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Thread: Breaking: Agreement has been reached on raising the debt limit....

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    Re: Breaking: Agreement has been reached on raising the debt limit....

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    You still don't get it, so how about answering the question, what is it about the liberal ideology that creates such loyalty? There WAS a public debt surplus but it was the result of taking money from intergovt. holdings thus the total debt went up. you don't seem to understand total debt and what we pay debt service on. Does it matter if there is a public debt surplus when total debt rose as did the debt service your tax dollars helped fund?
    You are trying to go so deep into this issue to find ANYTHING you can to convince yourself democrats are wrong, and you, along with conservatives are right. I dont have that problem. I can look at facts and draw conclusions based on whats real, and whats not. I am loyal to my party because I believe government. I believe government growth is the KEY to economic growth. Actually, I dont think we are spending enough money right now in washington. Even economists say you dont CUT government down to lower our debt, you spend MORE and increase government size. This is something the GOP is un-willing to accept. Hard REAL information from a credible source, kind of like Global Warming. The GOP might be able to trick some Americans into buying their B.S., but I know the truth. The GOP's goal is to destroy the lower and middle class and make Americans rely on large corporations to survive, and THAT my friend, is called DICTATORSHIP.
    Last edited by SypherAL; 08-01-11 at 10:42 AM.

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    Re: Obama: We have a deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Check the Treasury Dept. Flyer, as that is where the real numbers exist and what we pay debt service on. You want badly to believe what Clinton and the media told you but the facs simply refute it.
    Where did you post the Treasury numbers? I am not ignoring them.

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    Re: Breaking: Agreement has been reached on raising the debt limit....

    Quote Originally Posted by SypherAL View Post
    You are trying to go so deep into this issue to find ANYTHING you can to convince yourself democrats are wrong, and you, along with conservatives are right. I dont have that problem. I can look at facts and draw conclusions based on whats real, and whats not. I am loyal to my party because I believe government. I believe government growth is the KEY to economic growth. Actually, I dont think we are spending enough money right now in washington. Even economists say you dont CUT government down to lower our debt, you spend MORE and increase government size. This is something the GOP is un-willing to accept. Hard REAL information from a credible source, kind of like Global Warming. The GOP might be able to trick some Americans into buying their B.S., but I know the truth. The GOP's goal is to destroy the lower and middle class and make Americans rely on large corporations to survive, and THAT my friend, is called DICTATORSHIP.
    If you truly are as objective as you claim then explain the actual Treasury numbers to us and how it shows a deficit and rising debt? Bigger govt? Is that what you are learning in school? Govt. is the answer? Where is that liberal utopia that you want this country to become?

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    Re: Obama: We have a deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Flyersfan314 View Post
    Where did you post the Treasury numbers? I am not ignoring them.
    09/30/2001 5,807,463,412,200.06
    09/30/2000 5,674,178,209,886.86
    09/30/1999 5,656,270,901,615.43
    09/30/1998 5,526,193,008,897.62
    09/30/1997 5,413,146,011,397.34
    09/30/1996 5,224,810,939,135.73
    09/29/1995 4,973,982,900,709.39
    09/30/1994 4,692,749,910,013.32
    09/30/1993 4,411,488,883,139.38

    Or you can do it by day at the following

    http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/BPD...application=np
    Last edited by Conservative; 08-01-11 at 10:51 AM.

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    Re: Breaking: Agreement has been reached on raising the debt limit....

    This deal is being called a "down payment", it's hardly that. And call me jaded, but these triggers that are supposed to happen when / if the Congress or this committee cannot agree... my crystal ball says those triggers will quickly fade away and be ignored or removed entirely. This debate and fight will happen all again. The ONLY thing that was positive in this entire sham of a display by government, is that the tea party has now forced and framed this discussion in Washington and has forced everyone to listen. This has also proven that the tea party is no astro turf - and that they at least as a vast minority, have the ability and the support to push harder for conservative ideals than anyone ever could have imagined a year or two ago. IF there is ever to be a change in Washington to fight the status quo of a John McCain or a Harry Reid, the tea party is it. At least right now.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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    Re: Breaking: Agreement has been reached on raising the debt limit....

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    If you truly are as objective as you claim then explain the actual Treasury numbers to us and how it shows a deficit and rising debt? Bigger govt? Is that what you are learning in school? Govt. is the answer? Where is that liberal utopia that you want this country to become?
    I am not basing my decisions of anything in school, I dont need school to teach me whats right and whats wrong. I base my decisions on FACTS and CREDIBLE sources. I dont let extreme right-wing talk radio shows influence my decisions, and I dont believe letting poor families suffer because they "chose to be poor" is a humane cause to support. This country was founded on priciples to protect its citizens from these large corporations, including insurance companies, that the Republican party is out to support. The more you make people worry less about god given rights like food, medical care, and education, the more money these people are going to spend, which in return will create demand and create a path to quick economic recovery. The only way we can reach that goal is if Americans are willing to make some hard choices. The rich, the ones who created this mess in the first place, are not going to give up a dime, and thats just something I have come to accept. Republicans are more than willing to balance this budget out on the backs of the poor and ill. The ONLY way things will change is if Americans can understand the GOP's influence must be greatly reduced in washington for good, well, or atleast until they can reform their beliefs to actually serve the PEOPLE, not their employees like G.E. and big oil companies. God bless America, I am done explaining myself here.

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    Re: Breaking: Agreement has been reached on raising the debt limit....

    Any thread, like this one, that has devolved into a 'My side is better than your side" is nothing but a waste of time. Neither side is 100% right and neither side is 100% wrong. Neither side gives a damn about the average American. What we have is a very badly broken two party system.

    Not to say that we have any real alternative.

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    Re: Obama: We have a deal

    The debt increased from intergovernmental holdings. I think that is the problem here, we are arguing two different yet similar things. Intergovernmental holdings don't effect the economy like public debt and don't necessarily need to be paid back (for example reforming SS would greatly reduce the intergovernmental holdings).

    Either way Clinton did a better job of any other modern president of limiting the budget.

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    Re: Breaking: Agreement has been reached on raising the debt limit....

    Quote Originally Posted by SypherAL View Post
    I am not basing my decisions of anything in school, I dont need school to teach me whats right and whats wrong. I base my decisions on FACTS and CREDIBLE sources. I dont let extreme right-wing talk radio shows influence my decisions, and I dont believe letting poor families suffer because they "chose to be poor" is a humane cause to support. This country was founded on priciples to protect its citizens from these large corporations, including insurance companies, that the Republican party is out to support. The more you make people worry less about god given rights like food, medical care, and education, the more money these people are going to spend, which in return will create demand and create a path to quick economic recovery. The only way we can reach that goal is if Americans are willing to make some hard choices. The rich, the ones who created this mess in the first place, are not going to give up a dime, and thats just something I have come to accept. Republicans are more than willing to balance this budget out on the backs of the poor and ill. The ONLY way things will change is if Americans can understand the GOP's influence must be greatly reduced in washington for good, well, or atleast until they can reform their beliefs to actually serve the PEOPLE, not their employees like G.E. and big oil companies. God bless America, I am done explaining myself here.
    Yeah, I can see your credible sources that ignore actual data. I see a lot of misinformation in your posts because obviously you get your information from partisan sites or sites that only tell half the story(polifact) Still waiting to see that surplus you claim Clinton had and show it with actual numbers. If you are wrong on that what makes you think you aren't wrong on your other issues? This country wasn't built on the principles you support and I guess it is easier blaming a big company that actually employes people that pays taxes than it is holding your elected Representatives accountable for creating a 14.4 trillion dollar debt. Millions of people are employed by those evil big companies and those people live in your community, pay taxes, and contribute to charities. Keep discounting that.

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    Re: Breaking: Agreement has been reached on raising the debt limit....

    Quote Originally Posted by Polotick View Post
    Any thread, like this one, that has devolved into a 'My side is better than your side" is nothing but a waste of time. Neither side is 100% right and neither side is 100% wrong. Neither side gives a damn about the average American. What we have is a very badly broken two party system.

    Not to say that we have any real alternative.
    The Democratic party STANDS for giving a damn about the average American.... Our sole principles are founded on medicare and social security along with government programs to assit poverty in a broad range of areas. I am not saying our party is better then the GOP, I am saying our principles serve the people instead of the wealthy and large corporations.

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