Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree'

Henrin · Sep 2, 2011

Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

pbrauer said:
It was Northern legislators from both political parties and President LBJ who pushed for it to get the Civil Rights Act of 1964 passed.

Only about 58% of democrats voted for it while 80% of republicans voted for it.

1Perry · Sep 2, 2011

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pbrauer said:
It was Northern legislators from both political parties and President LBJ who pushed for it to get the Civil Rights Act of 1964 passed.

"In late November 1963 the assassination of John F. Kennedy changed the political situation. The new president, Lyndon Johnson, utilized his experience in legislative politics and the bully pulpit he wielded as president in support of the bill. In his first address to Congress on November 27, 1963, Johnson told the legislators, "No memorial oration or eulogy could more eloquently honor President Kennedy's memory than the earliest possible passage of the civil rights bill for which he fought so long."

Civil Rights Act of 1964 - Johnson and passage Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

By party and region

Note: "Southern", as used in this section, refers to members of Congress from the eleven states that made up the Confederate States of America in the American Civil War. "Northern" refers to members from the other 39 states, regardless of the geographic location of those states.

The original House version:

Southern Democrats: 7–87 (7%–93%)
Southern Republicans: 0–10 (0%–100%)
Northern Democrats: 145-9 (94%–6%)
Northern Republicans: 138-24 (85%–15%)
The Senate version:

Southern Democrats: 1–20 (5%–95%)
Southern Republicans: 0–1 (0%–100%)
Northern Democrats: 45-1 (98%–2%)
Northern Republicans: 27-5 (84%–16%)

I still don't understand this arguement nor the need for it. Let's say there were elements of racism 45 years ago. Nobody will deny there was. How does that make racism somehow O.K. today? Especially by those in Congress yelling "racism" the loudest? How is it that we can accept this unless it's really not about racism?

AdamT · Sep 2, 2011

Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

Henrin said:
Only about 58% of democrats voted for it while 80% of republicans voted for it.

The vote was on North/South lines -- not party lines. But it was Johnson's pro-civil-rights stand, and Goldwater's anti-civil-rights stand that pushed the Southern Democrats into the Republican party.

j-mac · Sep 2, 2011

Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

1Perry said:
I still don't understand this arguement nor the need for it. Let's say there were elements of racism 45 years ago. Nobody will deny there was. How does that make racism somehow O.K. today? Especially by those in Congress yelling "racism" the loudest? How is it that we can accept this unless it's really not about racism?

Absolutely! It is just one more distraction to keep American voters eyes off the current economic factors that will decide Obama's failed Presidency.

j-mac

Henrin · Sep 2, 2011

Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

AdamT said:
The vote was on North/South lines -- not party lines. But it was Johnson's pro-civil-rights stand, and Goldwater's anti-civil-rights stand that pushed the Southern Democrats into the Republican party.

My numbers talk about the parties and how it worked out. Sorry, but hiding behind the civil rights bill of 1964 to say democrats aren't racists when the numbers actually show a different picture doesn't work.

OhIsee.Then · Sep 2, 2011

MrVicchio said:
.
"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them."
Thomas Jefferson

All of your posts have this Tomas Jefferson quote. I can't find it where I should find it. Will you help me confirm this quote that appears to have such modern American English language style? Also have you seen the following Tomas Jefferson quote "I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around the banks will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered." Again Thomas Jefferson supports your positions, but in a language style that is modern, but I guess he knew when it would be most applicable and used the proper style.

MKULTRABOY · Sep 2, 2011

We should look up some white brotherhood sites. Something just gives me the idea we're going to hear some very similar arguments against the 'real racists'. It just blows my mind.

Henrin · Sep 2, 2011

SE102 said:
We should look up some white brotherhood sites. Something just gives me the idea we're going to hear some very similar arguments against the 'real racists'. It just blows my mind.

Because William Walters is a KKK member. You know being black and all.

MKULTRABOY · Sep 2, 2011

I was talking about you guys. :shrug:

opcorn:

teamosil · Sep 2, 2011

Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

Grant said:
This happens so very often.

If a Black man doesn't fit into the Black stereotype he, or she, is not really Black.

It's not about whether or not he fits into any stereotype. It is a question of how he could be completely oblivious to things that are part of every day life for every black person in the country... The reality is that people fabricate identities for online forums sometimes, so I don't automatically assume people are what they say they are. Who knows, he could really be black. But it seems like a longshot to me given that he appears to be under the impression that racial discrimination doesn't exist. If somebody on here claims to be from San Francisco, but then they make a series of impassioned posts about how earthquakes are a myth, I'll know they aren't from San Francisco too.

teamosil · Sep 2, 2011

Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

VanceMack said:
Ignoring the fact that on occasion, that negative stereotype has been enhanced/reinforced by some within that racial group. Like I said...its not necessarily something you want to admit.

Of course that is true- all stereotypes have some truth to them. Are you saying that makes it ok to be racist or something? Can you spell out your argument more?

Personally I don't give a rat's ass about who to blame or whatever, I just want to fix it going forward.

teamosil · Sep 2, 2011

Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

Grant said:
I don't see how favoring one race over another can lead to racial equality. Can you?

Well, of course it could. Think it through. Lets take a simpler example. Say that John has 10 carrots and Jane has 4. Your goal is for both of them to have the same number of carrots and you have 6 carrots. Who would you give them to if your goal was for them each to have the same number of carrots?

Henrin · Sep 2, 2011

Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

teamosil said:
It's not about whether or not he fits into any stereotype. It is a question of how he could be completely oblivious to things that are part of every day life for every black person in the country... The reality is that people fabricate identities for online forums sometimes, so I don't automatically assume people are what they say they are. Who knows, he could really be black. But it seems like a longshot to me given that he appears to be under the impression that racial discrimination doesn't exist. If somebody on here claims to be from San Francisco, but then they make a series of impassioned posts about how earthquakes are a myth, I'll know they aren't from San Francisco too.

Where did he say racial discrimination doesn't exist? From what I see he said the opposite.

Henrin · Sep 2, 2011

SE102 said:
I was talking about you guys. :shrug: opcorn:

So black dudes that agree are what? Somehow in support of KKK members?

teamosil · Sep 2, 2011

Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

Henrin said:
Where did he say racial discrimination doesn't exist? From what I see he said the opposite.

The post that I was reacting to was this one:

apdst said:
Equally qualified black, hispanic and oriental people have just as much opportunity to get a job as any white person in this country.

Later though he did say that racial discrimination will always exist or something to that effect. Perhaps he just misspoke the first time, I don't know.

MKULTRABOY · Sep 2, 2011

Henrin said:
So black dudes that agree are what? Somehow in support of KKK members?

In that they support arguments of yours similar to those of white brotherhood members, yes, that would be logically sound in some twisted way.

pbrauer · Sep 2, 2011

Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

Henrin said:
Only about 58% of democrats voted for it while 80% of republicans voted for it.

Look at the numbers, not the percentages.:roll:

haymarket · Sep 2, 2011

Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

cpwill said:
what?!? but, but, but.... they were all Democrats in the Bad Old Days before the Party Changed Completely Because People Change! Why, LBJ was an active proponent of Jim Crow laws most of his career. Surely Democrats wouldn't be so cynical as to accuse Republicans of ties to racism while celebrating their own racist and racist-aligned historical leadership? Perish the thought!!!

:lol: the best part of irony is when the target doesn't get it.

Your reply makes no sense to what I wrote.

RiverDad · Sep 2, 2011

Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

pbrauer said:
Civil Rights Act of 1964 - Johnson and passage Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

By party and region

Note: "Southern", as used in this section, refers to members of Congress from the eleven states that made up the Confederate States of America in the American Civil War. "Northern" refers to members from the other 39 states, regardless of the geographic location of those states.

The original House version:

Southern Democrats: 7–87 (7%–93%)
Southern Republicans: 0–10 (0%–100%)
Northern Democrats: 145-9 (94%–6%)
Northern Republicans: 138-24 (85%–15%)
The Senate version:

Southern Democrats: 1–20 (5%–95%)
Southern Republicans: 0–1 (0%–100%)
Northern Democrats: 45-1 (98%–2%)
Northern Republicans: 27-5 (84%–16%)

What tool came up with that bogus categorization? Northern and Southern is useful only for idiots who want to massage and twist the evidence for some misleading purpose. Political divisions that existed at the time of the Civil War say nothing about the nature of the political parties a century later. You may as well have divided the vote by into people with blond hair and people with brown hair or people who wore glasses and people who didn't wear glasses.

You see everyone, the blond congressmen who wore classes were more in favor of civil rights than the brown haired congressmen who didn't wear glasses. That proves my point ! ! ! ! 1 1 1 ! !

haymarket · Sep 2, 2011

Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

RiverDad said:
What tool came up with that bogus categorization? Northern and Southern is useful only for idiots who want to massage and twist the evidence for some misleading purpose. Political divisions that existed at the time of the Civil War say nothing about the nature of the political parties a century later. You may as well have divided the vote by into people with blond hair and people with brown hair or people who wore glasses and people who didn't wear glasses.

You see everyone, the blond congressmen who wore classes were more in favor of civil rights than the brown haired congressmen who didn't wear glasses. That proves my point ! ! ! ! 1 1 1 ! !

Your assertion is beyond absurd. North and South was a very real division - even a century after the Civil War when it came to things like Civil Rights.

Let me guess - you were not even alive during the period you are lecturing to others about ... right? Were your parents?

RiverDad · Sep 2, 2011

Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

teamosil said:
Of course that is true- all stereotypes have some truth to them. Are you saying that makes it ok to be racist or something? Can you spell out your argument more?

Personally I don't give a rat's ass about who to blame or whatever, I just want to fix it going forward.

Then tell the black community to fix its reputation. There, problem solved.

Henrin · Sep 2, 2011

Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

pbrauer said:
Look at the numbers, not the percentages.:roll:

If you believe the Civil Rights bill of 1964 is the proof that you aren't racist(which it actually means nothing to the topic) the numbers still show democrats were racist.

The original House version:[SUP]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_Rights_Act_of_1964#cite_note-King-11[/SUP]

Democratic Party: 152-96 (61%-39%)

Republican Party: 138-34 (80%-20%)

Cloture in the Senate:[SUP]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_Rights_Act_of_1964#cite_note-12[/SUP]

Democratic Party: 44-23 (66%–34%)

Republican Party: 27-6 (82%–18%)

The Senate version:[SUP]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_Rights_Act_of_1964#cite_note-King-11[/SUP]

Democratic Party: 46-21 (69%–31%)

Republican Party: 27-6 (82%–18%)

The Senate version, voted on by the House:[SUP]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_Rights_Act_of_1964#cite_note-King-11[/SUP]

Democratic Party: 153-91 (63%–37%)

Republican Party: 136-35 (80%–20%)

Sorry, but my point holds true.

haymarket · Sep 2, 2011

Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

RiverDad said:
Then tell the black community to fix its reputation. There, problem solved.

Perhaps you should fix your perceptions.

haymarket · Sep 2, 2011

Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

Henrin said:
If you believe the Civil Rights bill of 1964 is the proof that you aren't racist(which it actually means nothing to the topic) the numbers still show democrats were racist.

Take those numbers and analyze them for us then.

RiverDad · Sep 2, 2011

Re: Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks 'hanging on a tree' Read more: http://www.p

teamosil said:
Well, of course it could. Think it through. Lets take a simpler example. Say that John has 10 carrots and Jane has 4. Your goal is for both of them to have the same number of carrots and you have 6 carrots. Who would you give them to if your goal was for them each to have the same number of carrots?

Why would equality of outcome be anyone's goal when they realize that to achieve this goal they're going to have to sacrifice all of their freedom to a government which can impose equal outcomes on everyone?

If both John and Jane have the same equality of opportunity to get as many carrots as they like, which they do, then there is no problem.