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Debt ceiling cost to taxpayers: $1.7 billion

Conservative said:
Do you think your paycheck is an expense to the govt? You keep saying that tax cuts have to be paid for. Where did you learn that? Tax cuts are a benefit to the taxpayer by allowing them to keep more of what they earn. They aren't a line item expense thus don't have to be paid for as only expenses have to be paid for.

Obama has spent record amounts over the past two plus years and is about to make it 3 years in a row. This nation is broke and has to cut spending. Cutting spending doesn't hurt the private sector and that is where the economy has to grow and create jobs.
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You're arguing semantics -- I'm talking about accounting. If you want to maintain a reasonable account balance you have to offset lower revenue with lower spending, i.e., pay for tax cuts.

And yes, cutting spending absolutely hurts the private sector. What do you think happens to that money the government spends? It gets paid to private contractors, doctors, hospitals, and all the rest. Even if it's paid directly to a government worker, that worker uses it to buy groceries and pay his car note and to buy school supplies.
 
AdamT said:
You're arguing semantics -- I'm talking about accounting. If you want to maintain a reasonable account balance you have to offset lower revenue with lower spending, i.e., pay for tax cuts.

And yes, cutting spending absolutely hurts the private sector. What do you think happens to that money the government spends? It gets paid to private contractors, doctors, hospitals, and all the rest. Even if it's paid directly to a government worker, that worker uses it to buy groceries and pay his car note and to buy school supplies.
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Spending should have everything to do with revenue and if you believe revenue is going to drop then stop spending. Either way tax cuts aren't an expense thus don't have to be paid for.

As for govt. spending, you really need to learn the four components of GDP and what each contributes. there aren't any spending cuts in this POS legislation because all it does is cut the rate of growth of spending. Remember divide the so called savings by 10 and then apply that to the inflated budget we have now. That isn't a spending cut.
 
Redress said:
So you really do not know how interest payments work? Hint: they happen more than once.
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No, just amused that you are trying to make some point about interest, but but don't seem to understand how it would impact things.
 
Redress said:
Historically, democrats. All evidence points to that being the case now.
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That is incorrect. All evidence does not point to that being the case. Case in point, evidence points to Republicans in congress potentially being more fiscally responsible then democrats or a split congress.

I'm not suggesting one side definitely is or isn't better, but its pure sophistry to try and suggest that "ALL" evidence points to one side being more fiscally responsible. That applies only if one cherry picks their evidence.
 
AdamT said:
Brilliant. Thank you, teabaggers! They can also reimburse us for the massive market drop that was caused by their incredibly irresponsible stunt.
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nObama should reimburse us the 4.1 trillion that he spent in 2 1/2 years without any results. Thank you nObama!!
 
The Prof said:
vote obama, 2012!

this is a WAR!

there is an ENEMY!

etc

LOL!
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do we mark you as
a)merely uniformed
b) naive
c) playing ostrich hiding from reality
d) all of the above

?????
 
uniformed?

LOL!

did you know that proportionately MORE members of the tea party caucus (23 to 17) voted FOR the compromise than the exactly 50% of dems who did so in the house?

http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2011/roll690.xml

how dare all those congress people play politics with the full faith and credit, holding the entire world economy hostage

voting AGAINST compromise and FOR default...

party on, progressives
 
haymarket said:
do we mark you as
a)merely uniformed
b) naive
c) playing ostrich hiding from reality
d) all of the above

?????
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Right, the Obama results are so spectacular that he deserves another 4 years. After all there are only 24 plus million unemployed or under employed Americans, the debt has surpassed the debt ceiling, economic growth was a strong .4% and 1.3% first and second qtr 2011, spent over 800 billion on a stimulus program that helped generate these numbers so what is there not to be proud of. I will certainly consider voting for him in 2012
 
Conservative said:
Right, the Obama results are so spectacular that he deserves another 4 years. After all there are only 24 plus million unemployed or under employed Americans, the debt has surpassed the debt ceiling, economic growth was a strong .4% and 1.3% first and second qtr 2011, spent over 800 billion on a stimulus program that helped generate these numbers so what is there not to be proud of. I will certainly consider voting for him in 2012
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Yep and its ALL Obama's fault right?:roll:
 
TheDemSocialist said:
Yep and its ALL Obama's fault right?:roll:
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After two years with total Democrat control of Congress including a period of time with a filibuster proof Senate and now 2 1/2 years after taking office claiming he had solutions, yes, the numbers today are all Obama's fault
 
Conservative said:
After two years with total Democrat control of Congress including a period of time with a filibuster proof Senate and now 2 1/2 years after taking office claiming he had solutions, yes, the numbers today are all Obama's fault
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Yep its all Obama's fault. Even tho the Democrats pretty much knelled over to all the Bush and "Reaganomics" economic policies...
 
TheDemSocialist said:
Yep its all Obama's fault. Even tho the Democrats pretty much knelled over to all the Bush and "Reaganomics" economic policies...
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Do you ever accept responsibility for your own failures? How long are you going to blame Bush for the problems we have 2 1/2 years after Obama took office? Your leanings say it all about you and the failures of socialist countries all over the world speak volumes about the socialist economic policy. Barack Obama is trying to implement those here and the results speak for themselves, results you still want to blame on Bush.
 
