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California Marines Accused of Sham Marriages for Money

GPS_Flex

GPS_Flex

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California Marines Accused of Sham Marriages for Money

The military alleges that a Lesbian couple -- one a Marine, the other a civilian -- decided to live together off base and wanted to collect the $1,200 housing benefit granted to married Marines.

The female Marine found a male Marine willing to get married, allowing them to collect the housing benefit, and the civilian woman also eventually married a Marine and collected funds, 1st Lt. Maureen Dooley, a spokeswoman at Marine Corps Air Station Miramar in San Diego, said Saturday.

The female Marine, Cpl. Ashley Vice, told San Diego's KGTV-TV that she and her partner, Jaime Murphy, were forced to enter sham marriages because the military does not provide allowances for unmarried couples and they couldn't afford to live off base without the extra money. She and her partner only wanted to "be a family," Vice said.
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I was originally opposed to the repeal of DADT because I was worried that the military would suffer additional burdens in the form of lawsuits and requirements of special treatment for gay or lesbian members.

I changed my position on the issue when many of you made clear that lawsuits against the military for discrimination etc. are not allowed under current law. With that in mind, I would like to know if any of you now think the individuals in this story should get special treatment and not be charged with a crime.
 
I don't think so. I'm not a person that cares much what gay people do, and this is not really even about gay, IMO. It is people lying to cheat the gov't, just like welfare people do. Some may choose to say "Well, if they were allowed to marry, blahblah..", but the fact is they weren't, and they chose to do things this way. Lots of people cheat the system, but for some reason I hold military to a higher standard of honor. Is that fair of me? I have no idea.
 
I know it is illegal for citizens to marry illegals just to get them citizenship. Not that this is like that, but an example that there are laws on the books about cheating to get gov't benies. IMO people that intentionally do things just to cheat the gov't (tax payers), they should be punished.
 
Well, yeah they should face the penalty, sure they're in a ****ty situation that needs to be changed, but until it is they're accountable for their actions.
 
These kinds of marriages happen with hetero couples all the time in the service. Now that DADT has been lifted, it will happen with homo couples, as well.

There's no doubt that straight soldiers will enter into sham marriages to collect the bennies. That's where the showball is going to start.
 
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krickitt said:
I don't think so. I'm not a person that cares much what gay people do, and this is not really even about gay, IMO. It is people lying to cheat the gov't, just like welfare people do. Some may choose to say "Well, if they were allowed to marry, blahblah..", but the fact is they weren't, and they chose to do things this way. Lots of people cheat the system, but for some reason I hold military to a higher standard of honor. Is that fair of me? I have no idea.
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It is my understanding that the “we only did it because we aren’t allowed to marry” excuse is what the individuals who were caught are trying to use.
 
GPS_Flex said:
California Marines Accused of Sham Marriages for Money


I was originally opposed to the repeal of DADT because I was worried that the military would suffer additional burdens in the form of lawsuits and requirements of special treatment for gay or lesbian members.

I changed my position on the issue when many of you made clear that lawsuits against the military for discrimination etc. are not allowed under current law. With that in mind, I would like to know if any of you now think the individuals in this story should get special treatment and not be charged with a crime.
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I sympathize with the individuals involved, but breaking the rules is breaking the rules. You can't afford to live off-base? Live on-base. If you can't live off-base without the housing allowance, then either wait until gay marriage passes in California, or wait until your fiscal situation is more sound. A sham marriage is a sham marriage. Fraud and larceny is fraud and larceny. If you plan on breaking the rules, you better be prepared to face the consequences. You do the crime, you do the time.

On a different note, how exactly do you determine if a marriage is a "sham"?
 
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apdst said:
These kinds of marriages happen with hetero couples all the time in the service. Now that DADT has been lifted, it will happen with homo couples, as well.

There's no doubt that straight soldiers will enter into sham marriages to collect the bennies. That's where the showball is going to start.
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When they are caught, they are held to account. There are quite a few instances where this has happened.
 
GPS_Flex said:
It is my understanding that the “we only did it because we aren’t allowed to marry” excuse is what the individuals who were caught are trying to use.
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Not only that, they double dipped.
 
GPS_Flex said:
When they are caught, they are held to account. There are quite a few instances where this has happened.
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They only catch about 1% ofthe service members who engage in this activity.
 
StillBallin75 said:
I sympathize with the individuals involved, but breaking the rules is breaking the rules. You can't afford to live off-base? Live on-base. If you can't live off-base without the housing allowance, then either wait until gay marriage passes in California, or wait until your fiscal situation is more sound. A sham marriage is a sham marriage. Fraud and larceny is fraud and larceny. If you plan on breaking the rules, you better be prepared to face the consequences. You do the crime, you do the time.

On a different note, how exactly do you determine if a marriage is a "sham"?
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They couldn't live on post, either, because they're not married.
 
apdst said:
They couldn't live on post, either, because they're not married.
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I know that, I only meant that they should behave like most unmarried, dating couples. That goes for everyone, if you can't live off-base, stay in the barracks :shrug:
 
So-- they are going to make this a gay marriage issue to try to sidestep that they did this thing? Weak, but I'm sure they will have a huge defense team. Don't like the laws? Get them changed. We don't change laws by breaking them, although that is often difficult to believe these days..
 
apdst said:
They only catch about 1% ofthe service members who engage in this activity.
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Probably true. In fact, that might be the biggest downside to gays and lesbians in the military because it is much easier to spot do to the sex of partners etc.
 
GPS_Flex said:
Probably true. In fact, that might be the biggest downside to gays and lesbians in the military because it is much easier to spot do to the sex of partners etc.
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There's still a pretty big social stigma attached to being gay, though.
 
GPS_Flex said:
Probably true. In fact, that might be the biggest downside to gays and lesbians in the military because it is much easier to spot do to the sex of partners etc.
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It's another one of those aspects about military life that some folks didn't give the first damn thought to when they pissed-n-moaned about DADT.
 
StillBallin75 said:
There's still a pretty big social stigma attached to being gay, though.
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Same can be said for being a white male, a black woman, an Arabic male etc.

Stigmas will always exist. It is part of human nature.
 
The double dipping part is what I have an issue with

I can accept the singular case of a sham marriage, given the fact they couldnt live on base as a couple, but the second sham marriage goes beyond what would be acceptable in my books. It goes towards committing fraud to enrich oneself rather then making the system provide equal treatment
 
Just for the record-- I think straight people that do this should also be punished. Just like I think people that choose NOT to get married to collect welfare should be punished. We can't afford this kind of fraud, and I don't care WHO it is or what their excuse is. Do the right thing. Why is that such an issue?
 
GPS_Flex said:
Same can be said for being a white male, a black woman, an Arabic male etc.

Stigmas will always exist. It is part of human nature.
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Sure, I only meant that the fact that it's still a big social stigma will probably discourage this kind of behavior on the part of male troops to some degree, you know. For a lot of people, being able to live in a house isn't worth being known as the "gay guy" especially if you aren't really gay.
 
apdst said:
It's another one of those aspects about military life that some folks didn't give the first damn thought to when they pissed-n-moaned about DADT.
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This is more of a gay marriage issue than a DADT issue.
 
StillBallin75 said:
Sure, I only meant that the fact that it's still a big social stigma will probably discourage this kind of behavior on the part of male troops to some degree, you know. For a lot of people, being able to live in a house isn't worth being known as the "gay guy" especially if you aren't really gay.
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They can do it without anyone knowing.
 
Yes this is fraud, but there's a human ingredient here. Do they deserve the punishment of the law, I believe yes since they broke the law. But if the current law do not allow same sex marriages, I think we have to reconsider this. The bottom line is we are discriminating towards gays in many aspects. For regular people like ourselves, we can just be who we are. But for gays, they have to choose to 'come out' even then they face numerous discrimination from others. That in itself is quite unfair.

I'm originally from China, I can not tell you the discrimination gays face there. It's treated like a disease. No one can just 'came out' like here. US although far ahead of China is still not quite the notion of 'equality' for gays. For a society based on human rights, it really troubles me to see gays cannot get the equal rights here.
 
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