Page 11 of 13 FirstFirst ... 910111213 LastLast
Results 101 to 110 of 130

Thread: McConnell Offers 'Backup' US Debt Limit Plan

  1. #101
    Distributist
    Jeezy's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Last Seen
    10-14-15 @ 03:15 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    1,326

    Re: McConnell Offers 'Backup' US Debt Limit Plan

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    I see what you're saying, Jeezy, but it's not that simple. You see, per Art 1, Sect 9, clause 6 of the U.S. Constitution, it is Congress' responsibility to determine exactly what those "appropriations" are under the law. If they don't adhere to Art 1, Sect 8, clause 2, they place the Treasury's ability to pay for those appropriations in jeapordy effectively "passing the buck" - being derelect in their duties as members of Congress. While it is true that Treasury would have to pay bills anyway, its job becomes that much harder because without the ability to borrow money since revenues are thin (remember, Treasury isn't collecting enough income taxes to keep pace with spending obligations) it has to pick and choose which bills to pay.
    I don't see why any of this is an insurmountable problem. In a post 8/2 world, I envision the president submitting one last budget proposal to Congress....his "doomsday" budget, which I am positive has already been written.

    They will pass it, and fulfill their constitutional duty.

    It's that simple.

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    To that, you are correct. IF Treasure decides to pay only those debt obligations (appropriations) listed on page 13 of the report, it wouldn't be maximizing it's "bang for the buck" as much as it would be if it had chosen to pay for those debt obligations listed on page 16 as the total amounts are nearly identical. Just so everyone understands what Jeezy and I are talking about here:

    From page 13 of the report (all figures in billions):

    Defense Vendor Payments (page 13) = $31.7

    From page 16 of the report (all figures in billions):

    Food/Nutrition Services + TANF = $9.3
    HUD Programs = $6.7
    Veterans Affairs Programs = $2.9
    Special Education Grants = $3.6
    Tuition Assistance = $10.4
    Total = $32.9

    Diff between expenditures on page 16 from page 13 = $1.2 billion ($173.9 - 172.7)
    SWAGSWAGSWAGSWAGSWAGSWAGSWAGSWAG
    Quote Originally Posted by Josie
    Thanks for your awesomeness, Jeezy.

  2. #102
    Sage
    Taylor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    US
    Last Seen
    Today @ 08:43 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    6,170

    Re: McConnell Offers 'Backup' US Debt Limit Plan

    Quote Originally Posted by BDBoop View Post
    We all know something needs to happen, and it should already have happened. It's the Republicans somehow trying to pretend they play no part in this, they want no responsibility for this, that is the hold up.
    I've heard *many* Republicans openly recognize that they've also been guilty of out-of-control spending. They also recognize (but need constant reminders) that the only reason they were given another chance is because the democrats the past few years were far worse. To agree with Obama on a tax and spend deal toward fiscal responsibility risks a devastating blow to the party, which is why it's not going to happen.

  3. #103
    Sage

    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Huntsville, AL (USA)
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:48 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    9,773

    Re: McConnell Offers 'Backup' US Debt Limit Plan

    Debt ceiling push is getting more heated, only now promonent business leaders have gotten into the frey. They're all but demanding that the debt ceiling gets raised and they're pushing Congress, especially the GOP, to make it happen FAST!!!

    WashingtonPost.com/Business

    “The business community in large numbers is saying to our leaders in Washington, ‘Do your job,’ ” said Business Roundtable President John Engler, a former Republican governor of Michigan. “Failure to raise the debt ceiling would strike an immediate and serious blow to any economic recovery, and failure to make significant progress on long-term debt reduction will continue the uncertainty which is hampering our investment climate.”

    ...

    The differences over the debt ceiling present a problem for corporate donors, who helped create the House Republican majority by shifting their contributions away from Democrats last year. The Chamber, which is Washington’s biggest lobbying organization, also spent millions on advertising in support of GOP challengers.

    The Public Campaign Action Fund, a liberal-leaning advocacy group that favors public financing of elections, calculates that the Chamber and the financial services sector together spent nearly $20 million on GOP midterm candidates affiliated with the conservative tea party movement. Those rank-and-file Republicans now form the backbone of opposition to any new tax revenue, including Democratic proposals to end loopholes benefiting hedge fund managers, corporate jet owners, and oil and gas companies.

    ...

    Wall Street lobbyists and other business groups preferred private meetings with GOP members to educate them on the consequences of a default. Several lobbyists also met Monday afternoon with Treasury Secretary Timothy F. Geithner to repeat their concerns.
    This is getting very interesting indeed!

  4. #104
    Sage
    sangha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Lower Hudson Valley, NY
    Last Seen
    09-17-17 @ 05:48 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    59,990

    Re: McConnell Offers 'Backup' US Debt Limit Plan

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Debt ceiling push is getting more heated, only now promonent business leaders have gotten into the frey. They're all but demanding that the debt ceiling gets raised and they're pushing Congress, especially the GOP, to make it happen FAST!!!

