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Thread: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires

  1. #1741
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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires

    iliveonramen;1059854323]It's like week 1. Why don't you wait a bit and see what the goals end up being. The Tea Party is almost in year 4. It takes time before movements either dissapate (which is possible) or form a true movement. I'm saying reserve judgement. You don't have to agree with them off the bat or be a supporter but why not wait to see what their goals are before assuming they are long haired hippies wanting a hand out.
    We know what the T.E.A. Party wants, why not the Wall Street group? None of them seem to have a clue nor do they have an alternative, do you? What exactly would you like to see happen?

    I think for the most part it's increased our deficits. I think for a large part it's led to a concentration of wealth to the few. Why exactly are you personalizing this, I actually work in a very good job and do very well but my problems with trickle down are the results of trickle down economics.
    How does a policy that increased Tax revenue and generated 17 million new taxpayers increase the debt? spending causes debt not Reaganomics. What exactly is your problem with trickle down economics? Think trickle up is better or redistribution of wealth?

    Innovation doesn't stop with higher tax rates. This idea that Steve Jobs, Bill Gates, Mark Zuckerman only exist because of lower marginal tax rates and low capital gains tax is false. It's a good sales pitch but it isn't proven with reality. You would have to show an absence of innovation during times of high marginal tax rates for the wealthy which is not the case. I also find it interesting that you have pointed out very progressive innovators who I doubt would quit working if their tax rate went up 5% or so.
    You are missing the point, there isn't only Federal Taxes but there are state and local taxes as well so what is the fair share that the rich should pay? Please give me an amount then tell me how much additional revenue that will generate for the govt? Why is that even an issue?

    Reagan was also a very big deficit spending (Keynesian), Volcker started decreasing interests rates after finally beating inflation in 83', and oil prices dropped globally. To point to tax breaks as the reason is pretty disenginous because taxes are lower now than they were under Reagan. Clinton increased tax rates right before the boom in the 90's. You can't really claim taxes have such an effect on innovation and growth without explaining away the contradictions and other possible causes...which no one can.
    Reagan spent money on the military and with that spending left Clinton a "peace dividend" Why do you have a problem keeping more of your money? Do you have a problem with choosing how to spend it and need the govt. to help you? I assume that you know where your money goes when you spend it. Do you know where your money goes when it goes to the govt?


    And FDR is a very popular President still 60 years after he was President. His economic policies were the polar opposite of Reagans in a lot of ways. Just because he's a popular President does not mean everything he did was perfect.
    We are paying for FDR's New Deal today. His SS program was designed never to be paid out and now is a ponzi scheme.


    I am. You're the one with an idealized picture that doesn't meet reality. I've posted why i think the way I do.
    I back my statements up with verifiable data.


    Like I mentioned, it doesn't mean all his policies were perfect. He was the great communicator not the great economists. Liberals are anti-Reagan because he's the antithesis in economic policies to Liberalism. It's like asking why Libertarians are so anti-Roosevelt.
    No President is perfect but I will support any policy that allows the American people, even you, to keep more of what you earn and thus spend your money on the programs you deem worthy.

  2. #1742
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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires

    EarlzP;1059854252]
    I think sitting out of work for six months is too long,lets make a part of drawing goverment help work for everyone. Neut Gingrich said that people out of work should be going to school, I agree to an extent. Lets have placement programs focused to place people in a position to learn as they wait for openings in their choosen job fields. Going to college or even trade schools gives people an opportunity to learn one part of work, hands on experience provides the final element needed to complete any education. With many seniors now looking to retire lets start to place qualified prospective people in a hands on enviroment where they can gain from the experience and knowledge of those already employed.
    It is now two years, not 6 months and where did that 842 billion dollar first stimulu program go? Placement programs where? Where is the incentive for business to hire people with this Administration demonizing profit and wealth creation and you supporting them? Still waiting for you to tell me what the alternative is to Capitalism?
    EarlzP:You can either be part of the solution or part of the problem, which do you want to be? I did not suggest that businesses hire people, I suggested that people drawing unemployment or any type of government assistance be placed in a related work field, are you following me? Lets say that I am in out of work person drawing unemployment I have completed my degree and I am now ready to go to work, instead of my sitting around as a condition of my unemployment check I am placed with a company that fits my degree or my trade profile, the company I am placed with pays NOTHING and I get the job experience that will help me and any company I find employment with in the future, are you with me now? The baby boomer generation will soon be retiring this assures employers that they have a pool of educated or skilled people that are ready to go and makes it so that sitting home is no longer an option.

    EarlzP
    College loan payments and interest should be put on hold until the graduate is working, the same benefit should be extended to trades people, those without college or trade skills should be given the help they need to acquire an education.
    Where do college loans come from and can't you do better locally? Why is this the role of the Federal Govt?
    EarlzP:Why should any person be denied the opportunity to further their education because they can't obtain a student loan, why should students have to decide between taking a low paying job or getting an education. We have an employment problem in this country we need every potiential Bill Gates or Steve Jobs to have an opportunity to pursue an education in a field that they are interested in. The government "We the People" can make low interest or no interest long term loans ensuring that every young person has a choice, a choice that will not saddle them with a debt that will have a hard time paying off. We can't afford to lose one person who has the desire and the will to further their education

    EarlzP: We need to offer a hand up not a hand out, we need to offer hope in this period of high unemployment not criticism to people who have prepared for a job that is non existant No problem offering an hand up but not a hand out, but that isn't what is happening today.
    The chronic unemployed aren't going back to work and will collect unemployment as long as they can. There are jobs all over the place today but not THE job and sometimes you start low and work your way up. You seem to be unable to grasp that concept
    All people are not lazy bums who do not want to get out and get started. Can you stop with your sterotyping long enough to address the unemployment situation we are faced with. Lets say you are right and that people are not really interested in going to work, what would you suggest to get them motivated to get out and get going, my suggestion is to make drawing their check dependant on their getting up and get going doing some thing to mobilize them and at the same time give them the job exposure that will make them more valuable to employers.

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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post

    Net was a little over 100k but you never count those dropping out of the market, do you? That is disengenuous which you are all the time, the net wasn't 400k but the net is 9.1% unemployment and 16.5% U-6. Glad you are happy with those numbers.
    400,000 ...

    BLS says so ...


    Bureau of Labor Statistics Data




    Now where's that book title, Con? Why are you so afraid to tell me? I am getting the impression you're afraid of the results after I factcheck your bull****.

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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires

    [QUOTE=Conservative;1059854611]
    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbuti View Post
    No matter how you try to spin it -- 400,000 jobs added in September.


    Jimmy Carter made George Bush look bad. Carter created 10 million jobs in 4 years compared to Bush creating 4 million jobs in 8 years.[/QUOTE


    Tell that to the 25+ million unemployed and under employed. You certainly have that liberal compassion.
    I bet they would like to have Carter back considering he was up over twice as much in jobs over half the time period.
    Last edited by winston53660; 10-07-11 at 05:33 PM.

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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post

    It is almost 3 years later and there are still more unemployed than when he took office. How long are you going to blame Bush. Do they teach civics in school? What does Congress do and who controlled Congress in 2008. Democrats or Republicans? Be a good little liberal now and let them destroy your credibility.
    There were 8 million jobs lost to the Great Bush Recession, it will take time to recover from that. Meanwhile, we have a net gain of jobs since then.

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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Writing a loan is one thing, signing on the dotted line is another. To blame the banks solely is ridiculous. Banks got their money by bundling the loans and selling them to Freddie and Fannie, both govt. agencies.
    I'm not blaming banks solely, but I think they deserve some blame. They knew these were bad loans, they wrote them anyway and Bush bailed them out. That's fine, I'm not necessarily saying that was a bad idea, and this isn't about that.

    I do find it somewhat frustrating that after the government pulled these people's asses out of the fire, when they say "Hey, maybe you could pay a little more in taxes since we blew a big wad of cash saving your ass," there's cries of "Class Warfare!" Instead, the counter proposals are to take it out of Social Security, Medicare, and to raise taxes on the working class. Really?

    Let's say you and your friend buy a couple of 6 packs on Friday night, and your friend drinks 9 out of the 12. Would you be wrong to ask him to contribute a little more the next time you guys have some brews?


    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    This issue has been plowed more times than Paris Hilton.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oborosen View Post
    Too bad we have to observe human rights.

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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires

    Quote Originally Posted by rocket88 View Post
    I'm not blaming banks solely, but I think they deserve some blame. They knew these were bad loans, they wrote them anyway and Bush bailed them out. That's fine, I'm not necessarily saying that was a bad idea, and this isn't about that.

    I do find it somewhat frustrating that after the government pulled these people's asses out of the fire, when they say "Hey, maybe you could pay a little more in taxes since we blew a big wad of cash saving your ass," there's cries of "Class Warfare!" Instead, the counter proposals are to take it out of Social Security, Medicare, and to raise taxes on the working class. Really?

    Let's say you and your friend buy a couple of 6 packs on Friday night, and your friend drinks 9 out of the 12. Would you be wrong to ask him to contribute a little more the next time you guys have some brews?
    So we are going to only ask bankers and UAW workers to pay a tax increase?

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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbuti View Post
    400,000 ...

    BLS says so ...


    Bureau of Labor Statistics Data




    Now where's that book title, Con? Why are you so afraid to tell me? I am getting the impression you're afraid of the results after I factcheck your bull****.
    What as the net job change? you know what net means, don't you? My bet is you are also someone who gets a paycheck and has no idea that your expenses have to come out of it.

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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbuti View Post
    There were 8 million jobs lost to the Great Bush Recession, it will take time to recover from that. Meanwhile, we have a net gain of jobs since then.
    Let me know what civics told you about how our govt. runs. How did Bush alone create the 8 million job losses and what did the Democrat Congress in 2007-2011 do to prevent it? Doesn't speak well of Obama and the Democrats, does it?

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    Re: White House Tax Plan Would Ask More of Millionaires

    rocket88;1059854843]I'm not blaming banks solely, but I think they deserve some blame. They knew these were bad loans, they wrote them anyway and Bush bailed them out. That's fine, I'm not necessarily saying that was a bad idea, and this isn't about that.
    Bush had no authority to bail them or anyone else out, Congress had to authorize the spending. Congress under Democrat control with Obama voting yes, gave Bush the money to bail out the banks. Bush spent 350 billion of the 700 billion and left 350 billion for Obama. Most of the money loaned has been repaid so where did that appear on the budget of the U.S.? Hint, it didn't

    I do find it somewhat frustrating that after the government pulled these people's asses out of the fire, when they say "Hey, maybe you could pay a little more in taxes since we blew a big wad of cash saving your ass," there's cries of "Class Warfare!" Instead, the counter proposals are to take it out of Social Security, Medicare, and to raise taxes on the working class. Really?
    Like far too many you buy what the media tells you. Some of the banks didn't want the money and the big ones have paid back the loans with interest. Where are the counter proposals to take money out of SS and Medicare? Raising taxes on the working class? You mean the 65 million working class that don't pay any FIT?


    Let's say you and your friend buy a couple of 6 packs on Friday night, and your friend drinks 9 out of the 12. Would you be wrong to ask him to contribute a little more the next time you guys have some brews?
    Have you ever looked at the budget of the United States? Tell me what part of that budget the rich get more benefit out of than the middle class? Stop buying the rhetoric and get the facts.

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