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Thread: Debt ceiling cost to taxpayers: $1.7 billion

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    Re: Debt ceiling cost to taxpayers: $1.7 billion

    Quote Originally Posted by washunut View Post
    perhaps you could add the size of the increases, context?
    I could very well do that going back as far as 1917. Certainly it would be more meaningful for you to do your own investigation.

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    Re: Debt ceiling cost to taxpayers: $1.7 billion

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    FDR Policies and paying for WWII
    And you are correct.

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    Re: Debt ceiling cost to taxpayers: $1.7 billion

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    FDR Policies and paying for WWII
    Exactly, and it was that stimulus spending that broke us out of the Great Depression.

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    Re: Debt ceiling cost to taxpayers: $1.7 billion

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Exactly, and it was that stimulus spending that broke us out of the Great Depression.
    Look Adam you and all other liberals can continue to look backwards but it serves no purpose. Obama's stimulus interjected billions of taxpayer dollars that did nothing to stimulate the private sector job growth or GDP growth. The 2010 numbers were a mirage in that they were generated with taxpayer dollars and were offset by the debt created by that spending thus no net benefit. Once the stimulus spending wore off you are now seeing the true effects of the Obama economic policy, .4% and 1.3% GDP growth and 24 million unemployed or under employed Americans.

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    Re: Debt ceiling cost to taxpayers: $1.7 billion

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Look Adam you and all other liberals can continue to look backwards but it serves no purpose. Obama's stimulus interjected billions of taxpayer dollars that did nothing to stimulate the private sector job growth or GDP growth. The 2010 numbers were a mirage in that they were generated with taxpayer dollars and were offset by the debt created by that spending thus no net benefit. Once the stimulus spending wore off you are now seeing the true effects of the Obama economic policy, .4% and 1.3% GDP growth and 24 million unemployed or under employed Americans.
    As the great George Santayana said, ""Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."

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    Re: Debt ceiling cost to taxpayers: $1.7 billion

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    As the great George Santayana said, ""Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."
    You are right, Jimmy Carter revisited

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    Re: Debt ceiling cost to taxpayers: $1.7 billion

    Anyone got a link proving that tax cuts stimulate the economy? Obama cut taxes in the stimulus package (it was mostly tax credits, look it up, even Karl Rove admits it. Rove himself said it needed more infrastructure spending) and it did nothing to help us. Bush did the same thing. Look how great we are. Clinton raised taxes and we saw tremendous growth. Here's the honest to god truth: cutting spending right now will only have negative effects on the economy and on jobs. Realize that. We need to cut spending and get things under control, but not now when the economy is like this. Put together a bill at the end of this year to cut around 6 trillion with a 4:1 ratio of spending to tax increases, to go into effect starting 2013/14. That's the solution here. We need government to pour money into the economy right now in terms of infrastructure rebuilding. A massive national infrastructure rebuilding would turn this country around. Look at what Hitler did with Germany. He turned that country's economy from a gigantic steaming pile of hyper inflated **** to a massive superpower. I'm not saying he was a good guy by any means, but he spent billions on military and infrastructure and got people to work. That's what brings an economy back to life. Not cutting taxes on businesses that are ALREADY MAKING EXCELLENT PROFITS.
    Last edited by irviding; 08-04-11 at 09:16 PM.

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    Re: Debt ceiling cost to taxpayers: $1.7 billion

    Quote Originally Posted by irviding View Post
    Anyone got a link proving that tax cuts stimulate the economy? Obama cut taxes in the stimulus package (it was mostly tax credits, look it up, even Karl Rove admits it. Rove himself said it needed more infrastructure spending) and it did nothing to help us. Bush did the same thing. Look how great we are. Clinton raised taxes and we saw tremendous growth. Here's the honest to god truth: cutting spending right now will only have negative effects on the economy and on jobs. Realize that. We need to cut spending and get things under control, but not now when the economy is like this. Put together a bill at the end of this year to cut around 6 trillion with a 4:1 ratio of spending to tax increases, to go into effect starting 2013/14. That's the solution here. We need government to pour money into the economy right now in terms of infrastructure rebuilding. A massive national infrastructure rebuilding would turn this country around. Look at what Hitler did with Germany. He turned that country's economy from a gigantic steaming pile of hyper inflated **** to a massive superpower. I'm not saying he was a good guy by any means, but he spent billions on military and infrastructure and got people to work. That's what brings an economy back to life. Not cutting taxes on businesses that are ALREADY MAKING EXCELLENT PROFITS.
    There are four components of GDP with the largest one being consumption. You tell me how you, keeping more of what you earn impacts consumption. this is a private sector economy that relies on consumer spending. More take home pay leads to more consumer spending and that stimulates and grows the economy. The Obama tax cuts were not rate cuts but instead or basically as you stated tax credits along with a simple rebate that once spent was gone. Tax rate cuts however put more money into your hands with every paycheck. I hope you can see the difference.

    Both Reagan and GHW Bush compromised with liberals accepting a 3 to 1 spending cuts to tax increases. Guess what, we got the tax increases but NOT the spending cuts. Give us the spending cuts first and then talk about tax increases. Right now 24 plus million Americans are either unemployed or under employed paying very little in Federal Income Taxes. Put those people back to work and the revenue problem would be partially solved.

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    Re: Debt ceiling cost to taxpayers: $1.7 billion

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    There are four components of GDP with the largest one being consumption. You tell me how you, keeping more of what you earn impacts consumption. this is a private sector economy that relies on consumer spending. More take home pay leads to more consumer spending and that stimulates and grows the economy. The Obama tax cuts were not rate cuts but instead or basically as you stated tax credits along with a simple rebate that once spent was gone. Tax rate cuts however put more money into your hands with every paycheck. I hope you can see the difference.

    Both Reagan and GHW Bush compromised with liberals accepting a 3 to 1 spending cuts to tax increases. Guess what, we got the tax increases but NOT the spending cuts. Give us the spending cuts first and then talk about tax increases. Right now 24 plus million Americans are either unemployed or under employed paying very little in Federal Income Taxes. Put those people back to work and the revenue problem would be partially solved.
    Thank you, in my opinion you hit the nail on the head, it's not that I believe the world would end, or business would go broke if the tax cuts were allowed to end. Business and individuals did pretty well with the old rates.

    But what didn't happen was the spending cuts, they never do. I'm just tired of being lied to, so I'm never going to be for any type of tax hikes, until I see variable, honest spending cuts. When I can see that our government (I don't care who is in charge) is serious about fixing broken programs, making them more efficient and less costly.... when spending cuts are enacted, rather then just pushing money from one program to the other. When that happens … then come and ask for help.

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    Re: Debt ceiling cost to taxpayers: $1.7 billion

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    There are four components of GDP with the largest one being consumption. You tell me how you, keeping more of what you earn impacts consumption. this is a private sector economy that relies on consumer spending. More take home pay leads to more consumer spending and that stimulates and grows the economy. The Obama tax cuts were not rate cuts but instead or basically as you stated tax credits along with a simple rebate that once spent was gone. Tax rate cuts however put more money into your hands with every paycheck. I hope you can see the difference.

    Both Reagan and GHW Bush compromised with liberals accepting a 3 to 1 spending cuts to tax increases. Guess what, we got the tax increases but NOT the spending cuts. Give us the spending cuts first and then talk about tax increases. Right now 24 plus million Americans are either unemployed or under employed paying very little in Federal Income Taxes. Put those people back to work and the revenue problem would be partially solved.
    Hey bro, sorry for the late response. I'm not so active on these forums I just got an email saying the thread was updated, lol.

    Anyway here is the way I see it - yes, tax cuts on the middle class work. Like you said putting money into people's pockets is beneficial. But when you cut taxes on corporations and on the super wealthy, the money gets put into a bank and not spread into the economy. Find me a scholastic source that says otherwise. You can't. That's the thing. Tax cuts are not the answer right now. The problem is that corporations are not hiring people because there is no demand and there is a lack of confidence. That's the problem. Not taxes at a high level. Nor is spending the problem either right now.

    You're right about spending cuts not happening ever though. That's why a balanced budget amendment would be nice. It would keep them in line. But again, a deal should go through ASAP and be poised to take effect in 2013 or 2014, and it should be allotted at least 8 years or so until the balanced budget amendment restrictions have to come into play.

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