    WashingtonPost.com/Business



    This is getting very interesting indeed!
    Yes, it is

    U.S. Chamber’s Tom Donohue tells Atlanta Rotary how business is faring in D.C. | SaportaReport

    In one of the funnier moments during his Rotary talk, Donohue was asked if Congress was going to raise the debt ceiling.

    Yes, it will be raised, Donohue answered, mainly because the country can not afford to not pay its bills. To those newly-elected representatives who say they aren’t going to raise the debt ceiling and will shut down government, Donohue said the U.S. Chamber has its own message: “We’ll get rid of you.”
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  5. #105
    Sage

    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Huntsville, AL (USA)
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:48 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    9,773

    Re: McConnell Offers 'Backup' US Debt Limit Plan

    ...the U.S. Chamber has its own message: "We’ll get rid of you".
    DAMN!!! Talk about sending a strong message to members of Congress who sold their souls to corporate interest!!

    This is what Sen McConnel had to say to that (from the same NYTimes.com article linked below, first paragraph no less!)

    The Senate Republican leader, Mitch McConnell of Kentucky, warned Wednesday that allowing a federal default could have disastrous political consequences for his party and “destroy” the Republican brand.
    Seems the GOP is now in fallback mode w/o a sensable fallback plan. Speaking of which...

    More on Sen. McConnel's "fallback plan"...

    From NYTimes.com:

    Mr. McConnell’s proposal would give Mr. Obama sweeping power to increase the government’s borrowing authority, in three increments, by up to $2.4 trillion — enough, it is estimated, to cover federal obligations through next year — only if Mr. Obama specifies spending cuts of equal amounts. Congress would vote on whether or not to approve Mr. Obama’s debt-limit increases, but the president could veto any disapproval and presumably sustain his veto in the House and Senate.
    And here's the kicker, ladies and gentlemen...

    And Congress would not have to approve the proposed spending cuts before the debt-limit increase.
    All I have to say to this is......
    Last edited by Objective Voice; 07-13-11 at 06:12 PM.

  6. #106
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Last Seen
    05-06-12 @ 11:12 PM
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    9,800

    Re: McConnell Offers 'Backup' US Debt Limit Plan

    Yes, it will be raised, Donohue answered, mainly because the country can not afford to not pay its bills. To those newly-elected representatives who say they aren’t going to raise the debt ceiling and will shut down government, Donohue said the U.S. Chamber has its own message: “We’ll get rid of you.”
    Hallelujah and Amen.

  7. #107
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Canada, Costa Rica
    Last Seen
    05-16-16 @ 09:45 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    31,645

    Re: McConnell Offers 'Backup' US Debt Limit Plan

    Quote Originally Posted by BDBoop View Post
    Hallelujah and Amen.
    Yes, indeed.

    The American people have at last discovered how to spend their way to prosperity!

    Once you get past $15 trillion mark it really doesn't matter anymore. Why have ceilings at all?

    Raise high the roofbeam, carpenters~.

  8. #108
    Mod Conspiracy Theorist
    rocket88's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    A very blue state
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:19 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    31,198

    Re: McConnell Offers 'Backup' US Debt Limit Plan

    To those newly-elected representatives who say they aren’t going to raise the debt ceiling and will shut down government, Donohue said the U.S. Chamber has its own message: “We’ll get rid of you.”
    It'll be interesting to see if the GOP believes in business or in the Tea Party. It seems that they have two different agendas on this one.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    This issue has been plowed more times than Paris Hilton.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oborosen View Post
    Too bad we have to observe human rights.

  9. #109
    Professor

    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Last Seen
    03-23-13 @ 02:33 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    1,265

    Re: McConnell Offers 'Backup' US Debt Limit Plan

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Once again, the dems did not vote against it because they are ideologically opposed to increasing the debt. Their position is that sometimes debt is OK, and sometimes not OK. Therefore, being sometimes for debt and sometimes against it is not hypocritical. It is consistent with their beliefs

    The repubs, on the other hand, make a big show about how they oppose the debt and deficit spending.....except when they are in the majority. Suddenly deficit spending and debt is not a problem....It's a necessity!!!!


    It's OK If You're A Republican
    laughing .... okay ... I think I got this ..... libs are not against the debt ..... as long as they are running it up ..... but if republicans are doing the running up ... welllllllll then they are against it ... So what you are saying ... is that it's only for political reasons ..... that they are for or against the debt .... thanks for clearing that up .. sounds to me just like you are accusing the republicans of .......

  10. #110
    Tavern Bartender
    Constitutionalist
    American's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    12-15-17 @ 10:49 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    76,323

    Re: McConnell Offers 'Backup' US Debt Limit Plan

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    The GOP is setting a trap for Obama. Obama vetoes then raises it on his own, per the Republican plan, he gets attacked as trashing the Constitution. However, Obama actually does have a play at invoking the "legitimacy of all valid debt" clause, contained in the 14th Amendment. Whereas Congress violates the Constitution by refusing to authorize what the United States owes, Obama can submit an executive order designed to bring the United States into compliance with the Constitution.
    An executive order has zero effect on Congress. Only Congress can borrow money on the credit of the US. 14th Amendment doesn't apply to the President, because debt must be validated by law, which only Congress can pass.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

Page 11 of 13 FirstFirst ... 910111213 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •