setting, you will have blood on your hands (and gross injustice just the same) should said killer slay one of the non-killers among him, including C.O.s, or other prison staff.

    As for guilty who are exonerated - they are, most of the time if not all, exonerated only after new evidence comes to light that exonerates them. And hence they no longer look "pretty damn guilty."
    WRONG.

    The guilty are exonerated for all sorts of reasons, including high powered defense (ie: OJ), jury tampering (ie: John Gotti), jury nullification (ie: Rodney King and Reginald Denny), to name but a few.

    And as for plea bargaining to lesser charges and eventually getting released, that happens regardless of whether or not the death penalty is in place. And, correct me if I'm wrong, but plea bargaining doesn't happen AFTER you're sentenced.
    That's realy not the point, is it?

    If someone who has committed first degree murder is allowed to plea bargain to manslaughter, for one reason or another, the CJS has failed in its quest for justice.

    I really don't understand what argument you're trying to make here.
    That much is obvious. Try reading a little slower and thinking a little harder.

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