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Thread: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

  1. #421
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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    So I have to support the Republocrats in some manner or shut up? Mmmmm, tyranny.

    How about this instead. It's America, it's still a free country for now. So long as it remains that way I will run my mouth the way I want to when I want to against who I want to. If you don't like it, don't read my posts. Sorry to point out that decades of Republocrat rule has driven us to this current state, or the fact that while Obama has made concessions and tried to compromise, the Republicans have been obstructionists in this entire thing. Even when given back their call for spending cuts, they refused because they want to keep things like the Capital Gains tax where it is to give big breaks to the super rich instead of doing what is right by the Republic. And they continue to do so. Obama has them in a corner, they had their chance to claim victory; but due to party politics, engaging in the partisan crapfest which has become standard Republocrat rule, they missed it. They ****ed up. Now they're just continuing this little farce for as long as they can but they know they're boned.

    You may claim you all "know about the partisanship", I'm not so sure that's a statement of fact. As it seems that many even here are still falling to the partisan rhetoric, attacks, and defenses.

    So no, I will not "just be quiet". I have a right to speak, and I will damned well do just that. And if you don't like it, well it's freedom baby. Deal with it.
    /slides to a halt

    "Your Greek Chorus of Complete and Total Agreement has arrived."

  2. #422
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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    I'll keep asking, perhaps someone will tackle this question.....



    Given all the revenue the government collects each month, who will be paid before the seniors, veterans, and military?



    Anyone?
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    I'll keep asking, perhaps someone will tackle this question.....



    Given all the revenue the government collects each month, who will be paid before the seniors, veterans, and military?



    Anyone?
    Rev, those on the list you provided will be paid AFTER the debt holders (of which, social security is the largest followed by the Federal Reserve bank). However, i still believe a deal will be made before the 2nd and this little game of political chicken the GOP created has morphed their power grab for 2012 into a toy elephant. Tis bad form to hold your country by financial hostage....
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    Rev, those on the list you provided will be paid AFTER the debt holders (of which, social security is the largest followed by the Federal Reserve bank). However, i still believe a deal will be made before the 2nd and this little game of political chicken the GOP created has morphed their power grab for 2012 into a toy elephant. Tis bad form to hold your country by financial hostage....


    So Obama isn't holding the country in any financial hostage game? It's just the Republicans here? These faux cuts over 10 years amount again to pissing in the ocean.


    so SS will be paid, he lied about this.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    the prez has 3 priorities---lift the roof hi enough to get thru next november (ie, 2.4T), protect programs from cuts, raise revenue

    knuckle dragging neanderthals have two demands---d4d (dollar for dollar), no tax hikes

    as of last weekend they were sposed to be largely in agreement on 1.7T (biden)---1.1T discretionary, 200B mandatory (described as military pensions or farm subsidies), 200B medicare, 200B interest savings

    this morning: House to Vote on $2.4 Trillion Debt Increase, Cuts - Bloomberg
    Last edited by The Prof; 07-15-11 at 01:10 PM.

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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Sgt Meowenstein View Post
    He had to spend in order to stabilize the crap economy that Bush left him. You think Republicans don't spend? Are you forgetting the 2 wars, the Medicare drug plan, and the Bush tax cuts for the rich, none of which were paid for? ANd who passed TARP? Here's a hint, it wasn't Obama. Maybe you should just quit at this point. You lose.
    Well no, he did not have to do what he did to stabilize the economy. Other countries employed different strategies and are much better off for it. Nobody thinks that Republicans don't spend... they think Obama is much worse. TARP?? LOL Bush passed it, & Obama was staunchly behind it. Were he not, he could have chosen not to spend the money. Of course, he did spend the money and the vast majority of it has already been paid back.

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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    So Obama isn't holding the country in any financial hostage game? It's just the Republicans here? These faux cuts over 10 years amount again to pissing in the ocean.
    No. Cutting spending during this stage of the recovery is some kind of sick joke. You see, once the labor market slack begins to tighten up, the deficit will naturally contract without any new legislation. But as the labor market currently stands, fiscal consolidation will go dollar for dollar in terms of output (GDP) reductions i.e. you cut spending by $500 billion, and GDP falls by that same amount. Therefore, it is critical that the debt ceiling be raised ASAP. Otherwise the bond market will begin to play a different tune.

    so SS will be paid, he lied about this.
    Just because the trust fund will receive the interest payments/repayments for the scheduled debt that is owed, there is no guarantee that S.S. recipients will receive 100% of their scheduled payments. If it goes this way, something like 70% of the nominal payments would most likely be the result.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    I'll keep asking, perhaps someone will tackle this question.....



    Given all the revenue the government collects each month, who will be paid before the seniors, veterans, and military?



    Anyone?
    Interest on debt obligations will be paid first. Not sure if there is even a legal requirement that the others be paid - maybe the military.

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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    No. Cutting spending during this stage of the recovery is some kind of sick joke. You see, once the labor market slack begins to tighten up, the deficit will naturally contract without any new legislation. But as the labor market currently stands, fiscal consolidation will go dollar for dollar in terms of output (GDP) reductions i.e. you cut spending by $500 billion, and GDP falls by that same amount. Therefore, it is critical that the debt ceiling be raised ASAP. Otherwise the bond market will begin to play a different tune.
    That's the Keynsian theory... actual research has shown the opposite. That meaningful and permanent cuts can have a stimulative effect on the economy. If deficit reduction is to occur in a down economy, spending cuts are the single best approach.

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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    This is the true debate right here. When one studies economics it becomes apparent that economists are sort of like psychologists, in the sense that they have different schools of thought.

    The true debate shouldn't be on the specifics of this deal. The debate should be fought over the validity, the evidence or lack of, Keynsian Theory.

    I don't know much about this theory, only a very little. I was taught that the value of dollar in this model is determined by how fast the dollar goes through the economy. This is why you see commercials for debit and credit cards. Sure, the first reason is to advertise the services these cards present, but the second is to push people to use plastic. This inevitably speeds the process at which the dollar is rotated through the economy, thus strengthening the value of the dollar.

    Also, if I remember correctly credit is required in this perception of our economy. Credit allows people to spend more, thus speeding up the transfer of money through the economy.

    It is with this evidence, that I think it is apparent that Obama believes in Keynsian Theory. He wants to raise the debt ceiling so he can spend more, starting the cycle of the dollar through the economy, and his mind, will strengthen the currency.

    The problem is he hasn't realized that this is a school of thought. There are others, that have substantial evidence to show that their school of thought is more accurate.

    I was taught a more traditional approach to macroeconomics. I was taught during a recession you cut taxes, this increases the spending power of corporations, thus keeping consumption at a decent level, to the point that maybe they could still hire.

    It should be noted, that in both of these views consumption is key. The higher the consumption, the better the economy performs. We are now in a state of saving resources, at least that is what I feel like. Instead of going out and having dinner at a restaurant, I feel more and more people are cooking their own dinners.

    I feel like throwing more money in the economy isn't going to get people to consume more. It will probably do the opposite. Seeing the government throw money at the problem, their confidence in our government is going to decrease, resulting in more hording of resources, which in both models isn't good.

    We as a people have to think very carefully on how to perceive the economy. Should it be the keynsian school of thought, or others? That is the true debate, not exactly what program you are going to cut, or where you are going to put said resources.

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