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Thread: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    And Dems haven't? At least the GOP is trying to hold the line now, and liberals act like it's the end of the ****ing world. Seriously Redress, are you concerned about spending? I'm genuinely curious.
    But raising the debt ceiling has nothing to do with deficit reduction and everything to do with paying existing government obligations. Given that virtually ever economist, including the bi-partisan debt commission, has said the revenue enhancements (including taxes) are critical to deficit reduction, those that will not entertain such discussions are merely debt reduction charlatans; they are not really interested in debt reduction, they are interested on taking advantage of a good crisis to attack the social safety net.

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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Sgt Meowenstein View Post
    Yeah that's what I thought. You find one problem out of 42 and you dismiss the whole list. You're not even worth the time it took to type this post. How about all of those tax cuts? DO you hate tax cuts now? Never mind. You're a clueless partisan hack. Lay down and go to sleep. It's the best thing you could do for yourself.
    You're the one with the burden of proof. PROVE to me Obama had anything to do with any of that stuff. You come up with some list from some site, without anything to back it up. Where's the proof? Why don't the democrats push all those issues if they are so good for Obama? Why is some hack site from some hack member of a political forum the only place they're mentioned?

    *crickets*

    And yes, I'm going to bed. IVE GOT A JOB, AIN'T IT NICE? I'm closing on a house next week, you gotta job to? I doubt it, considering your some pansy on a political forum at almost midnight! LOL What a joke.
    Last edited by dontworrybehappy; 07-15-11 at 01:16 AM.

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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Yes I am concerned about spending. However, playing games like this with something that can have large negative impact on many Americans is not the way to do it, and pointing out that we would not have had to do this if conservatives actually cared about the debt when republicans are president is a perfectly valid point to make.

    There is a right way to do things and a wrong way to do things. This is the wrong way.
    So, any debt crisis is solely the doing of the GOP? Reps are just using the leverage they have now, you, like the Dems did with the health care monstrosity. If Obama's serious, why isn't that on the chopping block?
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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    Given that virtually ever economist, including the bi-partisan debt commission, has said the revenue enhancements (including taxes) are critical to deficit reduction, those that will not entertain such discussions are merely debt reduction charlatans; they are not really interested in debt reduction
    Obama was offered the revenue plan put forth by his debt commission and he refused, so does that make him a debt reduction charlatan?

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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    So, any debt crisis is solely the doing of the GOP?
    No, but this one certainly is.

    Reps are just using the leverage they have now,
    The fact that the credit of the United States is being used as "leverage" is a perfect illustration of this point. In order for something to be used as leverage, it has to be something that one side in the negotiation wants, and the other side doesn't want or doesn't care about. Which, sadly, seems to be pretty accurate.

    you, like the Dems did with the health care monstrosity.
    Obama's "leverage" in the health care debate was the fact that he was elected to the White House, there was a Democratic majority in the House, and a 60-vote Democratic supermajority in the Senate. On the other hand, in THIS debate, Republicans control one-half of one branch of government. Rather than using a strong political position as leverage, they are using the threat of forcing the United States into default as leverage.

    If Obama's serious, why isn't that on the chopping block?
    For lots of reasons, but let's go with the most simple one: the CBO says that the Affordable Care Act will substantially REDUCE the deficit over the next 10 years, and even more in the following decade.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 07-15-11 at 01:26 AM.
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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3 - Political Hotsheet - CBS News



    The Good President will have to let Old People, Disabled people STARVE because of the damned dirty GOP.

    Starve you hear, STARVE.
    I retired 19 months ago. My wife continues to work and I am on Social Security. Personally, I am at that point of frustration with the deficits and spending that I possibly do not care whether or not the Federal Government stays open for business. It might be best to shut it down. It would be painful for my wife and I, but we would survive.

    It is time for this country to have a complete reversal of policy. It is time for both parties to stop spending our hard-earned tax dollars as if it did not matter how much of a deficit they run. It probably is time that we shut down a government that has become tyrannical.

    It is probably time that we shut down a government that tells what size car we drive. It is probably time we shut down a government that tells us what type of lightbulb we must purchase, no matter how much we dislike the one we will have to purchase.
    It is probably time we shut down a government that tells us we can keep our insurance but entices companies to drop our insurance.
    It is probably time we shut down a government who forces us to spend excessive amounts of our hard-earned money for fuel for our cars when energy is abundantly available right now, but companies are not left alone to drill, pump, and refine our oil and gas.
    It is probably time that we shut down a government that wants to raise taxes when we are in a lingering malaise with continuing very high unemployment.
    It is probably time that we shut down a government that allows 47% of it's citizens to pay no income taxes.

    In 1964, there was a book published entitled, "You Can Trust the Communists To Be Communists." Today, one might write a book entitled, "You Can Trust Tax and Spend Democrats To Be Tax and Spend Democrats." President Obama within the past week has intimated that he wants to get this debt ceiling business behind us so he can go on a new or continued spending spree.

    Enough is enough! Too many Americans have yet to learn the virtue of frugality and many, unfortunately, will never learn it. Too many Americans have not saved or are not saving over their lifetime and have always lived for today. This is irresponsible. Also, and again very unfortunate, far too many people have become dependent on a nanny state to take care of them. This too is highly irresponsible. The result is the government spends and spends and taxes and taxes to provide services that individuals should provide for themselves. And then, surprise of surprises, the government spends far too much and runs deficits and creates debt that just explodes and the revenues can no longer pay the bills. And some sit around wondering how in the world could this have happened. And some even sit around telling us that their nanny bennies better not be cut.

