Page 20 of 106 FirstFirst ... 1018192021223070 ... LastLast
Results 191 to 200 of 1060

Thread: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

  1. #191
    I support ██ ███
    jasonxe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Last Seen
    12-16-15 @ 05:02 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    1,405

    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    Quote Originally Posted by Smokified View Post
    In that case I may have misunderstood your post.
    it's ok, I wasn't descriptive enough.
    Last edited by jasonxe; 09-20-11 at 07:43 PM.



  2. #192
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    The greatest city on Earth
    Last Seen
    08-04-12 @ 02:27 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    31,089

    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    that doesn't provide them the proper incentive to stop voting for the pushers who hand out the drug called entitlements
    Social Security & Medicare....are drugs?

    huh.

  3. #193
    Sage
    teamosil's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    San Francisco
    Last Seen
    05-21-14 @ 10:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    6,623

    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    Quote Originally Posted by Smokified View Post
    It sounds like you are implying that simply being more responsible with the money that we do have is not a realistic soltution on it's own. People already do not have enough money which is why spending is down. How is raising taxes going to even remotely have a positive effect on the core of the problem? As a matter of fact the taxes discussion is almost a pointless distraction from the real issue which is cost of living. When I bought my house 3 years ago I was living in a fairly decent comfort zone. I make more now but am able to afford less. This is the problem.
    Well if cost of living is your issue then taxes rather than spending cuts is definitely in your interests. Spending cuts would come out of your pocket where tax increases would come out of the pockets of folks that can afford them. For example, a cut in social security means you need to save more for retirement starting tomorrow. If they cut college loans, you need to save more for your education or your kids' education. If they cut education spending you are more likely to have to pay for your kids' school. Everything they cuts means firing people which means more people competing with you for jobs. Etc. Spending cuts equate to taking it out of the middle class's pockets.

    As for being responsible for the money we do have, I see it differently. Societies that reinvest a significant portion of their GDP in maintaining their foundations like a strong education system, good chances to get out of poverty, strong scientific research, etc, do much, much better and everybody tends to live much better. So to me the question is more about being responsible about chipping back in to cover those expenses. Trying to save a few bucks in the short term in taxes and trading in the future to get it, that is what I consider irresponsible.
    Last edited by teamosil; 09-20-11 at 08:19 PM.

  4. #194
    Sage

    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Huntsville, AL (USA)
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:45 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    8,736

    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    Quote Originally Posted by Smokified View Post
    The problem is not so much the taxes or the cuts as it is the fact that business is not growing because people are not spending. Companies are not going to take risks like expansion in a market that can't make up it's mind on which direction it is going, and especially when it is heading in the wrong direction. No amount of molesting the tax code is going to fix that problem. None of this was a problem until it cost people $4 a gallon to put gas in their cars.
    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    When Eisenhower was president, the highest tax rate was 90%, and unemployment was low. No, I am not suggesting that we tax at 90% again. I just brought up this fact to show the lie that is being passed around that it is tax cuts that create jobs. Jobs are created when people buy stuff, and when the middle class is squeezed more than the rich, they buy less, and fewer jobs are created as a result. It's all about supply and demand. What can kill demand, and therefore jobs? Greed.
    I'm glad a couple of people here get it. As I stated in post #152, America ceased using manufacturing as a profit base and started relying heavily on financial services. As such, credit consumption propped up stagnant wages practically forcing middle-class Americans to depend on credit just to make ends. We borrowed from our "personal equity fund" - our homes - and/or maxed out our credit cards just to buy the things we needed just to get through life - fuel for our cars, food, health care/insurance, daycare, banking services, home heating (utilities). All the while the cost of these such things got more and more expensive. If it was difficult for a two-income househood to make ends meet it became increasingly difficult if one of those wage earners lost their job. That's a reality in good times, but the problem is made worse in a down economy.

    I'm sure there will be plenty of people here who will say, "Well, they should have been more responsible with their money," and to that I'd say you're right - to a degree. You see, there's two-sides to this credit consumption story. On the one hand, it became the norm. America, through the financial industry itself, effectively "forced" credit unto us all. Sure, a business will readily accept cash for goods and services, but when wages remain flat for so long yet the cost of goods and services continue to increase it becomes difficult for a waitress, a daycare worker, a data entry clerk, an auto mechanic, a landscaper - just our average ordinary blue-collar worker - to accumulate disposable income in large enough quatities to do anything other than pay the mortgage or other basic necessities just to survive. For many, using the credit card to bridge that income gap became commonplace. We got use to it to where now most of us are like prisoner with a number only that number is our credit rating.

