• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Employers add no net jobs in Aug.; rate unchanged

Status
Not open for further replies.
pbrauer said:
Exactly, you've hit the nail squarely on the head. Why should they hire anyone if there making a profit?
Click to expand...

They are making money by doing more with less. Increase the demand and businesses will hire. Obama isn't doing that by improving incentive
 
Objective Voice said:
WRONG! The President started out seeking a clean debt limit increase - no tax revenue, no spending cuts. He only sought "revenue raisers" after Cantor/Boehner/McConnell insisted on deep spending cuts which would have come primarily from social programs. And even then, the President was offerring a 4-1 deal - $4 trillion in cuts for $1 trillion in revenue over 10-12 years. The GOP idiot trio balked! Get your facts right.
Click to expand...

Clean debt limit increase does nothing but raise the credit card limit and that is and was unacceptable. There are no spending cuts because the base budget used was the record 3.7 trillion plus normal increases.
 
Conservative said:
They are making money by doing more with less. Increase the demand and businesses will hire. Obama isn't doing that by improving incentive
Click to expand...

Q: How many gallons of milk is a rich person going to buy?
 
winston53660 said:
Ahhheemmmm:

[h=1]Executive Order--Delivering an Efficient, Effective, and Accountable Government
[/h] EXECUTIVE ORDER
DELIVERING AN EFFICIENT, EFFECTIVE, AND ACCOUNTABLE GOVERNMENT

Click to expand...


Rhetoric, where's the beef? Aw, here it is


Obama economic results in 2011, .4% GDP and 1% GDP growth in 2011, 25+ million unemployed or under employed Americans in 2011, 4 trillion added to the debt in less than 3 years, and a downgrade of the U.S. credit rating. Rising Misery index 7.83 to 12.67. First President in U.S. History to have our credit downgraded on his watch! 38-41% JAR and well over 50-55% disapproval ratings.
 
Conservative said:
Rhetoric, where's the beef? Aw, here it is

.
Click to expand...

So suddenly certifiable, empirically testable, quantifiable examples of cutting government waste however big or small are rhetoric?

U 2 funny man,:lamo
 
Conservative said:
Aw bull****, stop with the bleeding heart liberal and tell that to Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, and all other self made millionaires who took risk and didn't need govt. to take care of them.

Your lack of understanding of the private sector is an indictment of our education system today. In a free enterprise society there are going to be people that cannot compete and are going to be left behind. That is their own fault and not the role of the govt. to raise them up beyond their ability to compete. Failure is not only an option with liberalism but an expectation so as to create dependent people
Click to expand...

There you go again trying to call people "uneducated" with your "indictment of our education system" rant. Shove it, Mister! And stop trying to use Microsoft as a template for how anyone can go from rags to riches. The Microsoft story is a unique on; we're talking two young individuals from MIT who were able to get in on the ground floor of the home computing and software industry but who had alot of help moving up that economic ladder.

Yes, there will always be people who are poor or who just ascend to average means, but fewer people of average means seek government aid than you think. And even some poor people are proud people and will only go to the government for help as a last resort. Of course, there are some who take advantage of the system, but to label every person of average or poor means as lazy, shift-less, drug addicts, or moochers is just stupid and biggoted on your part. BTW, I understand the "private sector" very well for an "average" person.
 
winston53660 said:
So suddenly certifiable, empirically testable, quantifiable examples of cutting government waste however big or small are rhetoric?

U 2 funny man,:lamo
Click to expand...

Then we don't need a 3.7 trillion dollar govt. do we? What was the 2012 budget request from the President?
 
Objective Voice said:
There you go again trying to call people "uneducated" with your "indictment of our education system" rant. Shove it, Mister! And stop trying to use Microsoft as a template for how anyone can go from rags to riches. The Microsoft story is a unique on; we're talking two young individuals from MIT who were able to get in on the ground floor of the home computing and software industry but who had alot of help moving up that economic ladder.

Yes, there will always be people who are poor or who just ascend to average means, but fewer people of average means seek government aid than you think. And even some poor people are proud people and will only go to the government for help as a last resort. Of course, there are some who take advantage of the system, but to label every person of average or poor means as lazy, shift-less, drug addicts, or moochers is just stupid and biggoted on your part. BTW, I understand the "private sector" very well for an "average" person.
Click to expand...

I forgot how I had to be very precise with a liberal and used too obvious of an example. Millions of small businesses have created success over time and that has made millionaires out of small middle class individuals. You have a better alternative than free enterprise and capitalism? All I see is whining. Keep underestimating the human spirit and entreprenuerial spirit.
 
Conservative said:
Unemployment numbers by month. 2 Million? Hmmmm

2008 7628 7435 7793 7631 8397 8560 8895 9509 9569 10172 10617 11400
2009 11919 12714 13310 13816 14518 14721 14534 14993 15159 15612 15340 15267
Click to expand...
You really should stay clear of numbers. You get cut every time you neglect to heed that advice.
 
winston53660 said:
Maybe we do maybe we don't.



You got google look it up.
Click to expand...

