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Thread: Bachmann wins Iowa straw poll, keeps momentum

  1. #191
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    Re: Bachmann wins Iowa straw poll, keeps momentum

    Quote Originally Posted by GPS_Flex View Post
    Good point eh? Do you really think conservatives won’t elect a woman because they think she belongs in the kitchen? Do you get out much?
    We will find out this spring!
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Bachmann wins Iowa straw poll, keeps momentum

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Actually it is worth thinking about because it was after the debt ceiling agreement was reached that the US credit rating was downgraded. It showed that the government is not serious in looking after its debts and was judged accordingly.
    Nevertheless, the damage that would resulted from an inability to raise the debt ceiling would have thrown the entire global economy back into turmoil, in which case we would have had much bigger problems on our hands than a credit downgrade. And remember, the rationale behind the downgrade was not simply that the debt is a problem, it's also that there are intransigent orthodox ideologues in Congress on both sides of the aisle who don't seem willing to compromise.

    Furthermore, the Obama Administration should have seen this coming and had a budget in place well before this 'crisis' ever appeared. The American government is no longer deserves a triple A rating. Bachmann was correct.
    well, frankly I personally supported the Simpson-Bowles and Domenici-Rivlin plans, but unfortunately none of those recommendations ever made their way to the floor of the House or Senate. That's another story though.
    Last edited by StillBallin75; 08-15-11 at 03:58 AM.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

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    Re: Bachmann wins Iowa straw poll, keeps momentum

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    We will find out this spring!
    Does this mean to you that if Bachmann is not the nominee, Republicans are sexist?

    There is no one who attacks Conservative women more than the left wing. They have blood in their eyes and hate in their hearts whenever Palin or Bachmann are mentioned, and will attack their families and every aspect of their lives. They become, as charged, deranged.

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    Re: Bachmann wins Iowa straw poll, keeps momentum

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Nevertheless, the damage that would resulted from an inability to raise the debt ceiling would have thrown the entire global economy back into turmoil, in which case we would have had much bigger problems on our hands than a credit downgrade. And remember, the rationale behind the downgrade was not simply that the debt is a problem, it's also that there are intransigent orthodox ideologues in Congress on both sides of the aisle who don't seem willing to compromise.
    The money was always there to pay the government's debts and more progress would have been made with spending cuts, something that this government was clearly unwilling to do.

    There is only one ideology that interests lenders and that is the one that says they will be repaid. As the US government was borrowing $2 trillion a year with no apparent interest in slowing down its spending or paying down the debt, the lenders were warned of this through the credit downgrade.

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    Re: Bachmann wins Iowa straw poll, keeps momentum

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Does this mean to you that if Bachmann is not the nominee, Republicans are sexist?

    There is no one who attacks Conservative women more than the left wing. They have blood in their eyes and hate in their hearts whenever Palin or Bachmann are mentioned, and will attack their families and every aspect of their lives. They become, as charged, deranged.

    It would suggest it played a role in her defeat. The only positive proof that the Republican's are not sexist would be if they actually elected her as their nominee. I am betting they will not.

    I do not hate Bachmann or Palin and I am a liberal. I think they are stupid and unqualified to be president but I certainly do not hate them.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Bachmann wins Iowa straw poll, keeps momentum

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    The money was always there to pay the government's debts and more progress would have been made with spending cuts, something that this government was clearly unwilling to do.

    There is only one ideology that interests lenders and that is the one that says they will be repaid. As the US government was borrowing $2 trillion a year with no apparent interest in slowing down its spending or paying down the debt, the lenders were warned of this through the credit downgrade.
    I don't disagree with any of this. Nevertheless, not allowing the debt ceiling to increase would have been economically catastrophic, And, once again, the raising of the debt ceiling is to pay for debts that the government has already incurred through budgets already formulated, appropriated, and approved. In a hypothetical situation in which the debt ceiling failed to be increased, while it is still possible to pay off creditors who own your debt, the inability to pay off others whom you owe obligations to doesn't do one's credit any good.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

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    Re: Bachmann wins Iowa straw poll, keeps momentum

    [QUOTE]
    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    It would suggest it played a role in her defeat. The only positive proof that the Republican's are not sexist would be if they actually elected her as their nominee. I am betting they will not.
    And the fact that she might not be the right candidate for other reasons would not be a factor in their decision? And if they don't select a male candidate they are sexist also I suppose.

    I do not hate Bachmann or Palin and I am a liberal. I think they are stupid and unqualified to be president but I certainly do not hate them.
    Of course. These two women are "stupid" and therefore unqualified. Spoken like a true Liberal.

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    Re: Bachmann wins Iowa straw poll, keeps momentum

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    I don't disagree with any of this. Nevertheless, not allowing the debt ceiling to increase would have been economically catastrophic,
    I disagree but the 'catastrophe' was the word of the day for a while.

    And, once again, the raising of the debt ceiling is to pay for debts that the government has already incurred through budgets already formulated, appropriated, and approved.
    The Obama Administration has never presented a budget apart from the one that BHO brought forward and which was rejected 97-0.
    In a hypothetical situation in which the debt ceiling failed to be increased, while it is still possible to pay off creditors who own your debt, the inability to pay off others whom you owe obligations to doesn't do one's credit any good.
    I think there is a lot of room for us to disagree on either side and perhaps we are both leaning towards our ideologies rather than what might have been prudent, possible or predictable. I think that insisting that cuts be made and spending brought into line with conventional budget procedures would have sent a much stronger message to the international financial community than what eventually passed.

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    Re: Bachmann wins Iowa straw poll, keeps momentum

    [QUOTE=Grant;1059729015]

    And the fact that she might not be the right candidate for other reasons would not be a factor in their decision? And if they don't select a male candidate they are sexist also I suppose.
    That is not what I said. The only positive proof the majority of Republicans are not sexist is if they actually elect Bachmann as their candidate.


    Of course. These two women are "stupid" and therefore unqualified. Spoken like a true Liberal.
    There are as many brilliant women as there are brilliant men. However, Bachmann and Palin have demonstrated they are not among them.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Bachmann wins Iowa straw poll, keeps momentum

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Who are they going to run to? It sure as hell isn't going to be Obama.
    So you are saying that because Obama is so bad, the independents will go against every fiber in their body and vote for a far right wing religious corporatism nut job? I doubt that very much.
    PeteEU

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