TheDemSocialist said:
Yep its all Obama's fault. Even tho the Democrats pretty much knelled over to all the Bush and "Reaganomics" economic policies...
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Something to think about regarding Obama, the Post Turtle

While suturing a cut on the hand of a 75 year old rancher, who's hand was caught in the squeeze gate while working cattle, the doctor struck up a conversation with the old man... Eventually the topic got around to Obama and his role as our president.
The old rancher said, 'Well, ya know, Obama is a 'Post Turtle''.
Not being familiar with the term, the doctor asked him, what a 'post turtle' was.
The old rancher said, 'When you're driving down a country road and you come across a fence post with a turtle balanced on top, that's a 'post turtle'.
The old rancher saw the puzzled look on the doctor's face so he continued to explain. '
"You know he didn't get up there by himself, he doesn't belong up there, he doesn't know what to do while he's up there, he's elevated beyond his ability to function, and you just wonder what kind of dumb ass put him up there to begin with."
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Conservative said:
Do you ever accept responsibility for your own failures?
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How is this my failure?
If you are talking about sense im to the left of you and democrats controlled the house back then, well guess what im not a democrat, im a socialist... So still this would not be "my failure".

How long are you going to blame Bush for the problems we have 2 1/2 years after Obama took office?
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Well can you blame him when the markets and everything fell apart when he was still in office? No i bet you cant...
But Obama is still using much of the Bush policies in his administration..

Your leanings say it all about you and the failures of socialist countries all over the world speak volumes about the socialist economic policy.
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Ohhh boy now you wanna talk about socialism....
I bet you have a great understanding of socialism coming from your right wing blogs...

Barack Obama is trying to implement those here and the results speak for themselves, results you still want to blame on Bush.
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Good god.... :screwy
I wish he was but he isnt.
 
TheDemSocialist said:
How is this my failure?
If you are talking about sense im to the left of you and democrats controlled the house back then, well guess what im not a democrat, im a socialist... So still this would not be "my failure".


Well can you blame him when the markets and everything fell apart when he was still in office? No i bet you cant...
But Obama is still using much of the Bush policies in his administration..


Ohhh boy now you wanna talk about socialism....
I bet you have a great understanding of socialism coming from your right wing blogs...


Good god.... :screwy
I wish he was but he isnt.
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Ok, tell us what is so great about socialism and how it would benefit this country to convert to your socialist ideology?
 
TheDemSocialist said:
Your point?
Obama "wants to do". Obama "wants to do". Obama "wants to do"
That says it all.
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Obama results speak for themselves, probably excellent socialist results, right? High unemployment, low economic growth, and high debt

Obama record, 15.1 million officially unemployed TODAY 2 1/2 years later, 16.2% total unemployment or underemployment over 24 million TODAY, 4 trillion added to the debt as of the end of fiscal year 2011, and a rising misery index(7.83 to 12.67).

Economic growth-GDP

1st Qtr 2011 .4%
2nd Qtr 2011 1.3%
 
Conservative said:
Ok, tell us what is so great about socialism and how it would benefit this country to convert to your socialist ideology?
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This thread is not about socialism.
Now if you would like to talk about socialism and what not you can start a thread or there is currently one going on right now about socialism. If you would like to move this debate over there i would more and gladly follow you there.
 
TheDemSocialist said:
This thread is not about socialism.
Now if you would like to talk about socialism and what not you can start a thread or there is currently one going on right now about socialism. If you would like to move this debate over there i would more and gladly follow you there.
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So socialists don't spend a lot of money and have high debt?
 
Conservative said:
Obama results speak for themselves, probably excellent socialist results, right? High unemployment, low economic growth, and high debt
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Wait how is that socialism?
What has Obama done that is socialistic?
Passed the Bush Tax Cuts, didnt fight for a public option, continue many bush economic policies. Nothing he has done is socialism... Do the workers own the workplace? No.
Tell me how is anything Obama done socialism?

Obama record, 15.1 million officially unemployed TODAY 2 1/2 years later, 16.2% total unemployment or underemployment over 24 million TODAY,
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You have a source for this claims?
Because like TurtleDude i think your possibly making stuff out of thin air...

4 trillion added to the debt as of the end of fiscal year 2011, and a rising misery index(7.83 to 12.67).
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But when Bush and everyone else spent money it didnt matter right?

Economic growth-GDP

1st Qtr 2011 .4%
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False 1.8%
First-quarter U.S. economic growth slows to 1.8% - Economic Report - MarketWatch

2nd Qtr 2011 1.3%
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Ture...


But wait i thought if the gov gets involved that is "socialism" and that is bad. What do you want Obama to do about it?
Why are you calling on the big man to maybe help out a little bit? I thought you guys hate that...
 
Conservative said:
I think this is an act, you don't seem to have a clue as to the results of socialist countries.
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What there is a "socialist country" now somewhere?! Which one!? China (not socialist). Cuba (not socialist). The old USSR (not socialist. Claimed to be fighting for basic socialism there whole existence) Vietnam (not socialist). DPRK (not socialist).
 
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