I have and know what it is, but you continue to buy the Obama rhetoric and ignore his own proposals. If you cut waste why do you need a bigger budget?
 
Conservative said:
I have and know what it is, but you continue to buy the Obama rhetoric and ignore his own proposals. If you cut waste why do you need a bigger budget?
Click to expand...

So I should "buy" your cliche driven arguments?


I think I'll pass.
 
Conservative said:
Obamacare is one especially for the small businesses. Govt. shutdown of drilling in the Gulf, NLRB actions in S. Carolina, uncertainly about the tax code and policy. I could go on.
Click to expand...

The taxes under Obamacare don't come into effect until 2014.

The deep water drilling moritorum has long since been lifted.

How does the National Labor Relations Board dilemma in SC impact the entire nation?

Tax policy...this is a new argument...really didn't become an issue until Obama came into the White House. Your side keeps arguing that the corporate tax rate is too high compared to other industrialized nations, but I don't recall GWB seeking to lower it at any time throughout his tenure. So, why has it suddenly become this big issue within the last 2-3 years? Furthermore, if you're going to make the argument that our nation's economic policies are hampering job growth, were were you 4-8 years ago informing your Republican/Conservative leadership to change the tax codes back then?
 
Sheik Yerbuti said:
You really should stay clear of numbers. You get cut every time you neglect to heed that advice.
Click to expand...

Let's see, October unemployment 10172 and January 11919 and the difference is what? stop lying, Sheik.
 
Grim17 said:
A picture is worth a thousand words...

View attachment 67115424
Click to expand...
That sure is a nice what to hide the fact that Clinton inherited an unemployment rate of 7.3% and handed Bush an unemployment rate of 4.2%, who in turn handed Obama an unemployment rate of 7.8%.
 
Objective Voice said:
The taxes under Obamacare don't come into effect until 2014.

The deep water drilling moritorum has long since been lifted.

How does the National Labor Relations Board dilemma in SC impact the entire nation?

Tax policy...this is a new argument...really didn't become an issue until Obama came into the White House. Your side keeps arguing that the corporate tax rate is too high compared to other industrialized nations, but I don't recall GWB seeking to lower it at any time throughout his tenure. So, why has it suddenly become this big issue within the last 2-3 years? Furthermore, if you're going to make the argument that our nation's economic policies are hampering job growth, were were you 4-8 years ago informing your Republican/Conservative leadership to change the tax codes back then?
Click to expand...

Businesses operate on a five year plan, not year to year and don't print their own money.

deep water drilling was lifted late causing unemployment and drills to move overseas.

NLRB facts S. Carolina employment and unemployment which goes into the national numbers.

Tax policy affects a 5 year plan of business.

Classes out today?
 
Sheik Yerbuti said:
That sure is a nice what to hide the fact that Clinton inherited an unemployment rate of 7.3% and handed Bush an unemployment rate of 4.2%, who in turn handed Obama an unemployment rate of 7.8%.
Click to expand...

Let's put the Bush/Obama record side by side starting with the unemployment numbers

Year Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
2001 4.2 4.2 4.3 4.4 4.3 4.5 4.6 4.9 5.0 5.3 5.5 5.7
2002 5.7 5.7 5.7 5.9 5.8 5.8 5.8 5.7 5.7 5.7 5.9 6.0
2003 5.8 5.9 5.9 6.0 6.1 6.3 6.2 6.1 6.1 6.0 5.8 5.7
2004 5.7 5.6 5.8 5.6 5.6 5.6 5.5 5.4 5.4 5.5 5.4 5.4
2005 5.3 5.4 5.2 5.2 5.1 5.0 5.0 4.9 5.0 5.0 5.0 4.9
2006 4.7 4.8 4.7 4.7 4.6 4.6 4.7 4.7 4.5 4.4 4.5 4.4
2007 4.6 4.5 4.4 4.5 4.4 4.6 4.7 4.6 4.7 4.7 4.7 5.0
2008 5.0 4.8 5.1 4.9 5.4 5.6 5.8 6.1 6.2 6.6 6.8 7.3
2009 7.8 8.2 8.6 8.9 9.4 9.5 9.5 9.7 9.8 10.1 9.9 9.9
2010 9.7 9.7 9.7 9.8 9.6 9.5 9.5 9.6 9.6 9.7 9.8 9.4
2011 9.0 8.9 8.8 9.0 9.1 9.2 9.1 9.1
 
it's time to take a look at our economic model / trade agreements, because if businesses don't step up hiring domestically, government will. we can either pay more for consumer goods or we can pay more taxes for entitlements. if we spend it on domestically made goods, there is more tax revenue which makes less borrowing possible. if we don't, cutting borrowing will be unlikely to impossible.

i can attest that it's a crap job market. i navigated it in '09, found contract work, and have been navigating it again recently as my contract ends. luckily, i found out today that my old job opened up again, i applied immediately, and i think i got it. to say i'm relieved would be the understatement of the year.
 
Conservative said:
I posted the Bush unemployment rate for his entire term vs. Obama's. Still waiting for you to post a side by side comparison.
Click to expand...
Bush, unemployment went from 4.2% to 7.8% -- a 3.6 point jump (86% increase)
Obama, unemployment went from 7.8% to 9.1% -- a 1.3 point jump (17% increase)

G'head, Con, this is where you cry that I'm off-topic again.
 
