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Thread: Employers add no net jobs in Aug.; rate unchanged

  1. #981
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    Re: Employers add no net jobs in Aug.; rate unchanged

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael H View Post
    Lets recap ... you don't know what a loan is, you don't know what a bailout us, you can't add to 16 trillion, you don't know what secrecy is, you don't know what a conspiracy is, and your waiting for someone else to research for you.

    Your also a protector of the faithful like Iron Man, protecting America from lowbrow agendas, for truth, righteousness and theeeeeeeee American waaaayy. Protect us Captain Goldenbuoy.
    This miserable attempt to save face displays your desperation.

    Did you provide evidence of conspiracy? Unawareness is not conspiracy.
    You are labeling the discount window and Fed funds overnight market as "secret"! Which of course is nonsense.

    So we have gone from me stating there were 16 trillion dollars in secret bailouts to ... your request for info whom was it loaned to, liability, and are their any defaults. And the FED not having 16 trillion. And a lesson in banking for me. Bank of America taking 1 day loans for 100 billion 160 times ... So I misrepresented notional amounts and you as yet had no info on the loans.
    I actually researched the the GAO report, found the figures, and located the discrepancy to which the counting techniques were manipulated to make the total loan amount seem larger than it should. Instead of looking at the pictures, i actually read this section of the report to which it stated:

    Table 8 aggregates total dollar transaction amounts by adding the total dollar amount of all loans but does not adjust these amounts to reflect differences across programs in the term over which loans were outstanding. For example, an overnight PDCF loan of $10 billion that was renewed daily at the same level for 30 business days would result in an aggregate amount borrowed of $300 billion although the institution, in effect, borrowed only $10 billion over 30 days. In contrast, a TAF loan of $10 billion extended over a 1-month period would appear as $10 billion. As a result, the total transaction amounts shown in table 8 for PDCF are not directly comparable to the total transaction amounts shown for TAF and other programs that made loans for periods longer than overnight.
    Source
    I am not sure if you have a reading comprehension problem, little interest in understanding the subject, or a little bit of both; but it should be obvious to anyone as to why the total figure of $16 is intellectually dishonest.

    Do you understand what "but does not adjust these amounts to reflect differences across programs in the term over which loans were outstanding." means?

    Basically ... look for your self if you are interested. Foreign and national interests were helped.
    Your ignorance is brewing. Primary dealers have had the ability to access the fed funds market and discount window since way before this this report came about. In fact, any member bank that is running below their required reserve ratio is basically required to go to either of these sources. An institution such as Deutche Bank is in fact a primary dealer!

    If the counting techniques were applied throughout all lending facilities, i have little doubt they could have come up with a number of $40 trillion. None the less, such practice is not a GAAP.

    Now that's a doozy ... a loan is not a bailout.
    The fed funds market and discount window is not a bailout. Instead, they are an aspect of how the Fed conducts monetary policy.

    The FED expectations as a lender have what to do with the amounts they loaned? 16 Trillion reduced to to 16 Billion? Were the loans secret? Did anyone in government have knowledge of these loans? Did any of these loans make it into a newspaper?
    Nothing you posted above is of importance, because the Fed is mandated to act independent of political will. When Bank of America makes a loan to a Japanese company operating in the U.S., should this be considered a bailout or worthy of being national news? In fact, the only news sources that featured this "story" are associated with fringe elements.

    Actually 16 trillion is technically correct ... that was the amount of the loans.
    Technically, it is not because the same counting techniques were not held constant throught the summary.

    but does not adjust these amounts to reflect differences across programs in the term over which loans were outstanding.
    If you would like to prove the GAO report of 266 pages is a lie ... step up to the plate.
    Never said they were lies, only intellectually dishonest.

    So is an overnight loan ... not a loan? Is it the money fairy come to visit you in your sleep?
    An overnight loan is certainly not a bailout! That much should be crystal clear, otherwise every time the Fed expands it's balance sheet, it is bailing out financial institutions.

    Page 144 of the report ... see that little number in the lower right hand corner ... that's the loan amount.
    On page 143, you will see these funny little things called words. Learn to read them!

    sanders.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/GAO Fed Investigation.pdf

    This is where I have to explain to an economics expert that a loan is a bailout. You didn't actually respond to this did you?
    So when i trade on my margin account, essentially Interactive Brokers is giving me a bailout because it is in fact an overnight loan (technically speaking, it is a function of the brokerages overnight money market sweep). Of course not.

    This is where I have to explain to you it was a one time audit the FED was trying to avoid. See when you have no oversight ... you can do what ever you want ... like 16 trillion in secret loans.
    The political motive behind this audit cannot be denied (See Ron Paul). Therefore, i find it hilarious that you have essentially opened your mouth and inserted your foot thigh deep. Next time you want to make a statement, make sure to have enough ammo to back it up.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

  2. #982
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    Re: Employers add no net jobs in Aug.; rate unchanged

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    So how do we change that and what do we do now to solve our financial problems? Keep looking back and ignoring what is going in right now
    Well, it is true, we should not have gone into Iraq in the first place, but if we don't recognize that history, we will repeat it sooner or later. You have to face the past before you can learn from it.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  3. #983
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    Re: Employers add no net jobs in Aug.; rate unchanged

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Well, it is true, we should not have gone into Iraq in the first place, but if we don't recognize that history, we will repeat it sooner or later. You have to face the past before you can learn from it.
    How does Iraq affect what is going on right now and the fact that we have a net job loss since this President took office?

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    Re: Employers add no net jobs in Aug.; rate unchanged

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    How does Iraq affect what is going on right now and the fact that we have a net job loss since this President took office?
    It is still costly, and we still have people dying there. Today.

    Again, the government doesn't control jobs. If you want to charge government with jobs, you are in essence asking the government to hire people.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  5. #985
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    Re: Employers add no net jobs in Aug.; rate unchanged

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    In reality it's actually the other way around. People tend to spend money if it's doled out in small quantities, as Obama has done with the payroll tax cuts. When you hand out the money in a lump sum, as Bush did, people tend to bank it or use it to pay down debt.
    You will stretch the truth to fit you views to any length won't you? The Bush tax cuts were a one time payment ??? Guess there is no need to do anything with them then huh ?

    While on the other hand, wasn't a portion of the stimulus a one time tax refund of about 400 dollars ?
    Tell Me how is this payroll tax break (temporary tax break) working on stimulating the economy? We haven't moved off the 9% unemployment rate for months now … just another of your great success stories I guess.

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    Re: Employers add no net jobs in Aug.; rate unchanged

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    It is still costly, and we still have people dying there. Today.

    Again, the government doesn't control jobs. If you want to charge government with jobs, you are in essence asking the government to hire people.
    The govt controls the atmosphere for creating jobs and if you think that economic policy such as Obamacare doesn't raise concerns with business you are very naive.

  7. #987
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    Re: Employers add no net jobs in Aug.; rate unchanged

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    From your own article: "Social Security’s shortfall will not affect current benefits. As long as the IOUs last, benefits will keep flowing. But experts say it is a warning sign that the program’s finances are deteriorating. Social Security is projected to drain its trust funds by 2037 unless Congress acts."

    It is a problem, but not an urgent problem.

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    Re: Employers add no net jobs in Aug.; rate unchanged

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    So how do we change that and what do we do now to solve our financial problems? Keep looking back and ignoring what is going in right now
    you did ask this question didn't you?
    Did you serve in Iraq or how did Iraq affect you or your family?
    In answer to your ingestion of " how do we change that and what do we do now to solve our financial problems? "That,s been told to you numerous times,by myself and others but you keep ignoring the answers.
    The haggardness of poverty is everywhere seen contrasted with the sleekness of wealth, the exhorted labor of some compensating for the idleness of others, wretched hovels by the side of stately colonnades, the rags of indigence blended with the ensigns of opulence; in a word, the most useless profusion in the midst of the most urgent wants.Jean-Baptiste Say

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    Re: Employers add no net jobs in Aug.; rate unchanged

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    The govt controls the atmosphere for creating jobs and if you think that economic policy such as Obamacare doesn't raise concerns with business you are very naive.
    Not near as much as you think. As noted for you above, business did quite well with higher tax rates, for example. And business overall would prefer UHC because it wouold take that burden away from them.

    But these are separate issues overall. the fact is government can't control jobs. Not without hiring people themselves anyway.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  10. #990
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    Re: Employers add no net jobs in Aug.; rate unchanged

    Quote Originally Posted by The Barbarian View Post
    You will stretch the truth to fit you views to any length won't you? The Bush tax cuts were a one time payment ??? Guess there is no need to do anything with them then huh ?

    While on the other hand, wasn't a portion of the stimulus a one time tax refund of about 400 dollars ?
    Tell Me how is this payroll tax break (temporary tax break) working on stimulating the economy? We haven't moved off the 9% unemployment rate for months now … just another of your great success stories I guess.
    I wasn't referring to the Bush tax cuts, but rather to his 2008 tax rebate. It's okay to ask questions. You don't always have to go off half cocked.

    http://www.usatoday.com/money/perfi/...e-checks_N.htm

    The Bush rebate was a lump sum payment, as opposed to Obama's payroll tax cut, which was prorated so that people receive a portion of it in each paycheck.
    Last edited by AdamT; 09-07-11 at 05:33 PM.

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