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Thread: House to Vote on "Cut, Cap, and Balance" Bill

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    Re: House to Vote on "Cut, Cap, and Balance" Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    I think it is an attempt by them to save face with their base.
    It passed

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    Re: House to Vote on "Cut, Cap, and Balance" Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by ptif219 View Post
    It passed
    And it has served its purpose if you are happy! That is all it was intended to do, to make their base think they tried, before they had to compromise with the Dems.
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    Re: House to Vote on "Cut, Cap, and Balance" Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    And it has served its purpose if you are happy! That is all it was intended to do, to make their base think they tried, before they had to compromise with the Dems.
    No it will show the dems and Obama only care about raising the ceiling. The dems and Obama do not want a balanced budget. The proof is they have been lack in their duties for there has been no budget passed since Obama was elected.

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    Re: House to Vote on "Cut, Cap, and Balance" Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by ptif219 View Post
    No it will show the dems and Obama only care about raising the ceiling. The dems and Obama do not want a balanced budget. The proof is they have been lack in their duties for there has been no budget passed since Obama was elected.
    Yep, the GOP's bill worked as long as you are still happy with them. Now you won't blame them when they compromise with the Dems because they convinced you they gave it their best shot. And to think some thought it was a waste of time!
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    Re: House to Vote on "Cut, Cap, and Balance" Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    At least they are putting out ideas. And it seems a reasonable one to me. One that should pass. So why won't it pass? What is stopping it from passing?
    Since when has American society become so acceptable of mediocrity? Personally, I would prefer politicians actually come up with good ideas rather than just coming up with crap like this and calling it a day.

    The idea of capping and balancing the budget is bad for a multitude of reasons. Here is a short list I made off the top of my head:
    -GDP for any given year can constantly be revised. What happens in a situation when the GDP is assumed to be X for the fiscal year, but it is actually less than what is predicted? How do you account for that overspending in future budgets?
    -Add to that data for GDP lags by a year, so in order to enforce the spending cap Congress will most likely have to use the previous year's GDP. This will artificially lower the cap.
    -There is no measure in this bill to override the balanced budget in times of recessions. When revenue will naturally fall, government spending will likewise have to fall. This has the potential to make the impact of future recessions much worse than they otherwise could be.
    -Adding to my second point it takes away the government's ability to replace any declines in consumer demand during recessions.
    -Sometimes running a deficit can be beneficial to long-term economic growth. The United States has practiced this since the days of Alexander Hamilton.

    It will not pass because it is an ideologically driven bill. Maybe when Republicans figure out that they only control one half of one branch of government and write a bill that is capable of passing in the other chamber of Congress, then we can have a serious discussion about the worthiness of a given bill.

    To clarify one of your earlier posts the passage of this bill does not mean that a rise in debt ceiling is a certainty. Under Title III of the bill the only condition under which the debt ceiling is raised is if both chambers of Congress pass a Balanced Budget Amendment. Anyone who follows politics knows full well there are not 290 votes in the House and there are definitely not 67 votes necessary in the Senate. So, technically, it is possible that a spending cap could be passed without a corresponding rise in the debt ceiling. That is yet another reason why this bill is a joke.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Wait...if this were true then how can you say that it's just "showmanship" or that they "know it won't pass"? Obviously them making a "plan B" shows that this is not true. Or am I again missing something?
    I think everybody but the freshman Republicans understand that what they want to do will not pass. This is more or less an opportunity for Republicans leaders in the House to give the appearance that they are trying to appease the demands of the Tea Party, but were otherwise unsuccessful.

    So far the only Republicans that have made anything that looks remotely like a Plan B are Senate Republicans with Mitch McConnell's plan. John Boehner and other House Republican leaders have stated that passage of that bill in the House would be almost impossible and that Boehner would need to rely heavily on Democrats to ensure that it would pass.

    Right now, from my perspective, House Republicans have no backup plan if this bill fails in the Senate or the President vetoes it. I think they feel that they can win the PR battle against the President and avoid having the American people blame them for the potential economic disaster that could follow if the debt ceiling is not raised.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Are you sure? Have you read the bill?
    Yes, I have read the bill. Indeed, StillBallin75 is right that the bill lacks details about specific cuts that have to be made. All this bill does is set spending limits for next year's budget, but in no way says what those cuts will be in order to meet the spending limits that the bill calls for.

    Here is a link to the bill so you can examine it yourself:Read The Bill: H.R. 2560 - GovTrack.us

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    So you don't want a debt ceiling at all? Why? Everyone else is subject to a debt ceiling via caps on credit cards, etc etc...why shouldn't the government be subject to the same thing? Otherwise what is to stop them from spending 100 trillion dollars on a toilet seat? (note that was an obvious exaggeration with the toilet seat bit but gets the point across I hope.)
    I will come out and say that I would have no problem completely doing away with the debt ceiling. I find it senseless that Congress has the ability to pass spending bills and yet does not have to ensure that the Executive Branch has the means necessary to pay the bills that both branches agreed to.

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    Re: House to Vote on "Cut, Cap, and Balance" Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    And it has served its purpose if you are happy! That is all it was intended to do, to make their base think they tried, before they had to compromise with the Dems.
    Compromise on what? What plan have the dems put forth?
    "Hmmm...Can't decide if I want to watch "Four Houses" or give myself an Icy Hot pee hole enema..." - Blake Shelton


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    Re: House to Vote on "Cut, Cap, and Balance" Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    Compromise on what? What plan have the dems put forth?
    The "plan" apparently is some speech Obama gave... that's their plan. Of course this morning Obama throws in behind the Gang of 6 who actually WROTE DOWN a plan and didn't just levy more platitudes in a speech. More shifting of responsibility and work by Obama to others. I'm guessing someone else will have to do all of Obama's work for him so he can just defer to it and go get in some swings on the green.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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    Re: House to Vote on "Cut, Cap, and Balance" Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    The "plan" apparently is some speech Obama gave... that's their plan. Of course this morning Obama throws in behind the Gang of 6 who actually WROTE DOWN a plan and didn't just levy more platitudes in a speech. More shifting of responsibility and work by Obama to others. I'm guessing someone else will have to do all of Obama's work for him so he can just defer to it and go get in some swings on the green.
    The Gang of Six plan only cuts 3.7 trillion over 10 years. We'll add half of that to the debt this year. I'm glad the senate is actually working on a proposal, but I'm not ready to break out the party favors.
    "Hmmm...Can't decide if I want to watch "Four Houses" or give myself an Icy Hot pee hole enema..." - Blake Shelton


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    Re: House to Vote on "Cut, Cap, and Balance" Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    The Gang of Six plan only cuts 3.7 trillion over 10 years. We'll add half of that to the debt this year. I'm glad the senate is actually working on a proposal, but I'm not ready to break out the party favors.
    I know... and the issue isn't being addressed. 3.7 Trillion in 10 years is nothing without a balanced budget amendment that prevents Congress and the current or future Presidents from continuing to run up the debt. Anything less is to me, just more theater.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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    Re: House to Vote on "Cut, Cap, and Balance" Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    I know... and the issue isn't being addressed. 3.7 Trillion in 10 years is nothing without a balanced budget amendment that prevents Congress and the current or future Presidents from continuing to run up the debt. Anything less is to me, just more theater.
    Sad thing is, this is probably the bill that will pass, and the republicans will probably end up losing ground with the public in the process.
    "Hmmm...Can't decide if I want to watch "Four Houses" or give myself an Icy Hot pee hole enema..." - Blake Shelton


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