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    yet the effective top rate wasn't much different due to all the breaks, loopholes etc and that top rate applied to far less people and was justified in paying off a massive war.

    we also were the only industrial power left standing after WWII

    IS there anyone out there who suggests TAX HIKES create jobs? That is the main issue
    This is where the argument gets very convoluted. Tax increases wouldn't go to create jobs. They'd go towards paying down the national debt, as well as paying for those things our government has always paid for - our military, Medicaid, unfunded portions of Medicare, etc., etc. If Corporate America truly saw tax increases as a threat to their profitability they'd do the exact opposite of the conservative argument: they'd use their net profits and put them back into their business and advertise like hell to generate sales in order to capture more marketshare. It's a survivor's mentality in business. But there's a catch: no matter how much a company advertises to find new customers, unless customers have disposable income to spend, the demand will never be there. You can't keep dipping from the same well when it's been practically runs dry. That's the situation most Americans find themselves in right now. If you're lucky enough to still have a job chances are you've cut back on damned near e-v-e-r-y-t-h-i-n-g just to make ends meet. You're likely just one unfortunate, unexpected event away from going "Ah, ****!!!!"

    As for the tax rate during the WWII-era and now, we could have done the exact same thing for both the War in Iraq and the War in Afghanistan, but...

    Maybe if we had done so our deficit wouldn't be so freakin' outrageous today. War bonds and recycling drives anyone? Instead, we got "go out and shop, America! Keep consumerism going!" Gotta prop up the financial sector only to be screwed later by corporate greed. And what has working-class Americans received for their "generocity" of a massive private sector bailout? No jobs and generation-worth of IOUs. Where's the gratitude, Corporate America?

  5. #195
    Sage

    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Huntsville, AL (USA)
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:45 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    8,736

    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    Quote Originally Posted by 1Perry View Post
    We can't come anywhere close to make up the deficit with tax increases. That isn't to say that there should be none, but it's going to be equal to wizzing in the ocean as far as addressing the deficit goes.
    Then the options are:

    a) continue living with the threat of inflation or stagflation looming overhead, or;

    b) accepting the fact that it will take decades to pay down the debt with spending cuts alone.

    Conservatives continue to press the false assumption that "if you can't pay off the debt tomorrow, what's the point of even trying"? I say, "a balanced approach to out debt and deficits IS the only way to straighten this mess out over time." It took a decade to get us into this mess. Unless obstructionist Republicans renounce their Pledge and allow for revenue increases of some type over atleast the next 5-10 years, we WILL see inflation drape over this country like a wet, moldy blanket. And it - the economy - will weigh us down and stink for a long time.

  6. #196
    warrior of the wetlands
    TurtleDude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Ohio
    Last Seen
    Today @ 05:52 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    157,641

    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    back in the days of confiscatory tax rates it was far more difficult to go offshore to invest. Now, such rates would cause most of the productive investors to move offshore leaving the parasites with less to feed them
    Quote Originally Posted by EarlzP View Post
    Why would you not want to register your weapon?
    Quote Originally Posted by Celebrity View Post
    , as long as you can own one or fewer guns, your right to bear a firearm is not being infringed upon.

  7. #197
    Sage

    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Huntsville, AL (USA)
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:45 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    8,736

    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    back in the days of confiscatory tax rates it was far more difficult to go offshore to invest. Now, such rates would cause most of the productive investors to move offshore leaving the parasites with less to feed them
    Investors have already moved off-shore. So, what's your point?

    I'd accept your argument more if you had said investors are having a difficult time bringing their off-shore investments back!

  8. #198
    Slayer of the DP Newsbot
    danarhea's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Houston, TX
    Last Seen
    Today @ 05:43 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    36,882

    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    Quote Originally Posted by Smokified View Post
    It is not apples to oranges, it is the same argument. Is hiking taxes going to solve the fact that there is no demand?
    Actually, you are now throwing out a red herring. It was Republicans that said reducing taxes creates jobs, not the other side. Now you want to turn it around and ask how raising taxes creates them? It's a BS question to begin with, since rates of taxation have absolutely nothing to do with job creation. If it were true, then we would have had our greatest depression during the Eisenhower administration when the highest tax rate was 90%, and not the Hoover administration, when we had one of our lowest tax rates.

    Again, it boils down to supply and demand. If the middle and lower classes are squeezed, and can not afford to buy the products, then there is no demand, and therefore no job creation. Demand is the key to job creation. People have to afford products and services in order to buy them, and thus create jobs.
    The ghost of Jack Kevorkian for President's Physician: 2016

  9. #199
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Huntsville, AL
    Last Seen
    05-31-15 @ 11:00 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    13,813

    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Question: How is it "Class warfare" to ask the wealthiest Americans to pay the same tax rate as the middle class?

    And why don't you same people cry "Class warfare" when the wealthiest Americans are given the largest tax cuts and the middle and working class get smaller cuts?


    Hmmmmmmmmmmmm?
    They already do. There is no special rate for the rich.

    Perhaps now is the time to join with me to get the Fair Tax passed. Americans For Fair Taxation:

    It beats being fooled by the one term Marxist president Obama once again.

  10. #200
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Huntsville, AL
    Last Seen
    05-31-15 @ 11:00 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    13,813

    Re: Obama to propose $1.5 trillion in new tax revenue

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    I have only one question - What's wrong with the CEO of a major corporation paying at least the same rate that his secretary pays?
    I am all for that. The secretary is likely part of that 47% that pay no federal income taxes.

Page 20 of 106 FirstFirst ... 1018192021223070 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •