Page 43 of 54 FirstFirst ... 33414243444553 ... LastLast
Results 421 to 430 of 538

Thread: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

  1. #421
    Sage
    RiverDad's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Last Seen
    04-20-14 @ 02:16 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    5,039

    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Middleground View Post
    I found this article in The Globe and Mail and had to share. I admit I smirk when I hear Americans complain about tax rates as I knew they pay less than most developed countries. In fact, tax rates in the US today are comparable to those of 1965! Having said that, there's no graph that shows which country gets more bang for their taxed bucks, but that is another point altogether.

    I'm interested in hearing feedback and whether this surprises you or not.
    I hate half-assed analysis in newspapers that is published in order to foster an agenda.

    There is a relationship between tax rates and economic growth that is completely ignored by this G&M article.

    Let's look at the whole picture and let's begin the comparison in 1981 when Reagan took the US on a different course from the rest of the major Western economies.

    In 1981, the GDP per capita of the US was $26,005
    In 1981, the GDP per capita of Canada was $23,708
    In 1981, the GDP per capita of Germany was $21,243
    In 1981, the GDP per capita of France was $20,325
    In 1981, the GDP per capita of Italy was $18,973

    Let's normalize the numbers with the US set to 100.

    In 1981, the GDP per capita of the US was normalized to 100
    In 1981, the GDP per capita of Canada was 91.17
    In 1981, the GDP per capita of Germany was 81.69
    In 1981, the GDP per capita of France was 78.16
    In 1981, the GDP per capita of Italy was 72.96

    In 2008, the GDP per capita of the US was $43,250 (normalize to 100)
    In 2008, the GDP per capita of Canada was $36,123 (83.52)
    In 2008, the GDP per capita of Germany was $33,663 (77.83)
    In 2008, the GDP per capita of France was $30,624 (70.81)
    In 2008, the GDP per capita of Italy was $28,245 (65.31)

    So, to put the numbers into perspective.

    If the US had instituted Canadian policies and tax rates back in 1981 and followed the same policies and tax rates that Canada implemented in the period between 1981 and 2008, the present US per capita income of $43,250 would be $39,622, an 8.5% reduction in income.

    If the US had instituted German policies and tax rates back in 1981 and followed the same policies and tax rates that Germany implemented in the period between 1981 and 2008, the present US per capita income of $43,250 would be $41,209, an 4.75% reduction in income.

    If the US had instituted French policies and tax rates back in 1981 and followed the same policies and tax rates that France implemented in the period between 1981 and 2008, the present US per capita income of $43,250 would be $39,182, a 9.4% reduction in income.

    If the US had instituted Italian policies and tax rates back in 1981 and followed the same policies and tax rates that Italy implemented in the period between 1981 and 2008, the present US per capita income of $43,250 would be $38,713, a 10.5% reduction in income.

    Look at how far each of those countries has slipped over the last generation, especially Canada, which had a 1981 per capita income that was 91.17% of the US level and in 2008 it had slipped to an income level that was only 83.52% of American levels.

    TAX RATES AFFECT ECONOMIC GROWTH.

    The US and Mexico, back in colonial days had nearly identical GDP per capita figures. We were equally wealthy. Over the ensuing two hundred and fifty years the US simply grew its economy a half percent or so faster than Mexico and look at the result today. We started off with equal levels of wealth and today the

  2. #422
    Pragmatic Idealist
    upsideguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Rocky Mtn. High
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:01 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    10,145

    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    What the Euro-trash fail to realize is that the United States was never intended to be a Socialist Utopia like Europe wants to be. We as Americans do not turn to the Government to fix all of our problems; or at least we're not supposed to. Ours was intended to be a LIMITED Government, not an all-encompassing one, like they have chosen to submit to in Europe. Therefore, we are much less interested in paying into a government that we don't feel we're getting anything out of, and don't want anything from.
    Yep, we are more than happy having the 10th best standard of living in the world (and falling), trailing 8 european-style socialist countries.

    Norway at top of prosperity index - CNN

  3. #423
    Disappointed Evolutionist
    Catawba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Last Seen
    05-28-13 @ 08:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    27,254

    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    Yep, we are more than happy having the 10th best standard of living in the world (and falling), trailing 8 european-style socialist countries.

    Norway at top of prosperity index - CNN
    We just need to give trickle down economics some more time to work. Its only been used for 30 years now.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  4. #424
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:40 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,148

    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverDad View Post
    TAX RATES AFFECT ECONOMIC GROWTH.

    The US and Mexico, back in colonial days had nearly identical GDP per capita figures. We were equally wealthy. Over the ensuing two hundred and fifty years the US simply grew its economy a half percent or so faster than Mexico and look at the result today. We started off with equal levels of wealth and today the
    Truth, and I think that is something that is under-appreciated when people talk blithely of giving up a certain percentage of growth in order to meet some policy goal.


