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Thread: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

  1. #911
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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    editted for truth and accuracy
    Isn't it against the rules to be editing other member's posts. If you want to say something, say it under your own name, quit bastardizing my posts.





    once he entered the property illegally and with intent to commit theft, he was committing a crime.
    Wrong. It has to be proven that you are there to commit a crime. If I go into your yard and knock at your door, I have entered your property without your invitation, you don't have the right to shoot me dead.
    Geez, where do you people come up with such crap?


    he was still guilty of trespassing, which is a crime. so technically, even if he was just hiding, he was still committing a crime.
    If the business owners had a sign saying "No Trespassing" - you might be right, but they didn't. The business owners only knew that they were there to steal because they had problems with them before (as I understood the story). They should have called the police, instead they decided to take the law into their hands. That, too, is a crime.

    suppose you are getting raped and your rapist pulls out and runs to your closet. is he no longer committing a crime?
    Geez, now we are comparing him to a rapist! He wasn't a rapist, he was a thief. What part of that story do you not understand? A rapist inside your home, already having committed the crime "you said he pulled out" - is totally different than this case. What would you say if someone shot your teenager because he trespassed into someone's backyard and hid in a shed when he was only playing hide-n-seek with other kids in the neighborhood.
    I bet you wouldn't think it was okay. How would the neighbor know that your kid was just playing hide-n-seek and not carrying a gun and threatening him and his family? I'm not saying that this might have been the case here, we know that he was there to rob, because the business owners said that they had done it before, and they were waiting for them. But, if the law were applied the way you who think they were not vigilantes, we could have innocent people being killed left and right. And this argument is from those who claim to love the Constitution (the law of the land) - apparently many of you don't know what you support.



    "I have been thinking that I would make a proposition to my Republican friends... that if they will stop telling lies about the Democrats, we will stop telling the truth about them."
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  2. #912
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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by mertex View Post
    It is "The End" - it is over and done with, neither you nor I can change the outcome.
    No kidding. But that's not what you meant. You were claiming that you were right, others who disagree are wrong-the end. Which is absurd.

    Quote Originally Posted by mertex View Post
    The young man is dead, the jury has awarded the money, the business owners got away with being vigilantes. What else is there?
    Nonsense. You keep claiming that they were vigilantes which is a load of BS. They "punished" no one.



    Quote Originally Posted by mertex View Post
    It wasn't punishment from the judicial system,
    It wasn't punishment at all.

    Quote Originally Posted by mertex View Post
    but you would hardly call being killed a reward. Oh, maybe you would.
    A reward? Now that is a ridiculous statement. I bet you would reward the guy.


    Quote Originally Posted by mertex View Post
    That is where you and other obtuse people seem to go off in another direction.
    Insults? Hon, don't go calling other people obtuse when your arguments are so utterly lacking in logic.

    Quote Originally Posted by mertex View Post
    He wasn't killed while committing a crime. He was killed while hiding. If he had been killed while committing a crime he would have been killed driving off in a stolen car.
    That is tripe. He was in the process of trespassing and thieving while armed. And you don't think that's a crime? Also, people need to quit repeating the same pointless assumptions. To claim he was "hiding" is supposition and conjecture.


    Quote Originally Posted by mertex View Post
    Ha,ha, why am I getting the feeling that you are a conservative?
    Labeling now? In the last thread I posted in, I was accused of being a "Liberal." Silly nonsense. I am neither. Besides, we already have enough red herrings in this thread. Stay on topic.

    Quote Originally Posted by mertex View Post
    The police do a good job. Once in a while we have one that doesn't, don't throw them all under the bus. Oh, by the way, were you one of the ones that was defending the cops durting the Obama/Gates fiasco? Just wondering.
    No they don't. Their solve rates are pathetic across the board. They don't solve crimes very well, and neither do they prevent them.
    “In politics, stupidity is not a handicap.” -Napoleon

  3. #913
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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by mertex View Post
    Isn't it against the rules to be editing other member's posts. If you want to say something, say it under your own name, quit bastardizing my posts.
    it would help if you read the rules. it is not against the rules if you make it obvious that you have edited the post. hence the all caps and red font and my statement "edited...."






    Wrong. It has to be proven that you are there to commit a crime. If I go into your yard and knock at your door, I have entered your property without your invitation, you don't have the right to shoot me dead.
    Geez, where do you people come up with such crap?
    seriously? are you really going to try to argue that this meth-head was just there to borrow a cup of sugar? try a more accurate analogy. you sneak into my yard in the middle of the night and kick down my door, I would be justified in assuming you meant to do me harm and would shoot you.

    If the business owners had a sign saying "No Trespassing" - you might be right, but they didn't. The business owners only knew that they were there to steal because they had problems with them before (as I understood the story).
    there doesn't have to be a sign posted for you to be guilty of trespass. I don't see many women walking around with "no raping" signs around their necks, but apparently it is still illegal to rape them.

    They should have called the police, instead they decided to take the law into their hands. That, too, is a crime.
    too bad for you the grand jury didn't think so


    Geez, now we are comparing him to a rapist! He wasn't a rapist, he was a thief. What part of that story do you not understand? A rapist inside your home, already having committed the crime "you said he pulled out" - is totally different than this case.
    wrong, yet again. a trespasser, already having broken onto my property has already committed the crime. the fact that I stopped him before he could steal anything is irrelevent.

    What would you say if someone shot your teenager because he trespassed into someone's backyard and hid in a shed when he was only playing hide-n-seek with other kids in the neighborhood.
    apples and oranges. this meth-head was no innocent teenager playing hide and seek. but FWIW, unlike some people, I taught my kids to respect other people's property and persons, so they never would have broken into the neighbor's back yard. what part of breaking and entering is so hard for you to understand?
    The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.

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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    it would help if you read the rules. it is not against the rules if you make it obvious that you have edited the post. hence the all caps and red font and my statement "edited...."
    It may not be against the rules but it is an extremely ill-mannered thing to do.
    I hate the idea of causes, and if I had to choose between betraying my country and betraying my friend, I hope I should have the guts to betray my country. E.M. Forster

  5. #915
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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    I think judge and jury should be piss tested to see if maybe they were high when they came to the conclusion that a burglar's family should be able to sue someone defending their property.


    Jury sides with burglar's family in 2009 shooting death at auto lot | jury, burglar, lot - Colorado Springs Gazette, CO
    An El Paso County jury on Friday awarded nearly $300,000 to the daughter of a burglar who was fatally shot in 2009 while breaking into an auto lot.
    Parents of the victim, Robert Johnson Fox, embraced their attorneys after a judge announced the jury’s verdict, capping a two-week-long civil trial in which business owner Jovan Milanovic and two relatives were painted as vigilantes who plotted a deadly ambush rather than let authorities deal with a string of recent burglaries.
    Phillip and Sue Fox, who filed suit for wrongful death in 2010 on behalf of Fox’s 3-year-old daughter, called the jury’s award a victory in their fight to seek accountability for the death of their son, who they say never posed a threat to the heavily armed men.
    “Rob was in the wrong place doing the wrong thing, but the punishment didn’t fit the crime,” Sue Fox said afterward. “I can’t excuse his actions, but he didn’t deserve to be executed.”
    The exact amount of the award was $269,500, for factors such as loss of companionship and loss of future earnings. The family will also be awarded some of the costs associated with the more than yearlong legal battle.
    The jury of three men and three women deliberated for 2½ days over closely contested testimony about the predawn shooting on April 19, 2009.
    What blows my mind is that this happened in Texas. I'll just chalk it up to those rumors about the drinking water in El Paso.
    The ghost of Jack Kevorkian for President's Physician: 2016

  6. #916
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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    What blows my mind is that this happened in Texas. I'll just chalk it up to those rumors about the drinking water in El Paso.
    I had the same reaction until I realized it as El Paso County, Colorado.
    I love how, in scary movies, the person yells out, "Hello?" As if the bad guy is gonna be like, "Yeah, I'm in the kitchen! Want a sandwich?"

  7. #917
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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by evanescence View Post
    No kidding. But that's not what you meant. You were claiming that you were right, others who disagree are wrong-the end. Which is absurd.
    I'm not going to change your mind, you are not going to change mine. I know what the law is, apparently you don't. The jury considered it a wrongful death, the judge didn't disagree. So, who do you have on your side? A bunch of know-nothings that think the same way?

    Nonsense. You keep claiming that they were vigilantes which is a load of BS. They "punished" no one.
    They waited in "ambush" - what do you think that means?

    It wasn't punishment at all.
    Okay, some inane people think it was a reward, apparently you do.


    A reward? Now that is a ridiculous statement. I bet you would reward the guy.
    He was a thief, I never excused him, killing him was a bit extreme. But for some here, I guess their property is their life. Sad.


    Insults? Hon, don't go calling other people obtuse when your arguments are so utterly lacking in logic.
    For those unfamiliar with the law (obtuse), it may appear that way. There's quite a few people like that in this country, we have to put up with it.


    That is tripe. He was in the process of trespassing and thieving while armed. And you don't think that's a crime? Also, people need to quit repeating the same pointless assumptions. To claim he was "hiding" is supposition and conjecture.
    Don't be inane, nowhere did I say he was there for a Tea Party. You need to go back and read my post and try to get someone to help you understand it. The business owners had no business waiting in ambush for him. The guy that shot him through the door was wrong in doing so, he had him trapped, he could have called the police. But, he, like other gung-ho gun carrying people in our country think they have the right to act as policemen, they don't.


    Labeling now? In the last thread I posted in, I was accused of being a "Liberal." Silly nonsense. I am neither. Besides, we already have enough red herrings in this thread. Stay on topic.
    It's just that your statements were so like the statements made from gun toting conservatives.
    No they don't. Their solve rates are pathetic across the board. They don't solve crimes very well, and neither do they prevent them.
    I guess for most of you, you would be happy if everyone defended themselves and we could turn this country into another Somalia. That's a depressing thought.



    "I have been thinking that I would make a proposition to my Republican friends... that if they will stop telling lies about the Democrats, we will stop telling the truth about them."
    --Adlai Stevenson, Politician





  8. #918
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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    it would help if you read the rules. I don't know how to read, but I have edited other posts before and got away with, so I'm guessing I will again. it is not against the rules if you make it obvious that you have edited the post. hence the all caps and red font and my statement "edited...."
    I'm editing your post, you left out the most important statement, so I decided to add it in for you. It's unethical as all getout, but when dealing with the inane, you have to get down to their level.

    seriously? are you really going to try to argue that this meth-head was just there to borrow a cup of sugar? try a more accurate analogy. you sneak into my yard in the middle of the night and kick down my door, I would be justified in assuming you meant to do me harm and would shoot you.
    Well, I guess your edited statement about not being able to read is accurate. Where did I mention that he was there to borrow a cup of sugar? He didn't kick in any door, and when you have someone trapped in a shed, how can you say he was there to shoot you, you can't see through doors, can you, and come to find out he didn't even have a gun.
    there doesn't have to be a sign posted for you to be guilty of trespass. I don't see many women walking around with "no raping" signs around their necks, but apparently it is still illegal to rape them.
    It was a business, not a home. And why do you keep comparing it to a "rape" - you seem to have some obsession with "rape" - geez, I wonder why? Rape is bodily harm, and still doesn't require the death penalty. You have to be pretty screwed up to put more value on property than on life. They could have had him arrested, which is the proper way to handle criminals, not take the law into your own hands and act like third world cannibals.


    too bad for you the grand jury didn't think so
    How pathetic, if you think it is too bad for me, I'm not affected either way by this occurrence. Too bad for you that you begrudge the daughter getting money for her father's wrongful death, yet the jury and the judge didn't disagree that it was a wrongful death. There is no changing of that fact. No matter how many times you jump up and scream "unfair" - it's a done deal, deal with it.


    wrong, yet again. a trespasser, already having broken onto my property has already committed the crime. the fact that I stopped him before he could steal anything is irrelevent.
    Well, try it, and let's hope the justice system in your area is as inane as those who think like you do, you may end up learning your mistake the hard way.


    apples and oranges. this meth-head was no innocent teenager playing hide and seek. but FWIW, unlike some people, I taught my kids to respect other people's property and persons, so they never would have broken into the neighbor's back yard. what part of breaking and entering is so hard for you to understand?
    Yeah, like kids have never done what parents tell them not to do! LOL! But, if that is what your neighbor would say about your teen. "I thought he was a meth-head, was armed and was going to harm me" - you'll have to agree with him.



    "I have been thinking that I would make a proposition to my Republican friends... that if they will stop telling lies about the Democrats, we will stop telling the truth about them."
    --Adlai Stevenson, Politician





  9. #919
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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by Leo View Post
    It may not be against the rules but it is an extremely ill-mannered thing to do.

    Manners? They don't even know what that is.



    "I have been thinking that I would make a proposition to my Republican friends... that if they will stop telling lies about the Democrats, we will stop telling the truth about them."
    --Adlai Stevenson, Politician





  10. #920
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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    What blows my mind is that this happened in Texas. I'll just chalk it up to those rumors about the drinking water in El Paso.
    If this happened in El Paso Texas I think the jury would have had the sense to tell the dead armed burglar junky's family to **** off.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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