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Thread: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree'

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    What myth would you be referring to?
    the myth of equal opportunity
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    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverDad View Post
    Be sure to note the debunking of that study (comment #259) here and additional information (comment #349 here.
    Noted. I noticed he didn't do much with your comments on it either. Oh well..

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    You're trying to blame that totally on racism and that's where you're going wrong. The black community and the do-gooders share some responsibility, as well.
    It can't be anything other than racism. That is all that differs between the applicants- their race. Read the study. It's insane how far they went to ensure that nothing else differed. They all have IQs, education levels and incomes in real life that are in the same bracket. They all scored in the same range in terms of grammar usage and they eliminated any that had a notable accent. They are all roughly the same height. They had panels of people rate them for attractiveness and paired up ones that matched. They had them dress the same and had them say the same exact things when they dropped off the resumes. They even tested for things like how many times a minute the person makes eye contact and whatnot to make sure that matches. There really is nothing, except the color of their skin, that differs. So, discrimination on the basis of skin color is racism by definition. There isn't any blaming required.

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    That's exactly what you're doing.

    That sentence proves my point.
    So how do you propose we tackle the issue of racism as a society?

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    They all scored in the same range in terms of grammar usage and they eliminated any that had a notable accent. They are all roughly the same height. They had panels of people rate them for attractiveness and paired up ones that matched. They had them dress the same and had them say the same exact things when they dropped off the resumes. They even tested for things like how many times a minute the person makes eye contact and whatnot to make sure that matches. There really is nothing, except the color of their skin, that differs. So, discrimination on the basis of skin color is racism by definition. There isn't any blaming required.
    This really speaks to the experiment design. Controlling for a lot of variables doesn't make the experiment that much more accurate when the variables that are controlled only play a minor part in the process under study. Making eye contract and such other minute behaviors are not the crucial factors that determine how an employer evaluates LOW SKILLED LABOR. Employers want HARD WORKING, RELIABLE and PLIABLE workers who do their jobs, do them well, and take direction easily. Eye contact when speaking to someone is very low on the list of what is needed from a MANUAL LABORER.

    So how do you propose we tackle the issue of racism as a society?
    1.) Quit calling everyone a racist. People don't like being blamed for something that they're not doing.
    2.) Make sure the playing field is level and then leave it all alone.

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverDad View Post
    This really speaks to the experiment design. Controlling for a lot of variables doesn't make the experiment that much more accurate when the variables that are controlled only play a minor part in the process under study. Making eye contract and such other minute behaviors are not the crucial factors that determine how an employer evaluates LOW SKILLED LABOR. Employers want HARD WORKING, RELIABLE and PLIABLE workers who do their jobs, do them well, and take direction easily. Eye contact when speaking to someone is very low on the list of what is needed from a MANUAL LABORER.
    I don't think you understand. That is the point. The only thing that differs is race, so, apparently, employers are making extreme assumptions about how hard working, reliable or pliable workers are based solely on their race. That's what racism is.

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverDad View Post
    1.) Quit calling everyone a racist. People don't like being blamed for something that they're not doing.
    LOL. Yeah, right. Pretend it doesn't exist and it will just disappear like magic?

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverDad View Post
    2.) Make sure the playing field is level and then leave it all alone.
    Ah ha! Here we go! So, tell me, how do you think we should level the playing field? So far you seem to have vehemently opposed any and all attempts to reduce the massive inequality of opportunity. Are you changing your tune? What measures do you support to accomplish this?

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    the myth of equal opportunity
    There's equal oppurtunity for anyone--regardless of race, or sex--with the gonads to go out and get it.

    I did it and the Libbos on this forum constantly claim that I'm stupid, so I reckon it can't be that difficult.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    It can't be anything other than racism. That is all that differs between the applicants- their race. Read the study. It's insane how far they went to ensure that nothing else differed. They all have IQs, education levels and incomes in real life that are in the same bracket. They all scored in the same range in terms of grammar usage and they eliminated any that had a notable accent. They are all roughly the same height. They had panels of people rate them for attractiveness and paired up ones that matched. They had them dress the same and had them say the same exact things when they dropped off the resumes. They even tested for things like how many times a minute the person makes eye contact and whatnot to make sure that matches. There really is nothing, except the color of their skin, that differs. So, discrimination on the basis of skin color is racism by definition. There isn't any blaming required.
    You're in overdrive, proving my point.



    So how do you propose we tackle the issue of racism as a society?
    Over-come it. That's how. I didn't let it stop me from becoming successful in life.

    Had I listened to the likes of you, I would have deemed it hopeless and wouldn't have even tried. Instead, I would have given up and waited for the Liberal do-gooders to come along with a handout for me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Sure it does, and not just against blacks. However, it's the responsibility of each individual to get ahead in spite of that discrimination. So far, the Leftists haven't done anything, other than to convince a large portion of the black community that they can't succeed, because they can't get passed the racism.
    Most liberals point out that discrimination exists as a barrier to success. Then people like you interpret that as "convincing a large portion of the black community that they can't succeed". What you don't seem to understand is that the main liberal argument regarding discrimination is that exists as a barrier to success. The argument is NOT that it exists as an unconquerable barrier to success - which is what you seem to think with your constant assertions that "Leftists" are telling blacks that they can't succeed.

    Now the reason many liberals consider it important to point out racial discrimination is not to "convince people they can't succeed" or anything like that. The reason is that we see it as a tangible problem that can be eliminated in part by the government through things like equal access to quality education.

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Over-come it. That's how. I didn't let it stop me from becoming successful in life.
    First off, the idea that it is the victim's responsibility and that the people committing these crimes should just be allowed to continue as is is morally abhorrent. Do you apply the same philosophy to other types of crime? Should we not worry about trying to stop rape and just tell women to be more careful?

    Second, success isn't binary. It isn't like you are either successful or not. It's a matter of degree. It could well be that you would have been more successful were there less racial discrimination.

    Third, even if your success was completely unaffected by discrimination, obviously that isn't the case for everybody. Just because you overcame it, we shouldn't worry about those who were hit harder by it?

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    Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    Just blurting out your assumptions is not debating. The scientific studies all show that it is actually whites, not blacks, who are being hired despite being less qualified. If you have any evidence countering that, by all means, lets see it. Otherwise you lose.
    I'm supposed to counter something you just made up?

    Again, read your own article. It talks about where that accusation comes from- the CEO's statements. I don't see anything in there about hiring statistics being used in court. If I'm just missing it, by all means, quote the relevant section here. Otherwise, just be more careful about accurately describing what your sources say in the future.
    It isn't a court transcript. I post an actual example. You? Nothing.

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