    In 1850 sub-Saharan Africa had about the same GDP per capita as America. The difference between America’s average standard of living today and that of Burundi is a mere 0.9 percent of extra growth a year. If Presidents Lincoln through Reagan had put in place policies, taxes, or regulations that slowed economic growth a mere 1 percent of what it actually was, 99 percent of us would now be living in soul-crushing poverty....

    If the economy continues growing at its current annual rate, U.S. GDP will double in 90 years. If we cannot do any better than last quarter’s 0.4 percent, however, it will take almost two centuries to double. But if we added a mere 1 percent to our current annual growth rate we would double the size of the nation’s economy in 40 years. Of course, even that pales when compared to what will happen if we achieve higher growth rates. If we could realize just the normal post-recession growth and maintain it, we would more than double the size of the economy by the end of the decade.

    As that may be too much to hope for, let’s cut that torrid pace in half and shoot for what we achieved during the Reagan years. Such a relatively modest rate of growth would double the size of the economy every 16 years. That would mean that when today’s newborn finishes high school our GDP would be $30 trillion. When his or her first child starts school the economy would be a whopping $60 trillion. Consider how much easier it becomes to pay for Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security, and a host of other government goodies if there is a $60 trillion pot to draw from, compared to approximately $15 trillion today.

    Forgoing a mere 1 percent growth through needless regulations wipes out close to $150 billion in potential growth in a year. That is more than all the “tax the rich” proposals the administration has put forward during the debt crisis. Through compounding, that annual loss of 1 percent would cost the economy almost $2 trillion in forgone growth by the end of the decade. Even in Washington $2 trillion still counts as a lot of money. It is, for instance, enough to pay the average salary of 8 million unemployed Americans for the next half-dozen years...

  5. #425
    Disappointed Evolutionist
    Catawba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Last Seen
    05-28-13 @ 08:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    27,254

    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    Yep, we are more than happy having the 10th best standard of living in the world (and falling), trailing 8 european-style socialist countries.

    Norway at top of prosperity index - CNN
    From your article:

    "Norway leads the 2010 list ranking the prosperity of 110 of the world's nations by the London analytical center Legatum Institute.

    Norway also topped the 2009 rankings.

    "The Prosperity Index seeks to understand how economic fundamentals, health, freedom, governance, safety, education, entrepreneurial opportunity, and social capital influence a country's economic growth and the happiness of its citizens," the group says.

    Europe dominates the Top 10, taking six of the spots. The United States and Canada represent North America, while Australia and New Zealand check in from the Pacific-Asia nations."

    Sure is fortunate we had Canada around to pull our ranking up!
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  6. #426
    Sage
    mpg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Milford, CT
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 02:20 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    7,770

    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    Yep, we are more than happy having the 10th best standard of living in the world (and falling), trailing 8 european-style socialist countries.

    Norway at top of prosperity index - CNN
    Does the opinion of the London analytical center Legatum Institute outweigh the UN and OECD combined?
    If you expect people to be rational, you aren't being rational.

  7. #427
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:40 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,148

    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    From your article:

    "Norway leads the 2010 list ranking the prosperity of 110 of the world's nations by the London analytical center Legatum Institute.

    Norway also topped the 2009 rankings.
    amazing. you mean a nation tapped it's abundant natural resources by drilling for oil and it made it's citizenry wealthier?

    i'm astonished, simply astonished.

  8. #428
    Sage
    PeteEU's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Denmark
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 02:46 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    29,092

    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by mpg View Post
    Does the opinion of the London analytical center Legatum Institute outweigh the UN and OECD combined?
    No but the UN and OECD does not do what the Legatum does. Having higher GDP per captia does not mean the population is more phosphorous. The US GDP per capita is highly skewed due to massive wealth among few and massive poverty among many... it is called income inequality. That is why countries in Europe are higher on the prosperity index because their income inequality is so much better than the US and it shows.
    PeteEU

  9. #429
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:40 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,148

    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    No but the UN and OECD does not do what the Legatum does. Having higher GDP per captia does not mean the population is more phosphorous.
    one would rather hope that they would be less so

    The US GDP per capita is highly skewed due to massive wealth among few and massive poverty among many... it is called income inequality.
    really. is that why the poor in America are comparable to the middle class in Europe?

  10. #430
    Professor

    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Last Seen
    04-26-13 @ 03:23 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    1,404
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    one would rather hope that they would be less so



    really. is that why the poor in America are comparable to the middle class in Europe?
    Give your conservative tea party pit bulls buddies time and they will be able to lower the living standards of the poor, the deficit deal should help the poor get poorer and the rich get richer

Page 43 of 54 FirstFirst ... 33414243444553 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •