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Thread: Boehner: Debt Ceiling Increase Obama's Problem

  1. #11
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    Re: Boehner: Debt Ceiling Increase Obama's Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    This logic is befuddling... we're spending too much, so the answer is to... raise taxes.

    $14,000,000,000,000.00 in debt and you think the answer is to keep spending? Serious cuts to entitlements. I know that too many people are stuck on this "Too much military spending" lie, but let's be honest here, Defense Spending is roughly 18% of the Budget, Entitlements are hovering just under 60%.

    Ya'lls answer is "We spend too much on the military we have to raise taxes?" NO. We have to cut SS, Medicaide and Medicare, drastically. Guess what, we CANNOT AFFORD THEM.
    No, my logic is not "we spend too much, let's raise taxes." My logic is this: we spend too much and we lowered taxes at a bad time to lower taxes....so let's cut spending and raise *some* taxes, carefully.

    You'll find that I am pretty moderate, even conservative on a fiscal level (well, conservative by most standards; not conservative based on the demands of the child-throwing-a-tantrum tea party philosophy). I DO think we need to adjust Medicare, probably in a big way like raising the eligibility age (full disclosure: I think Paul Ryan's approach sucks). I do think we should fix other entitlements like SS and Medicaid in ways that make sense. I do think we need to cut military spending to the extent we can afford to do so. Anything that is 18% of the budget...needs to be touched. Period. You can't act as if it's off the table when it's nearly 1/5 of the problem. So we need a balanced approach..I WANT a balanced approach. I don't want the wingnuts in my party to win this battle. The difference is...the Republicans, it appears, DO want the wingnuts to effectively wag the dog.

    Again, how can you possibly dispute that the Bush administration grew the government, and yet lowered taxes? If you are going to grow government, taxes cannot go down or budget problems will arise. They are related, as much as you guys do not want to admit it. Spending and spending alone does not exist in a vaccuum; the revenue side IS a factor and WAS adjusted just before we started having these deficit problems in the early years of President Bush. I am not in favor of massive tax increases on the middle class, particularly in this climate; we need to be careful. But revenues need to be on the table, every bit as much as everything else needs to be on the table. And to suggest otherwise is stubborn partisanship at its finest.
    Last edited by Swizz; 07-12-11 at 02:45 PM.

  2. #12
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    Re: Boehner: Debt Ceiling Increase Obama's Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by Swizz View Post
    No. Taxes reimburse the government for services it provides for its citizens. During the Bush administration, the government started doing MORE for its citizens. We started fighting 2 wars for our country's security (well, arguably). We started providing more benefits for seniors via Medicare. We started investing more in education. Etc. So the government was doing more for us in many ways. (And yes, the same for the Obama administration.) Taxes should have gone up, or at the very least stayed constant...they should not have gone down.

    The difference between liberals and conservatives is that liberals admit there is a spending problem and desire a balanced approach. Conservatives, on the other hand, still blindly support tax cuts, forever and ever amen, and refuse to even humor the idea of an increase in revenue. This sort of ideological purity is destructive and childish.
    How is maintaining current tax rates a cut? Is it your view that the "other side" has been totally adult in approuching the issue? The problem as I see it our govt. (all parties) have failed and are failing to do their job. Federal budget year starts Oct, every year, yet the Feds wait to the last minute to pass a budget. This debt issue has been known for months. Yet the elected officials have now waited to the last minute. It is time we get some "grown ups" in office who will do things on time. There is way to much bs coming from both sides.
    "I can explain it to you but, I can't understand it for you"

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    Re: Boehner: Debt Ceiling Increase Obama's Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by GoVote2012 View Post
    Seriously, you support 3 foreign wars over supporting your own people? Your elderly, sick, disabled? Wow.
    I support spending we can afford. "The Elderly and the Sick" cost us 3 TIMES as much as "foreign wars". In fact, if you were to shelves all military spending, we'd have a deficit of roughly $11,000,000,000,000.00

    So tell me, dear, how being $11,000,000,000,000.00 in debt is affordable, responsible governing? I know you think people are incapable of surviving without the hand of Government, but I have more faith in people. Besides, we both know most entitlement spending is just political bribes for votes. That's all Entitlement spending has ever been, "Vote for us, we'll give you other peoples money".
    Climate, changes. It takes a particularly uneducated population to buy into the idea that it's their fault climate is changing and further political solutions can fix it.



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    Re: Boehner: Debt Ceiling Increase Obama's Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    It's a little sick right? **** the old and infrim Americans, those guys in the ME need "freedom"! The forever war needs to go too. Foriegn aid needs to go. We don't have to scrap SS, Medicade, and Medicare; we can make changes to the system. We can also get rid of the Capital Gains Tax and tax that income as income would be normally taxed.

    The willingness of some to huck people into the street or prevent their care in order to continue imperial and agressive wars is befuddling. If we hadn't gotten into our forever war, we could have more than paid for universal healthcare. A real one, not this giveaway to the insurance companies Obama made.
    Exactly! We need to fix our problems at home before we try and fix the world. I understand as a world power we have some obligations, but not everything we have put on our plate. We can still have military- just not as much. I'm not saying cut everything. I'm saying lets not spend more then the rest of the world combined on defense- and we do!

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    Re: Boehner: Debt Ceiling Increase Obama's Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by mike2810 View Post
    How is maintaining current tax rates a cut?
    I'm speaking of the Bush tax cuts. They are supporting the Bush tax cuts, forever and ever amen...that is what I meant. They may not be a future tax cut but as enacted in the past, they were a tax cut and are still supported by conservatives across the board (even those, such as John McCain, who voted against them).

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    Re: Boehner: Debt Ceiling Increase Obama's Problem

    Well apparently i huge part of this country and this countries future is not the Republicans "problem" now....
    What a bunch of ****ing jerk offs.. "My way or the highway"? Seriously!? Your in congress. Debate come to a meeting point republicans!


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    Re: Boehner: Debt Ceiling Increase Obama's Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    I'm mildly shocked, this is past the point the GOP always caves in and gives up it's position to the Democrats in the "spirit of bi-partisanship" and usually get hosed.

    I guess the Tea Party really DOES matter.

    Let's face it folks, the problem is NOT a revenue problem, it's a spending problem. WE HAVE TO CUT SPENDING, not increase taxes.
    Yeah, and couple it with equal tax cuts.

    Starve the beast.

    That's what the "fiscal conservatives" at the state level have been doing.

    Creating millions of jobs in the process, just like every time taxes are cut.

    Because all money retained by businesses is used to create American jobs.

    Always. Just look at all those jobs the extension of the 01-03 cuts have created!

    Everybody knows its a couple percent in taxes forcing business overseas, not the lure of dirt cheap labor.
    Anyone wondering what I'm talking about start here:
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  8. #18
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    Re: Boehner: Debt Ceiling Increase Obama's Problem

    Republicans think Obama is playing rope a dope... and I agree. He is.

    The Tea Party does in fact matter - and I'd like to see, at least once in my lifetime, a group of politicians with a backbone. They say it's a myth - like elves and wood faeries and such. No raising the debt ceiling without a Constitutional Amendment for a Federal balanced budget. And I want it in writing from the Democrats... in blood, with fingerprints and a "no way out of it", and a few cases of scotch so the progressives can blame it on being **** faced drunk when they signed it.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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    Advisor Swizz's Avatar
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    Re: Boehner: Debt Ceiling Increase Obama's Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    Because all money retained by businesses is used to create American jobs.

    Always.
    Yeah, so where are the jobs then? Businesses are sitting on record profits.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    Republicans think Obama is playing rope a dope... and I agree. He is.

    The Tea Party does in fact matter - and I'd like to see, at least once in my lifetime, a group of politicians with a backbone. They say it's a myth - like elves and wood faeries and such. No raising the debt ceiling without a Constitutional Amendment for a Federal balanced budget. And I want it in writing from the Democrats... in blood, with fingerprints and a "no way out of it", and a few cases of scotch so the progressives can blame it on being **** faced drunk when they signed it.
    Why in writing from the Democrats? A Republican president and Congress are what UN-balanced the budget after Clinton left office.
    Last edited by Swizz; 07-12-11 at 02:59 PM.

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    Re: Boehner: Debt Ceiling Increase Obama's Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by Swizz View Post
    I'm speaking of the Bush tax cuts. They are supporting the Bush tax cuts, forever and ever amen...that is what I meant. They may not be a future tax cut but as enacted in the past, they were a tax cut and are still supported by conservatives across the board (even those, such as John McCain, who voted against them).
    If the Bush rates are so bad. Why did the likes of Pelosi take advantage of them instead of contributing what they consider their fair share? Pelosi did nothing wrong in following approved tax rates. I am saying if they so strongly feel the "rich" need to pay "their fair share", why have they not contributed at the rate they feel is appropriate along? It is political bs to me to say the rich need to pay more, yet Pelosi has not. Contributions/gifts to the govt. can be done above the tax rate.
    "I can explain it to you but, I can't understand it for you"

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