    Shut it down!!! Well, at least shut down the tax and spenders and do it now!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    But raising the debt ceiling has nothing to do with deficit reduction and everything to do with paying existing government obligations. Given that virtually ever economist, including the bi-partisan debt commission, has said the revenue enhancements (including taxes) are critical to deficit reduction, those that will not entertain such discussions are merely debt reduction charlatans; they are not really interested in debt reduction, they are interested on taking advantage of a good crisis to attack the social safety net.
    Taking advantage of a good crisis. That sounds familiar. Wasn't it Rahm Emmanual that said you never let a good crisis go to waste. I don't believe that's what the GOP is doing here. What's the point of a debt celiing in the first place? The exact same arguments and scare tactics being used now would be used in the future any time someone wanted to raise the debt ceiling. Besides, the GOP has indicated a willingness to raise it, but not at the expense of taxpayers.
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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    But raising the debt ceiling has nothing to do with deficit reduction and everything to do with paying existing government obligations. Given that virtually ever economist, including the bi-partisan debt commission, has said the revenue enhancements (including taxes) are critical to deficit reduction, those that will not entertain such discussions are merely debt reduction charlatans; they are not really interested in debt reduction, they are interested on taking advantage of a good crisis to attack the social safety net.
    The raising of the debt ceiling has a great deal to do with deficit reduction. We have spent and spent and we have a huge deficit (42 cents of every dollar spent) and the debt is rising as fast as rocket to space. If the debt ceiling is raised with no reduction in spending, the raise will be for naught. Yes, it would authorize the debt, but it would not curb future spending. The President has already assured us that increased spending will commence immediately after this debt ceiling is passed. This must stop. Do you run your personal finances by borrowing 42 cents for every dollar you spend? If not, why not? Hopefully, it's because you have more common sense about your personal finances than many have about our federal budget.

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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    No, but this one certainly is.
    Really? Thought it was the GOP that seems to be acting as if the debt ceiling should mean something. So you somehow believe that raising the debt ceiling to to allow as much spending as desired, is actually the better policy for debt reduction?



    The fact that the credit of the United States is being used as "leverage" is a perfect illustration of this point. In order for something to be used as leverage, it has to be something that one side in the negotiation wants, and the other side doesn't want or doesn't care about. Which, sadly, seems to be pretty accurate.
    Yes, Dems want to raise taxes and the GOP doesn't want to. Sorry, but negotiation is part of politics. We've seen what Dems do when they aren't forced to negotiate.



    Obama's "leverage" in the health care debate was the fact that he was elected to the White House, there was a Democratic majority in the House, and a 60-vote Democratic supermajority in the Senate.
    Oh, did healthcare pass by a super majority vote? The majority of the people did not want Obamacare. That should have been evident when Scott Walker was elected.

    On the other hand, in THIS debate, Republicans control one-half of one branch of government. Rather than using a strong political position as leverage, they are using the threat of forcing the United States into default as leverage.
    I believe there's actually more of a mandate to attempt a control of govt spending than there ever was for health "reform". It's why Rep gained so much in 2010. I do think it's funny that Obama and the Dems have a super majority and you say it shows a strong political position yet the gains made by the GOP in 2010 meant nothing.



    For lots of reasons, but let's go with the most simple one: the CBO says that the Affordable Care Act will substantially REDUCE the deficit over the next 10 years, and even more in the following decade.
    The CBO could only work with the numbers they were given. Numbers that have been proven to be quite false.
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    Re: Obama says he cannot guarantee Social Security checks will go out on August 3

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    Really? Thought it was the GOP that seems to be acting as if the debt ceiling should mean something. So you somehow believe that raising the debt ceiling to to allow as much spending as desired, is actually the better policy for debt reduction?
    I think it's neither better nor worse in terms of debt reduction, as it doesn't have the slightest bearing on how much spending occurs in practice. But raising or eliminating the debt ceiling is certainly a better policy in terms of good governance, as it prevents an accidental default from occurring.

    Yes, Dems want to raise taxes and the GOP doesn't want to. Sorry, but negotiation is part of politics. We've seen what Dems do when they aren't forced to negotiate.
    Can you please specify what the Republicans are "negotiating" on exactly? What are they willing to give up, compared to the status quo? Their only bargaining chip is that the president actually doesn't want to see the nation default on its debt, whereas Republicans either don't care or are doing a good job of hiding it. So if the Republicans' prize in these negotiations is a whole slew of policy goodies, whereas the Democrats' prize is that the Republicans don't cause the US to default on its debt, that indicates to me that one side cares more about a default than the other. (Note: I'm not suggesting that that's because Republicans are ideologically opposed to it...Democrats did the same thing when they were in the opposition. Which is exactly the point: it's entirely political, and whichever party is in the opposition views the debt ceiling as the other side's problem.)

    Oh, did healthcare pass by a super majority vote? The majority of the people did not want Obamacare. That should have been evident when Scott Walker was elected.
    It never would have gotten passed if the voters hadn't elected Democrats to the White House, Senate, and House of Representatives in 2008. And really that's all the "leverage" that was needed.

    I believe there's actually more of a mandate to attempt a control of govt spending than there ever was for health "reform". It's why Rep gained so much in 2010. I do think it's funny that Obama and the Dems have a super majority and you say it shows a strong political position yet the gains made by the GOP in 2010 meant nothing.
    When the Republicans control the White House, House of Representatives, and a supermajority in the Senate (as the Democrats did in 2009) then those situations might be comparable. And that hypothetical Republican government would be well within the scope of its power to choose to not raise the debt ceiling and slash federal spending by 43% if it so desired...not that it actually would.

    The CBO could only work with the numbers they were given. Numbers that have been proven to be quite false.
    So then what makes you think that the numbers being cited for this round of deficit reduction talks are accurate? You can't just cite the CBO when it's convenient and then write them off when it isn't.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 07-15-11 at 02:20 AM.
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