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Tea party to GOP: We could make 'examples' of you over debt ceiling

AdamT said:
The solution is very obviously to simply raise the debt ceiling without preconditions, just as it's been done over a 100 times before. Everyone on both sides understands that spending has to be curtailed in the mid-to-long term, but the smart way to approach that is not to try to patch together some kind of Frankenstein's monster under a false deadline.
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What we need is both parties to remember the lost art of compromise, and get to work doing their job.
 
If Obama had any brains, he would simply call for a policy of freezing the debt ceiling without increasing taxes on the middle class.

Because then guess who would have to pay up?

Doing that would force the GOP into wanting to increase the debt ceiling, because the GOP can't make its rich sponsors pay more taxes, so they would have to tell the middle class to shoulder the extra burden, making them unpopular. Since that's not a politically viable option, the GOP would have no other choice than to advocate raising the debt,

which, obviously, is what the GOP has done for years.
 
AdamT said:
The solution is very obviously to simply raise the debt ceiling without preconditions, just as it's been done over a 100 times before. Everyone on both sides understands that spending has to be curtailed in the mid-to-long term, but the smart way to approach that is not to try to patch together some kind of Frankenstein's monster under a false deadline.
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Look where that solution has got us. It's not going to happen this time.
 
solletica said:
If Obama had any brains, he would simply call for a policy of freezing the debt ceiling without increasing taxes on the middle class.

Because then guess who would have to pay up?

Doing that would force the GOP into wanting to increase the debt ceiling, because the GOP can't make its rich sponsors pay more taxes, so they would have to tell the middle class to shoulder the extra burden, making them unpopular. Since that's not a politically viable option, the GOP would have no other choice than to advocate raising the debt,

which, obviously, is what the GOP has done for years.
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Those are the same sponsers that also back the Dems. This right here is the problem. So many wanting to blame one side while refusing to own up that it's both parties that are at fault.
 
solletica said:
It's the truth, backed up by historical data--the largest increases in the US debt occurred during GOP administrations, caused by military spending (arms race, Iraq War). . .

. . .look at the graph. Note the biggest spikes occurred during the Reagan-GHWB years and the dumbya years.

The Reagan-GHWB debt can be excused as a result of the need to compete with Soviet Union in the Cold War.

But the dumbya deficits cannot be excused.

I know this comes as a surprise to you considering FoxNEWS and Sean Hannity never mentioned it.
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I know you guys keep forgetting the lies of the Dems regarding their promises to cut expenses when they did not do so, but that's okay, some of us do. Also, I think your nice little chart is out-of-date. You see, there was an election in 2010. That election put many new GOP members in Congress. This is not your mother's GOP.
 
No, the art of compromise.


Martin Luther King, Jr., once said that the people in our country “must learn to live together as brothers or perish together as fools.”

http://go.hrw.com/resources/go_sc/hlth/hh4ada_ch_99.pdf

By contrast, business demonstrates in many ways how to prosper through compromise. In a free market society, conceiving, developing and delivering a product or service is filled with hundreds of compromises that balance the needs of the consumer to obtain value with the needs of the producer to make a profit.

The Art of Compromise CIO.com


The art of compromise, which is essential to democracy, seems to have gone out of style in recent years of angry all-or-nothing politics.

Read more: The Nation: The Art of Compromise - TIME
 
LesGovt said:
I know you guys keep forgetting the lies of the Dems regarding their promises to cut expenses when they did not do so,
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:lol: who cares? Why worry oneself over a single stone created by the Dems when the mountain of dirt was created by the GOP--as indicated in the chart?

LesGovt said:
but that's okay, some of us do. Also, I think your nice little chart is out-of-date.
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Perfectly in date. I think what you meant say was that it wasn't the chart Rush Limbaugh gave you.

This is an old, tired pattern: the right wingers getting up and screaming "the Lefties are spending, the Lefties are spending!",

and then we throw up a chart showing that in fact the Right that's responsible for most of the debt,

and the right, having had its ass handed to it, crawls back in its hole, looks around, checks if no one else is around, and starts up again w/"the Lefties are spending, the Lefties are spending!"

LesGovt said:
You see, there was an election in 2010. That election put many new GOP members in Congress. This is not your mother's GOP.
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There's only one GOP--the Grand 'ol Pit.
 
Maybe you missed it, and judging by your post, you did...but a great deal of the republicans elected in this past election cycle ran on cutting spending in DC. The problem for you is that this time, they actually mean it. As much as the tea party is hated by the left, they are the only group that has been for cutting spending. They had their hand in electing a lot of republicans this go around and they are serious about changing how things are done.

Like I said, maybe you didnt notice.
 
LesGovt said:
This is not your mother's GOP.
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and this aint your dad's dems

California budget: Democrats pass austerity budget - Los Angeles Times

Cuomo budget: $10 billion deficit cut, no new taxes, layoffs likely

Jerry Brown Budget Cuts | California budget: Gov. Jerry Brown approves cuts to services for poor, sick and elderly - Los Angeles Times

MA House votes to restrict unions - Boston.com

New Jersey Assembly Passes Bill That Requires Public Workers' Unions To Pay More For Benefits - WPIX

Emanuel Unveils Major Budget Cut On First Full Day « CBS Chicago

Governor Pat Quinn signs Illinois education reform bill into law, new rules effect school days, teacher strikes, tenure | abc7chicago.com

Detroit Moves Against Unions - WSJ.com

Union Deal Defeated; Gov. Malloy Pledges To Cut State Workers - CTnow

Rahm Emanuel sends layoff notices to city workers in union showdown - Chicago Sun-Times
 
bottom line: 61.6T under and sinking 5.3T per year:

The federal government's financial condition deteriorated rapidly last year, far beyond the $1.5 trillion in new debt taken on to finance the budget deficit, a USA TODAY analysis shows.

The government added $5.3 trillion in new financial obligations in 2010, largely for retirement programs such as Medicare and Social Security. That brings to a record $61.6 trillion the total of financial promises not paid for.

Medicare alone took on $1.8 trillion in new liabilities, more than the record deficit prompting heated debate between Congress and the White House over lifting the debt ceiling.

Social Security added $1.4 trillion in obligations, partly reflecting longer life expectancies. Federal and military retirement programs added more to the financial hole, too.
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U.S. funding for future promises lags by trillions - USATODAY.com

there's not enough revenue in the copernican system to make these promises complete

if something isn't done NOW to fundamentally reform our entitlements, then our big 3 federal programs (our state pensions as well) will DIE

leadership, anyone?
 
solletica said:
:lol: who cares? Why worry oneself over a single stone created by the Dems when the mountain of dirt was created by the GOP--as indicated in the charts.
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You still don't understand the nature of the lies about cutting expendtures and its impact on deficits.

solletica said:
Perfectly in date. I think what you meant say was that it wasn't the chart Rush Limbaugh gave you.
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You are humorous. I meant what I said and I am the one who said it.

solletica said:
This is an old, tired pattern: the right wingers getting up and screaming "the Lefties are spending, the Lefties are spending!",
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I believe that all of the entitlements were driven by the Democrats and they make up far more than half of the budget. And, of course, thee are many other programs that were supported by Democrats.

solletica said:
and then we throw up a chart showing that in fact the Right that's responsible for most of the debt,
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In context, they do not.

solletica said:
and the right, having had its ass handed to it, crawls back in its hole, looks around, checks if no one else is around, and starts up again w/"the Lefties are spending, the Lefties are spending!"
Click to expand...

Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!

You are a stitch!

Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!

solletica said:
There's only one GOP--the Grand 'ol Pit.
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Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!

You are a stitch!

Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!

I think the Comedy channel may need your services.
 
LesGovt said:
You still don't understand the nature of the lies about cutting expendtures and its impact on deficits.
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We do--the GOP has chanted the "cut spending" mantra for years, and the chart on annual deficits proves they lied. Pretty basic :rolleyes:

OH, here's more charts from the CATO Institute, FYI. . .

The Republican Spending Explosion

http://www.cato.org/pubs/briefs/bp87.pdf
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LesGovt said:
You are humorous. I meant what I said and I am the one who said it.
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Nope. You said what rush limbaugh and/or someone at FoxNEWS told you to believe, which explains why, llike most conservatives, you're unable to provide any cites to refute the larger deficits under GOP administrations.

LesGovt said:
I believe that all of the entitlements were driven by the Democrats
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Yes, you believe many things, such as how palin, bachman, and the Mama Grizzlies will save America, or how global warming is a "myth", or how Intelligent Design is science, or. . .

Trouble is belief is irrelevant. What matters is evidence, and like most conservatives, you have none, since you get your "education" from the likes of bill o'reilly and sean hannity who don't offer any to go with their commentary.

Rest of unsubstantiated (no evidence) BS snipped.
 
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solletica said:
We do--the GOP has chanted the "cut spending" mantra for years, and the chart on annual deficits proves they lied. Pretty basic :rolleyes:

OH, here's more charts from the CATO Institute, FYI. . .

Nope. You said what rush limbaugh and/or someone at FoxNEWS told you to believe, which explains why, llike most conservatives, you're unable to provide any cites to refute the larger deficits under GOP administrations

Yes, you believe many things, such as how palin, bachman, and the Mama Grizzlies will save America, or how global warming is a "myth", or how Intelligent Design is science, or. . .

Trouble is belief is irrelevant. What matters is evidence, and like most conservatives, you have none, since you get your "education" from the likes of bill o'reilly and sean hannity who don't offer any to go with their commentary.

Rest of unsubstantiated (no evidence) BS snipped.
Click to expand...

Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!

My guess is that you even think you know something. You do not, but I confess, you are very funny.

Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!
 
OpportunityCost said:
Maybe you missed it, and judging by your post, you did...but a great deal of the republicans elected in this past election cycle ran on cutting spending in DC. The problem for you is that this time, they actually mean it. As much as the tea party is hated by the left, they are the only group that has been for cutting spending. They had their hand in electing a lot of republicans this go around and they are serious about changing how things are done.

Like I said, maybe you didnt notice.
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Heard that song in the past. How did that work out? Any chance we can learn from history?
 
Seems to me a lot of the republicans also ran on jobs jobs jobs. How's that workin' out? Can someone name a single solitary measure that republicans have proposed that might improve the job situation?
 
LesGovt said:
Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!Ha!

My guess is that you even think you know something. You do not
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It's really funny when there's evidence of those who think they know something but don't. . .

‪Palin Katie Couric Interview‬‏ - YouTube

When Michele Bachmann says “deficit” she doesn’t mean deficit

When Michele Bachmann says
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HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
images
 
Boo Radley said:
Heard that song in the past. How did that work out? Any chance we can learn from history?
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Why do you think that suddenly any demands to raise the debt ceiling are met with spending cuts? Because there is finally a large group within the republican caucus that realized we are spending entirely too much. Entitlement reform is on the table and to their credit even cuts in military spending are being discussed.

Thats all new. Do you really think that such a turnaround from 2001-2004 occurred with the same ole-same ole? I dont. I think the difference is the tea party ideas and current members of congress that ran on those ideas--and mean it.
 
Boo Radley said:
Heard that song in the past. How did that work out? Any chance we can learn from history?
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Indeed, I think some Republicans have learned from history that compromising with liberals doesn't satisfy liberals. Instead, they point to it and say, "See!!!! They spend too."
 
AdamT said:
Seems to me a lot of the republicans also ran on jobs jobs jobs. How's that workin' out? Can someone name a single solitary measure that republicans have proposed that might improve the job situation?
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Sure. Don't raise taxes on the rich. That is allegedly suppose to create jobs.
 
AdamT said:
Seems to me a lot of the republicans also ran on jobs jobs jobs. How's that workin' out? Can someone name a single solitary measure that republicans have proposed that might improve the job situation?
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The republicans usually run on debt debt debt. They just call it "tax cuts" to make it appealing to their (gullible) middle class voting base.
 
AdamT said:
The solution is very obviously to simply raise the debt ceiling without preconditions, just as it's been done over a 100 times before. Everyone on both sides understands that spending has to be curtailed in the mid-to-long term, but the smart way to approach that is not to try to patch together some kind of Frankenstein's monster under a false deadline.
Click to expand...

a problem with your logic (?) is that the budget process is broken. The senate has not passed a budget in nearly three years. If that process was in order then you have an argument.
 
X Factor said:
Indeed, I think some Republicans have learned from history that compromising with liberals doesn't satisfy liberals. Instead, they point to it and say, "See!!!! They spend too."
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You know, liberals could say the same thing. But this is why it's a problem. The function of government requires compromise. Without it, you cannot govern, and thus should not be in power.
 
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