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Amazon to California: Read My Lips, No Online Sales Tax(edited)

Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

obvious Child said:
What is the justification to pay sales tax? Are they using any of the state services to produce and deliver their product? No. Why should they pay sales tax? If I sell to you over the internet and deliver by USPS, what state service have I benefited from? This is why the nexus issue has always stood. There has to be some tangible reason for collecting the tax. Without nexus, there should be no tax.



So you are basically just for enforcing an inter-custom unions tarriff even when there is no tangible economic business reason to tax them?
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Are you trying to claim that you don't benefit from taxes paid ot the state you live in?

You are also trying to claim that the delivery of the product to your door did not use facilities paid with state tax dollars? So, I guess the delivery service used private roads to bring you the product you purchased, right? And the facilities you used to actually order the product? Telecom lines don't benefit from public sector facilities?
 
Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

obvious Child said:
What is the justification to pay sales tax? Are they using any of the state services to produce and deliver their product? No. Why should they pay sales tax? If I sell to you over the internet and deliver by USPS, what state service have I benefited from? This is why the nexus issue has always stood. There has to be some tangible reason for collecting the tax. Without nexus, there should be no tax.

So you are basically just for enforcing an inter-custom unions tarriff even when there is no tangible economic business reason to tax them?
ludahai said:
Are you trying to claim that you don't benefit from taxes paid ot the state you live in?
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How do you get that from what he said?

ludahai said:
You are also trying to claim that the delivery of the product to your door did not use facilities paid with state tax dollars? So, I guess the delivery service used private roads to bring you the product you purchased, right? And the facilities you used to actually order the product? Telecom lines don't benefit from public sector facilities?
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1. Just because one benefits in some way (roads) from taxes does not mean they agree that said benefits are most efficiently provided by the government nor do they often even have a choice in the matter. Benefiting from a redistribution of wealth does not mean one should support it.
2. USPS contracts private delivery services like Fedex because they're less efficient.
3. What about digital download sales via satellite internet to a home that is energy self sufficient, in a privately secured neighborhood?

The internet is doing great without the government getting involved, did you shed a tear when Netflix turned your local Blockbuster into a 7-11 Vending machine? Or were you glad, like I, that the location was replaced with anther business?
 
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Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

Amazon will still sell in California tax free. That's why they cut ties with the affiliates here. The affiliates were considered a corporate presence and their sales taxable. By severing the ties with the California affiliates, purchases in California from an out of state supplier through Amazon still won't be charged sales tax. If they ever decide to charge all California on line retailers sales tax regardless of where the order comes from, online retailers can simply move their transaction servers to a state that doesn't. Then set up an on-line bank account with your current business bank in the same state, then transfer the money once in a while. Drop shippers are exempt, so your California business becomes a drop shipper. Don't for get to collect and pay the sales tax for in state purchases in your new business location.
 
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Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

ludahai said:
Are you trying to claim that you don't benefit from taxes paid ot the state you live in?

You are also trying to claim that the delivery of the product to your door did not use facilities paid with state tax dollars? So, I guess the delivery service used private roads to bring you the product you purchased, right? And the facilities you used to actually order the product? Telecom lines don't benefit from public sector facilities?
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Why state factilities are you talking about?
 
Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

American said:
Why state factilities are you talking about?
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Roads? And depending upon the jurisdiction, telecom facilities...

Not that it really matters... it goes into the general fund for the good of the state... I prefer consumption taxes to income taxes, but this circumvents them...

I wonder how many of the people supporting Amazon here support the Fair Tax as a replacement to the income tax.
 
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Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

ludahai said:
Roads? And depending upon the jurisdiction, telecom facilities...
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Those are paid through delivery charges, and Amazon pays its telecom through it's own services. Don't try to make people pay unnecessary taxes.
 
Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

ludahai said:
Are you trying to claim that you don't benefit from taxes paid ot the state you live in?

You are also trying to claim that the delivery of the product to your door did not use facilities paid with state tax dollars? So, I guess the delivery service used private roads to bring you the product you purchased, right? And the facilities you used to actually order the product? Telecom lines don't benefit from public sector facilities?
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Are you saying UPS pays no vehicle tax or license fees used to maintain the roads in the state they're in?
 
Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

.... not to mention gasoline tax for every gallon purchased.
 
Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

Prof. Peabody said:
Are you saying UPS pays no vehicle tax or license fees used to maintain the roads in the state they're in?
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what of the person buying the good or service, the one who gets charged the sales tax? Amazon does not pay the sales tax, the consumer does, Amazon just collects it and remits it to the government. The consumer definately uses the roads and infrustructure that the taxes pay for.
 
Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

The conservatives who posted replies on the first page simply don't want free and fair trade. If your state has a sales tax, as a conservative or anyone who promotes free trade, you should want those taxes to apply to all businesses equally.

Lord Tammerlain said:
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what of the person buying the good or service, the one who gets charged the sales tax? Amazon does not pay the sales tax, the consumer doe
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This has been shown to be false. Businesses typical pay taxes though a number of means such as slightly reduced wages, reducing cost, paying out of profits, etc. However, state sales tax is paid by the consumer. The reason for wanting the sales tax applied to online transactions is not just about collecting more revenue, its about fair and free trade. Amazon, before the addition of sales tax to online transactions, had an unfair advantage over every business in Cali. If you are a conservative, you should want all taxes to be applied fairly and throughout, not piecemeal that picks winner and losers.
 
