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Thread: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    It is not murder to use lethal force to defend yourself and property against burglars especially armed burglars.
    It is if the intruders aren't attempting to use lethal force (with some exceptions for home invasions). Your own article points that out.

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    If what the property owner did was murder then he would be in prison right now.
    Because the grand jury didn't indict. Frankly I'm surprised by that. It suggests that possibly something else is going on. Nevertheless, again according to your own article (not to mention my own knowledge), these men violated the law.

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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by Aderleth View Post
    It is if the intruders aren't attempting to use lethal force (with some exceptions for home invasions). Your own article points that out.
    The intruders were armed.


    Because the grand jury didn't indict. Frankly I'm surprised by that. It suggests that possibly something else is going on. Nevertheless, again according to your own article (not to mention my own knowledge), these men violated the law.
    All it proves is that the standard used for civil trials is too lax and should be just as strict as the standards for criminal trials.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by Aderleth View Post
    You and the law are in disagreement on this issue.
    So the property owner was found guilty in a criminal trial and serving time?
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    The intruders were armed.
    Yes. We've established that. They weren't attempting to use deadly force.


    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    All it proves is that the standard used for civil trials is too lax and should be just as strict as the standards for criminal trials.
    The fact that the grand jury chose not to indict despite the fact that these men violated the criminal statute for murder without valid self defense proves that the standard for civil trials is too lax?

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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by Mathematician View Post
    I wouldn't exactly expect the business owners to have bean bag guns. I hope this story spreads to scare those thinking of committing burglary.
    I don't know why people lift cultural norms from the Old West and insert them into the 21st century. As far as I know, we all stand in line for our groceries. The human condition has changed radically from when we were howling for blood in the Colosseum.
    Last edited by Morality Games; 08-29-11 at 02:01 AM.
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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by Aderleth View Post
    I hope the story spreads to discourage business owners from behaving like thugs. Congratulations to them. Instead of being out a couple hundred bucks for a car stereo or two, they're out $260k. Clearly that was a wise decision they made.

    Also, bean bag guns? Seriously?
    So let's just expect the owners to sit there and watch some piece of crap human steal from them? If you don't like lethal shots or bean bag guns, perhaps you prefer taser guns?

    You criticize their decisions like they should have known some ignorant jury was going to award money to the criminal's family.
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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    So the property owner was found guilty in a criminal trial and serving time?
    No, but he probably should have been. Sounds like a case of jury nullification.

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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    So the property owner was found guilty in a criminal trial and serving time?
    As I've explained twice now, I find the behavior of the grand jury baffling based on the facts we have available. You probably would too if you actually looked at what the law says and what actually happened.
    Last edited by Aderleth; 08-29-11 at 02:04 AM.

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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by Mathematician View Post
    So let's just expect the owners to sit there and watch some piece of crap human steal from them? If you don't like lethal shots or bean bag guns, perhaps you prefer taser guns?

    You criticize their decisions like they should have known some ignorant jury was going to award money to the criminal's family.
    What they should have done is called the police and, if possible, hold the guy until they got there. The kid was hiding in a shed and they shot him through the door.

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    Re: Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

    Quote Originally Posted by Aderleth View Post
    As I've explained twice now, I find the behavior of the grand jury baffling based on the facts we have available. You probably would to if you actually looked at what the law says and what actually happened.
    Sounds like a case of jury nullification. They weren't going to indict someone for shooting a burglar even if the law said otherwise. It's not uncommon.

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