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Thread: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

  1. #431
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    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Article I, Section 8, Clause 1: "The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States...."

    Very good, you can cut and paste. This however, doesn't mean you understand, or apply the clause properly.

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    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by EarlzP View Post
    Give your conservative tea party pit bulls buddies time and they will be able to lower the living standards of the poor, the deficit deal should help the poor get poorer and the rich get richer
    Your post would probably get accolades over at DemocratUndergroud or Daily Kos, but here it will be snickered at due to its reliance on the latest far left platitudes.

    • "The America Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money." -- Alexis de Tocqueville





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    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    It just like those that seem to dislike this country of ours to compare it to a country(Norway) a country who is about the same size as New Mexico, the population of Minnesota, and the GDP of Rhode Island. A country who's GDP is dependent on oil and gas exportation to the tune of 22% of it's GDP

    Seeing the GPD percentage related to gas and oil here in America is 7.5% I guess those same people are basically asking that we increase our drilling and oil output by 3 fold just like Norway right ?

    It's easy to cherry pick other countries and point out their good points, but a comparison between them and us, is only useful when you consider everything that country does. What I fail to understand is why it “seems” that liberals always want to run down our country, and forget the good in it, why always point to the bad in our history, and never mention the good we have given to the world ? Then wonder in the next breath, why people get the opinion of them that they hate our country. Maybe if you mentioned the USA more often in a good light, people wouldn't get that opinion of you that they do.

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    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    really. is that why the poor in America are comparable to the middle class in Europe?
    Seriously? On what planet are you?

    First off all, comparing a country to a continent is arsine at best.

    As for the attack it self... prove it. Prove that the middle class of Germany, France, Spain, UK are people that live on 11k US dollars a year.... which is the official poverty threshold of the US.
    PeteEU

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    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Tell us--specifically--what subsidies the oil companies get from the government. Thanks in advance!
    Read the article
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverDad View Post
    I hate half-assed analysis in newspapers that is published in order to foster an agenda.

    There is a relationship between tax rates and economic growth that is completely ignored by this G&M article.

    Let's look at the whole picture and let's begin the comparison in 1981 when Reagan took the US on a different course from the rest of the major Western economies.

    In 1981, the GDP per capita of the US was $26,005
    In 1981, the GDP per capita of Canada was $23,708
    In 1981, the GDP per capita of Germany was $21,243
    In 1981, the GDP per capita of France was $20,325
    In 1981, the GDP per capita of Italy was $18,973

    Let's normalize the numbers with the US set to 100.

    In 1981, the GDP per capita of the US was normalized to 100
    In 1981, the GDP per capita of Canada was 91.17
    In 1981, the GDP per capita of Germany was 81.69
    In 1981, the GDP per capita of France was 78.16
    In 1981, the GDP per capita of Italy was 72.96

    In 2008, the GDP per capita of the US was $43,250 (normalize to 100)
    In 2008, the GDP per capita of Canada was $36,123 (83.52)
    In 2008, the GDP per capita of Germany was $33,663 (77.83)
    In 2008, the GDP per capita of France was $30,624 (70.81)
    In 2008, the GDP per capita of Italy was $28,245 (65.31)

    So, to put the numbers into perspective.

    If the US had instituted Canadian policies and tax rates back in 1981 and followed the same policies and tax rates that Canada implemented in the period between 1981 and 2008, the present US per capita income of $43,250 would be $39,622, an 8.5% reduction in income.

    If the US had instituted German policies and tax rates back in 1981 and followed the same policies and tax rates that Germany implemented in the period between 1981 and 2008, the present US per capita income of $43,250 would be $41,209, an 4.75% reduction in income.

    If the US had instituted French policies and tax rates back in 1981 and followed the same policies and tax rates that France implemented in the period between 1981 and 2008, the present US per capita income of $43,250 would be $39,182, a 9.4% reduction in income.

    If the US had instituted Italian policies and tax rates back in 1981 and followed the same policies and tax rates that Italy implemented in the period between 1981 and 2008, the present US per capita income of $43,250 would be $38,713, a 10.5% reduction in income.

    Look at how far each of those countries has slipped over the last generation, especially Canada, which had a 1981 per capita income that was 91.17% of the US level and in 2008 it had slipped to an income level that was only 83.52% of American levels.

    TAX RATES AFFECT ECONOMIC GROWTH.

    The US and Mexico, back in colonial days had nearly identical GDP per capita figures. We were equally wealthy. Over the ensuing two hundred and fifty years the US simply grew its economy a half percent or so faster than Mexico and look at the result today. We started off with equal levels of wealth and today the
    Using 1981 to "normalize" income and then apply it 2008 income is "playing with statistics"

    Here's a better look at what happened in the US



    IOW, nearly all that growth in GDP went to the upper bracket
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by mpg View Post
    Does the opinion of the London analytical center Legatum Institute outweigh the UN and OECD combined?
    Yes, because Standard of Living measures are more relevant than GDP growth figures. SoL depend on a more detailed set of data than just income and economic stats
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Seriously? On what planet are you?

    First off all, comparing a country to a continent is arsine at best.

    As for the attack it self... prove it. Prove that the middle class of Germany, France, Spain, UK are people that live on 11k US dollars a year.... which is the official poverty threshold of the US.
    In most of Europe, the poor get the same medical care that the middle class do. In the US, they just die
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    I value our seniors, I don't value the unnecessary optional GOP war in Iraq. The GOP wanted it, now let them pay for it by giving up their precious tax cuts.
    As I said we have different priorities.
    Irrelevant to the issue -- you stated that the war in Iraq is the biggest part of the increase in the debt.
    This is demonstrably false, as noted.
    So... you're either lying, or you do not know any better.

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    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Congress can increase the FICA cap and lock the funds from general fund use. No need to increase the deficit whatsoever.
    There is if you want to cash in any of the $2.6T in SSTF IOUs.
    The money to make good on those IOUs can only come from the general fund or borrowing; either will increase the deficit.

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