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Thread: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

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    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    Quote Originally Posted by The Barbarian View Post
    Why do you liberals insist on continuing with this, it could have been much worse theory? There is no proof to back up what you are saying.
    Liberalism isn't based on facts, its based on feelings.

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    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    Quote Originally Posted by conservativeguy View Post
    Liberalism isn't based on facts, its based on feelings.
    Over sterotyping 101. I suppose you have a doctorate in sterotyping and making wild generalizations?

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    First of all, this isn't a "liberal" thing. The main person behind TARP was Hank Paulson, a life-long Republican and former CEO of Goldman Sachs.
    I did not really know much about him but a quick look at Wikipedia indicates that he is more left than center. He looks like a very-big-government guy. Many liberal Republicans suffer from this same malady. So I tend to believe it really is a liberal thing.

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    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    There are specific requirements for Chapter 11 that GM and Chrysler couldn't meet. They were too far gone. Again, there was ZERO chance that they would be reorganized without the government bailout. They were weeks away from going away for good.
    That would have been best. Government Motors still cannot stand on its own. It requires government subsidies in the form of major tax breaks to customers to buy the cars they otherwise would not want. I will never knowingly buy a product from Government Motors. In fact, I bought a Ford. Just because.

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    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    I did not really know much about him but a quick look at Wikipedia indicates that he is more left than center. He looks like a very-big-government guy. Many liberal Republicans suffer from this same malady. So I tend to believe it really is a liberal thing.
    It doesn't matter whether it is considered to be "liberal" or not. The fact of the matter is, we have a capitalist system in the US, and it seems to work pretty well. If GM had become uncompetitive with the other makers, then it should have been reorganized, not taken over by the government.

    How is it that Ford managed to stay in business without government bailouts?

    and what is it that happened to Chrysler in the end? Wasn't it bought out by a European automaker?
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    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    Quote Originally Posted by washunut View Post
    I have heard this argument many times. What do you think would have happened if GM and Chrysler went under and why would it have been different than when the airlines go into bankruptcy. Do you really think that the country was about to stop buying cars? The large number of jobs you mention is much larger than all of the employees at the two companies, it assumes that ALL of the workers at ALL of the companies supplying parts into those two would also go under, so the assumption would have to be Americans would stop buying cars. This argument never seemed credible. Would there have been job losses yes as there were anyway.
    No, we wouldn't stop buying cars

    We'd stop buying cars that were made by american corporations, and the profits would go overseas.

    And the companies that supply parts for the american car corps would go under and be replaced with foreign companies that would supply the car manufacturers, so additional profits and jobs would go overseas.
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    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    It doesn't matter whether it is considered to be "liberal" or not. The fact of the matter is, we have a capitalist system in the US, and it seems to work pretty well. If GM had become uncompetitive with the other makers, then it should have been reorganized, not taken over by the government.

    How is it that Ford managed to stay in business without government bailouts?

    and what is it that happened to Chrysler in the end? Wasn't it bought out by a European automaker?
    I don't have answers for your questions. But from your statements it sounds like we agree about what should have happened.

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    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    If the debt were, say, a trillion dollars, then an increase of 50% might be sustainable. That increase would add 500 b to the debt.

    Since the debt is actually 15 trillion and counting, even 7% is still over a trillion dollars, or ten grand each for a hundred million taxpayers. Are you willing to put another ten grand on your MasterCard?



    Hey, imagine that, 7% of 15 is actually more than 50% of 1.

    Currently, the government is at least beginning to talk about the debt. They aren't proposing any realistic plan to do anything about it, talking about 4 trillion over 10 years vs. 3 trillion over ten years. Even 4 trillion over ten years would result in a debt of 25 trillion, or a quarter million each for a hundred million taxpayers.

    Don't get me wrong. This is nothing new, and isn't all on Obama and his Democratic Congress. Putting two wars on the national MasterCard while cutting taxes didn't help.

    Would an additional stimulus actually bring the economy back? If so, then increased revenues would pay it back. If not, we'd be left with an unsustainable debt.

    Come to think of it, we already have an unsustainable debt anyway, so what the heck?

    Hey, Nero, where did you put that fiddle?
    What happens if we stay where we are and do nothing?
    Debt will still rise, the economy will still be spiraling down.

    When unemployment goes up again and the cost of living goes up again,not only the unemployed on Main street will suffer.
    The American corporations will be in need of a lot of warehouses for overstocked inventory and a lotof red ink.

    The old ride the credit card routine is coming to an end for the American people

    So far a lot of people have critised the American people for living beyond their means .
    Lets see how good the sales are when the American people start living within their needs, and buying only what they need.
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    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    Quote Originally Posted by presluc View Post
    What happens if we stay where we are and do nothing?
    Debt will still rise, the economy will still be spiraling down.

    When unemployment goes up again and the cost of living goes up again,not only the unemployed on Main street will suffer.
    The American corporations will be in need of a lot of warehouses for overstocked inventory and a lotof red ink.

    The old ride the credit card routine is coming to an end for the American people

    So far a lot of people have critised the American people for living beyond their means .
    Lets see how good the sales are when the American people start living within their needs, and buying only what they need.
    Living beyond our means, putting everything on the credit card, then paying minimums didn't work out so well, did it? Lots of people used the equity in their houses to pay off those credit cards, then kept living beyond their means. We know the results of that sort of economy.

    But, how is it better to live on our collective MasterCard by allowing the federal government to continue to spend beyond its means? Are we just trading individual debt for collective debt? I like the individual plan better, as I was able to opt out and only buy what I needed all along. There is no way to opt out of the federal debt that I know of.
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    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    Quote Originally Posted by washunut View Post
    I have heard this argument many times. What do you think would have happened if GM and Chrysler went under and why would it have been different than when the airlines go into bankruptcy. Do you really think that the country was about to stop buying cars? The large number of jobs you mention is much larger than all of the employees at the two companies, it assumes that ALL of the workers at ALL of the companies supplying parts into those two would also go under, so the assumption would have to be Americans would stop buying cars. This argument never seemed credible. Would there have been job losses yes as there were anyway.
    American manufacturing labor for auto parts left America with outsourceing.
    As far as Americans stop buying car scenerio?
    They might stop buying American cars but they have already done that in a lot of areas.
    #1 car sales Japan
    #1 used car sales Japan
    Japan has a strong labor and management Manufacturing base.
    China has a stromg managementand manufacturing base.
    America does not
    Which country has had the most progress in the past 11 years?
    Tiki bar regular.
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