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Obama's Approval Rating Drops to Lowest Ever, According to Gallup

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AdamT said:
Right, because we all know that gradeschool teachers, cops, and firefighters are just a bunch of shiftless, no good thugs who deserve to be put out on the street. :lol:[/QUOTE

Most of us know those are state jobs and not a Federal responsibility. Would you have supported the stimulus spending of Obama told you he was going to save union jobs instead of creating jobs?
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winston53660 said:
Ohhhh one of the seven deadly sins

Dante's definition was "love of self perverted to hatred and contempt for one's neighbour."
7 Deadly Sins
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Yep, everyone knows that a good politician will always promote killing seniors, starving, kids, and polluting the air then go ask them for their vote in the next election
 
Conservative said:
AdamT said:
Right, because we all know that gradeschool teachers, cops, and firefighters are just a bunch of shiftless, no good thugs who deserve to be put out on the street. :lol:[/QUOTE

Most of us know those are state jobs and not a Federal responsibility. Would you have supported the stimulus spending of Obama told you he was going to save union jobs instead of creating jobs?
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It was the federal government's responsibility to respond to the Great Recession. It so happens that one of the most effective ways to do that was to help the states avoid major layoffs. It had nothing to do with unions. That's a wingnut fantasy.
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AdamT said:
Conservative said:
It was the federal government's responsibility to respond to the Great Recession. It so happens that one of the most effective ways to do that was to help the states avoid major layoffs. It had nothing to do with unions. That's a wingnut fantasy.
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It was and is the state responsibility and the citizens of the state to respond to the needs in their community. Now answer the question, is that how the stimulus was sold?
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Conservative said:
Yep, everyone knows that a good politician will always promote killing seniors, starving, kids, and polluting the air then go ask them for their vote in the next election
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Dude, the silicone chip in your head wasn't set to go off till Monday.
 
AdamT said:
Right, because we all know that gradeschool teachers, cops, and firefighters are just a bunch of shiftless, no good thugs who deserve to be put out on the street. :lol:
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I see we agree. We can fix this problem by eliminating public sector unions.
 
AdamT said:
Conservative said:
It was the federal government's responsibility to respond to the Great Recession. It so happens that one of the most effective ways to do that was to help the states avoid major layoffs. It had nothing to do with unions. That's a wingnut fantasy.
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The Federal Government's responsibility is to do those things that are enumerated in the Constitution of the United States Article 1 Section 8. And that is ALL! This notion that our money that funds these powers is unlimited is a crock.

j-mac
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Misterveritis said:
I see we agree. We can fix this problem by eliminating public sector unions.
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Unions were created to better balance the interests of the employees and the employer.
The people of the state in question employ the members of a public sector union.

So... public sector unions are not competing against the interests of "the man", but "the people".

Given that, there's every reason to limit these unions and what they can bargain for.
 
PzKfW IVe said:
Unions were created to better balance the interests of the employees and the employer.
The people of the state in question employ the members of a public sector union.

So... public sector unions are not competing against the interests of "the man", but "the people".

Given that, there's every reason to limit these unions and what they can bargain for.
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Absolutely....Even FDR was against the unionization of the public sector worker.

j-mac
 
j-mac said:
AdamT said:
The Federal Government's responsibility is to do those things that are enumerated in the Constitution of the United States Article 1 Section 8. And that is ALL! This notion that our money that funds these powers is unlimited is a crock.

j-mac
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The Constitution grants broad spending powers. No one seriously questions the governments power to do emergency spending in response to a recession.
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AdamT said:
The Constitution grants broad spending powers. No one seriously questions the governments power to do emergency spending in response to a recession.
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No one? The speaking in absolutes like this are only more evidence that you don't even believe your own rhetoric....

Show me where in the Constitution the Federal government has the power to direct the states in spending outside the enumerated powers of the Federal Government?

j-mac
 
j-mac said:
Show me where in the Constitution the Federal government has the power to direct the states in spending outside the enumerated powers of the Federal Government?
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There is no such clause.
However, if the state elects to take money that the federal government offers, then the federal government can attach conditions on how that money is spent.

This is outside the discussion as to if the federal government has the power to offer that money to the states in the first place.
 
PzKfW IVe said:
Unions were created to better balance the interests of the employees and the employer.
The people of the state in question employ the members of a public sector union.

So... public sector unions are not competing against the interests of "the man", but "the people".

Given that, there's every reason to limit these unions and what they can bargain for.
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The fact of the matter is that unions are not the problem. The fact is that there is little or no correlation between states' budget woes and the degree of collective bargaining they confer on public sector employees. In other words, this is a BS issue that Republicans flog because they know that unions traditionally support democratic candidates.

Shanker Blog » Are Public Employee Unions To Blame For States' Budget Crises?
 
PzKfW IVe said:
There is no such clause.
However, if the state elects to take money that the federal government offers, then the federal government can attach conditions on how that money is spent.

This is outside the discussion as to if the federal government has the power to offer that money to the states in the first place.
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Big 10-4 on that. And thus the argument that the stimulus was unconstitutional to start with. See, statists like Adam are perfectly fine with an ever increasing federal power through the carrot of federal tax money handouts, except when it is someone that ideologically he disagrees with doing the dictating. Liberals have a assbackwards view of the Federal Government, they feel that the Federal Government is supreme granting power to the states instead of the original intent of a limited in power Federal structure that derived its power from the states individually. Thus they are changing this country from a country governed by the people to a government dictating to the people.

j-mac
 
Sheik Yerbuti said:
I'd say that's been thoroughly proven beyond any reasonable doubt.
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Obama economic results in 2011, .4% GDP and 1% GDP growth in October 2010 to March 2011, 25+ million unemployed or under employed Americans in July 2011, 4 trillion added to the debt in less than 3 years, and a downgrade of the U.S. credit rating. Rising Misery index 7.83 to 12.67. First President in U.S. History to have our credit downgraded on his watch! 38%-41% JAR and well over 50% disapproval ratings.
 
j-mac said:
No one? The speaking in absolutes like this are only more evidence that you don't even believe your own rhetoric....

Show me where in the Constitution the Federal government has the power to direct the states in spending outside the enumerated powers of the Federal Government?

j-mac
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The government did not direct the states' spending, so that would be a strawman. What they did was offer the states assistance. The states could take it or leave it.
 
Conservative said:
Obama economic results in 2011, .4% GDP and 1% GDP growth in October 2010 to March 2011, 25+ million unemployed or under employed Americans in July 2011, 4 trillion added to the debt in less than 3 years, and a downgrade of the U.S. credit rating. Rising Misery index 7.83 to 12.67. First President in U.S. History to have our credit downgraded on his watch! 38%-41% JAR and well over 50% disapproval ratings.
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And what Obama inherited: economy shedding 700,000+ jobs per month, GDP shrinking at 6+% per year, financial institutions teetering on the edge of collapse, trillion+ deficit.... Nice improvement.
 
AdamT said:
And what Obama inherited: economy shedding 700,000+ jobs per month, GDP shrinking at 6+% per year, financial institutions teetering on the edge of collapse, trillion+ deficit.... Nice improvement.
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It is 2 1/2 years later, are you happy with the results for the money spent? Obama didn't inherit anything that he didn't help create so get over it.
 
j-mac said:
No one? The speaking in absolutes like this are only more evidence that you don't even believe your own rhetoric....

Show me where in the Constitution the Federal government has the power to direct the states in spending outside the enumerated powers of the Federal Government?

j-mac
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That's a strawman. First prove this ...


To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States;​

... is not one of those enumerated powers.

Then prove spending is limited to only those enumerated powers following that one. And before you start posting Madison, expect posts on Hamilton.
 
Conservative said:
Obama economic results in 2011, .4% GDP and 1% GDP growth in October 2010 to March 2011, 25+ million unemployed or under employed Americans in July 2011, 4 trillion added to the debt in less than 3 years, and a downgrade of the U.S. credit rating. Rising Misery index 7.83 to 12.67. First President in U.S. History to have our credit downgraded on his watch! 38%-41% JAR and well over 50% disapproval ratings.
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You can click your heals too, still won't make that true.
 
Sheik Yerbuti said:
You can click your heals too, still won't make that true.
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Won't make what real, actual numbers? you are right, in your world percentage change matters than actual numbers. 25 million unemployed and under employed Americans aren't real, .4% and 1% GDP growth isn't real. Credit downgrade isn't real. Waiting for what is real in your world. You are quick to point out numbers when you believe they suit your purpose but not so when the numbers prove you to be wrong and prove your support for an incompetent, empty suit.
 
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