Last edited:
Conservative said:
I forgot how I had to be very precise with a liberal and used too obvious of an example. Millions of small businesses have created success over time and that has made millionaires out of small middle class individuals. You have a better alternative than free enterprise and capitalism? All I see is whining. Keep underestimating the human spirit and entreprenuerial spirit.
Click to expand...

There you go again trying to be condescending.

Yes, millions of Americans have started their own businesses - some out of their garages or from their kitchen tables - and are making hundreds of thousands if not millions of dollars today because they were able to turn their ideas into a product or service the free market system wants. I'm in no way arguing that. But...

Some of those individuals financed their business venture out of their own pocket using their life savings, credit cards, or perhaps they sold damned near everything they had to get the money they needed. OR...

Some borrowed money from friends and family. OR...

Some sought loans either from local/commercial banks. OR...

Some acquired the financial backing from venture capitalist. OR...

Some sought small business loans from the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT or recieved FEDERAL grant money.

Either way, the individual - whether college educated, high school graduate or no formal education at all - took a change, assessed the risks - and became successful entrepreneurs. Not everyone will be able to "see" their opportunity when such presents itself and not everyone will be able to capitalize on that opportunity when it comes their way. Life sometimes gets in the way while on the other hand some people just get lucky. Either way, I don't begrudge those who are successful anymore than I envy them.
 
Sheik Yerbuti said:
Bush, unemployment went from 4.2% to 7.8% -- a 3.6 point jump (86% increase)
Obama, unemployment went from 7.8% to 9.1% -- a 1.3 point jump (17% increase)

G'head, Con, this is where you cry that I'm off-topic again.
Click to expand...

Just stop with the rhetoric !:lamo:monkey:fly:
 
Conservative said:
Employment in November 2008 was 143.9 and employment January 2009 was 142.2 that isn't 2.4 million nor is the unemployment numbers from BLS so you can stop with the distortion and diversion.
Click to expand...
Holy, ****, Con! Stay away from numbers!!!

First of all, your 143.9 figure is through the end of November. The point made was that 2 million jobs disappeared between the election and inauguration. Yet here you are, lying by starting with December 1, figures.

Secondly, the numbers you post don't even match the numbers on BLS. BLS currently shows 144068 for 11/2008 enmployment. I highly recommend you refresh your personal stash.

So to wrap up your post, you provided the forum with completely bogus numbers and you lied about which month to start counting from in relation to the election.
 
Conservative said:
Businesses operate on a five year plan, not year to year and don't print their own money.

deep water drilling was lifted late causing unemployment and drills to move overseas.

NLRB facts S. Carolina employment and unemployment which goes into the national numbers.

Tax policy affects a 5 year plan of business.

Classes out today?
Click to expand...

So, what you're telling me is that althought Obamacare was signed into law in Mar 2010 businesses can't adjust the tailend of their 5-yr plan to incorporate tax increases, if any, that may apply to them?

As I said in another thread recently, businesses need to STOP USING THE PPACA AS AN EXCUSE NOT TO HIRE! The projections are still 3-4 years out and have nothing to do with them planning for today. Moreover, if as you say businesses work on 5-year planning cycles, it's clear then that some have planned rather poorly don't you think?
 
Sheik Yerbuti said:
Bush, unemployment went from 4.2% to 7.8% -- a 3.6 point jump (86% increase)
Obama, unemployment went from 7.8% to 9.1% -- a 1.3 point jump (17% increase)

G'head, Con, this is where you cry that I'm off-topic again.
Click to expand...

Unemployment rate by month

Year Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
2001 4.2 4.2 4.3 4.4 4.3 4.5 4.6 4.9 5.0 5.3 5.5 5.7
2002 5.7 5.7 5.7 5.9 5.8 5.8 5.8 5.7 5.7 5.7 5.9 6.0
2003 5.8 5.9 5.9 6.0 6.1 6.3 6.2 6.1 6.1 6.0 5.8 5.7
2004 5.7 5.6 5.8 5.6 5.6 5.6 5.5 5.4 5.4 5.5 5.4 5.4
2005 5.3 5.4 5.2 5.2 5.1 5.0 5.0 4.9 5.0 5.0 5.0 4.9
2006 4.7 4.8 4.7 4.7 4.6 4.6 4.7 4.7 4.5 4.4 4.5 4.4
2007 4.6 4.5 4.4 4.5 4.4 4.6 4.7 4.6 4.7 4.7 4.7 5.0
2008 5.0 4.8 5.1 4.9 5.4 5.6 5.8 6.1 6.2 6.6 6.8 7.3
2009 7.8 8.2 8.6 8.9 9.4 9.5 9.5 9.7 9.8 10.1 9.9 9.9
2010 9.7 9.7 9.7 9.8 9.6 9.5 9.5 9.6 9.6 9.7 9.8 9.4
2011 9.0 8.9 8.8 9.0 9.1 9.2 9.1 9.1
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom