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Thread: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree'

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    Again, if a white person and a black person apply for the same job with the same resume, the white person is 2.4 times more likely to get an interview. So I guess you have that backwards, eh?



    Honestly, this is just a wild eyed white supremacist rant... Obviously none of those things are remotely true.
    Get ****ing real.....

    It can cost a company around 30- 40k just to make the call to "switch on" their legal department for a case.

    That means if some dirtbag understands the system well enough, he/she can **** up and avoid getting fired by just offering to sign a paper saying they won't sue, the company ...and they'll be able to quit and walk away with a check for up to $40k. ...It's called "Mutual Separation".

    And if you think that's ****ed up, they can put, the company down as a reference and if someone calls, the company....the company can't say **** except that person X worked here between these dates. All in the name of avoiding legal liability....

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by 1Perry View Post
    I'm supposed to counter something you just made up?
    I didn't make it up. I keep posting the link to one of the studies- Discrimination in a Low-Wage Labor Market: A Field Experiment by Devah Pager, Bruce Western, Bart Bonikowski :: SSRN

    If you have some evidence we can weigh against that, lets see it. If not, then that's that.

    Quote Originally Posted by 1Perry View Post
    It isn't a court transcript. I post an actual example. You? Nothing.
    Maybe you're misunderstanding my position. I am not saying that past discrimination can never come into play. It certainly can. A pattern of discrimination can be evidence in a discrimination case. But, it's hard to get evidence of a pattern of discrimination into the court record. Circumstantial evidence such as statistics about the number of people of a particular race is not definitive proof of discrimination. There are plenty of legitimate reasons that a company might hire very few of a particular race. So, you can't bring those numbers up in court because they might be prejudicial. People would perceive it as evidence that there is a pattern of discrimination even if there isn't really one. Courts are very careful about what they let juries see. You need harder evidence, such as they found in that case where the CEO basically admitted that they were doing it.

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by ric27 View Post
    Get ****ing real.....

    It can cost a company around 30- 40k just to make the call to "switch on" their legal department for a case.

    That means if some dirtbag understands the system well enough, he/she can **** up and avoid getting fired by just offering to sign a paper saying they won't sue, the company ...and they'll be able to quit and walk away with a check for up to $40k. ...It's called "Mutual Separation".

    And if you think that's ****ed up, they can put, the company down as a reference and if someone calls, the company....the company can't say **** except that person X worked here between these dates. All in the name of avoiding legal liability....
    Not sure how that has anything to do with anything. Can you spell your argument out more?

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    I didn't make it up. I keep posting the link to one of the studies-
    No, you are making it up as you go. Your first arguement was that the two had the same qualifications. You then switched it to that white person getting hired even though the minority had better qualifications.

    Maybe you're misunderstanding my position. I am not saying that past discrimination can never come into play. It certainly can.
    It's nice to see you change your position to the factual one. The rest of your post is simple subjecture on your part to cover for your error.

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    First off, the idea that it is the victim's responsibility and that the people committing these crimes should just be allowed to continue as is is morally abhorrent. Do you apply the same philosophy to other types of crime? Should we not worry about trying to stop rape and just tell women to be more careful?
    Earth to "Out of Touch Liberal." Earth calling "Out of Touch Liberal," do you read, over. Hello. Hello. Is there any sentient life in "Out of Touch Liberal" land?

    Freedom of association is not a crime, no matter how much liberals want to make it one.

    You can't make employers undertake financially reckless hiring decisions. These are probabalistic decisions. They are unfair to the individual who is hit with a group characteristic, but there is the other side of the equation - an employer doesn't know which 10 of the 40 people he hires are going to be a bad fit for the company and end up costing the company money. Hiring people who don't work out is an expensive undertaking. Are you willing to pay all employers who have to fire employees who don't work out? You seem quite happy to force them to make unwise decisions in order to further the interests of the individual because you believe that the individual is paying a price for something that isn't his fault. Well the same applies to the employer - it's not his fault that there are observed racial differences in work-related characteristics and no one is stepping up to protect his interests.

    You yourself have agreed with Becker's conclusion - irrational discriminators will put themselves at a competitive disadvantage when compared to their competitors who don't irrationally discriminate and thus just harm themselves. The problem will solve itself if employers are irrationally discriminating. If they're rationally discriminating then the outcomes that result are not their fault.

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverDad View Post
    Earth to "Out of Touch Liberal." Earth calling "Out of Touch Liberal," do you read, over. Hello. Hello. Is there any sentient life in "Out of Touch Liberal" land?

    Freedom of association is not a crime, no matter how much liberals want to make it one.
    Uh, yes, racial employment discrimination is illegal... You've heard of the Civil Rights Act, no?

    I'm just going to ignore all the openly white supremacist crap about how it is financially reckless to hire black people and whatnot... That is a serious emotional and intellectual problem you have there, but I'm not going to be able to help you fix it on some internet forum.
    Last edited by teamosil; 09-03-11 at 07:51 PM.

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverDad View Post
    Freedom of association is not a crime, no matter how much liberals want to make it one
    Actually, discriminating based on race is a crime which is what teamosil is referring to. That's not really debatable.

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    Most liberals point out that discrimination exists as a barrier to success. Then people like you interpret that as "convincing a large portion of the black community that they can't succeed". What you don't seem to understand is that the main liberal argument regarding discrimination is that exists as a barrier to success. The argument is NOT that it exists as an unconquerable barrier to success - which is what you seem to think with your constant assertions that "Leftists" are telling blacks that they can't succeed.

    Now the reason many liberals consider it important to point out racial discrimination is not to "convince people they can't succeed" or anything like that. The reason is that we see it as a tangible problem that can be eliminated in part by the government through things like equal access to quality education.
    As long as you use it as the soul excuse for fewer successful blacks than successful whites, that's how it's going to be interpreted.

    The biggest problem, is the denial that racism isn't the only reason for a lack of success within the black community and anyone that points that out is automatically labled a racist. It's become such a taboo to criticize the black community, that it's impossible for the black community as a whole to take a good honest look at itself. Michael Nutter said it perfect a few weeks ago in a speech to a Philly youth group, and so long as black continue to harm their race and Libbos make it impossible for anyone to point that out, for fear of being called a racist, the statistics that are in the OP will never change.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    Actually, discriminating based on race is a crime which is what teamosil is referring to. That's not really debatable.
    Really? Can you show me criminal statutes which declare this to be so?

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    First off, the idea that it is the victim's responsibility and that the people committing these crimes should just be allowed to continue as is is morally abhorrent. Do you apply the same philosophy to other types of crime? Should we not worry about trying to stop rape and just tell women to be more careful?
    As long as there are so many black people that go way out of their way to prove the stereotypes correct, it will be the responsibility of the victims to disprove that stereotype.

    Second, success isn't binary. It isn't like you are either successful or not. It's a matter of degree. It could well be that you would have been more successful were there less racial discrimination.
    There are way more factors that effect success than just race.

    Third, even if your success was completely unaffected by discrimination, obviously that isn't the case for everybody. Just because you overcame it, we shouldn't worry about those who were hit harder by it?
    Those people have a responsibility to themselves to advance their lives, despite any discrimination they might have faced. Sitting on the porch and boo-hooing about being black isn't the appropriate response.

    What kind of work do you do?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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