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Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

xpiher said:
The conservatives who posted replies on the first page simply don't want free and fair trade. If your state has a sales tax, as a conservative or anyone who promotes free trade, you should want those taxes to apply to all businesses equally.



This has been shown to be false. Businesses typical pay taxes though a number of means such as slightly reduced wages, reducing cost, paying out of profits, etc. However, state sales tax is paid by the consumer. The reason for wanting the sales tax applied to online transactions is not just about collecting more revenue, its about fair and free trade. Amazon, before the addition of sales tax to online transactions, had an unfair advantage over every business in Cali. If you are a conservative, you should want all taxes to be applied fairly and throughout, not piecemeal that picks winner and losers.
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The sales tax is paid by the consumer, but as you state, if a retailer does not charge the sales tax while another has to, the one without the sales tax will have the lower effect price and gain more sales.
 
Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

Amazon has been collecting sales taxes in California for some time now.

It is not Amazon paying sales taxes, you understand, but purchasers. If you purchase locally, you pay sales tax. If you purchase online, you pay sales tax. Exempting one or the other from collecting taxes would be unfair, don't you think?

Anyone taking bets on whether Amazon will quit doing business in California over this issue? Anyone?
 
Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

Dittohead not! said:
Amazon has been collecting sales taxes in California for some time now.

It is not Amazon paying sales taxes, you understand, but purchasers. If you purchase locally, you pay sales tax. If you purchase online, you pay sales tax. Exempting one or the other from collecting taxes would be unfair, don't you think?

Anyone taking bets on whether Amazon will quit doing business in California over this issue? Anyone?
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If Amazon is outside of Cali, it's perfectly fine for them to not collect sales tax.
California has no taxing jurisdiction outside of it's state lines.

To stop any bs about "well they use California infrastructure."

That is all paid for by the individual or business through user fees and other taxes.
(Gas taxes, taxes on utilities, etc.)
 
Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

Harry Guerrilla said:
If Amazon is outside of Cali, it's perfectly fine for them to not collect sales tax.
California has no taxing jurisdiction outside of it's state lines.

To stop any bs about "well they use California infrastructure."

That is all paid for by the individual or business through user fees and other taxes.
(Gas taxes, taxes on utilities, etc.)
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Do people purchasing online somehow use less government services than people buying in a brick and mortar store? Do they homeschool their kids, put out their own fires rather than calling the fire department, arrest their own prowlers? Remember, it is the buyer who lives in California paying the taxes, not the seller.
 
Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

Misterveritis said:
Let's just hope that every state that tries this gets the same response.
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So, Amazon will close up shop? Is that what they want?

Tennessee (completely ruled by Republicans) is considering charging sales tax for online purchases for companies who deliver from Tennessee - because sales tax is the largest form of revenue for the state. If they keep fighting it, they may run out of places to work from.
 
Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

FilmFestGuy said:
So, Amazon will close up shop? Is that what they want?

Tennessee (completely ruled by Republicans) is considering charging sales tax for online purchases for companies who deliver from Tennessee - because sales tax is the largest form of revenue for the state. If they keep fighting it, they may run out of places to work from.
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No, they'll just move to a state that doesn't shaft them with taxes. Who wins in that case? I'll give you a hint: it won't be California.
 
Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

Amazon will quit marketing to California when pigs fly, Hell freezes, and San Francisco goes Republican.
 
Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

apdst said:
No, they'll just move to a state that doesn't shaft them with taxes. Who wins in that case? I'll give you a hint: it won't be California.
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So you don't want taxes to be applied evenly and fairly then?
 
Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

xpiher said:
So you don't want taxes to be applied evenly and fairly then?
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Since when have taxes been applied evenly and fairly?
 
Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

xpiher said:
So you don't want taxes to be applied evenly and fairly then?
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How is making someone who lives in possum pecker, Arkingsas pay California's high ass taxes fair and even?
 
Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

apdst said:
How is making someone who lives in possum pecker, Arkingsas pay California's high ass taxes fair and even?
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You didn't read the article?

California plans to force online retailers to collect sales taxes from consumers in the state, a new rule that drew shouts of outrage from Web-shopping giants like Amazon.com and O.co, also known as Overstock.com
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So its not people in another state paying cali taxes. Its calis paying cali taxes when buying goods in cali on line.
 
Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

xpiher said:
You didn't read the article?



So its not people in another state paying cali taxes. Its calis paying cali taxes when buying goods in cali on line.
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Oh, is that?!? I see. Well, when they purchase goods, online, from another state will they have to pay Cali taxes, then, too?
 
Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

apdst said:
Oh, is that?!? I see. Well, when they purchase goods, online, from another state will they have to pay Cali taxes, then, too?
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Edit: I miss read your question. No, this only applies to buying and selling goods in Cail. If you buy goods while in another site, you are subject to that state's laws. If you want to go over the state border and order something, you should be able to avoid the tax.

You are in cali, buying goods online you should have to pay a sales tax. The reason why Amazon is against this is because one of the main reason why people do a lot of shopping on their site is to avoid paying sales to tax to get their goods cheaper. However, this is not a free trade practice and is why everyone should be against the special privilege enjoyed by Amazon before the law passed.
 
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Re: California Screws the Pooch. Amazon cuts ties

ludahai said:
Are you trying to claim that you don't benefit from taxes paid ot the state you live in?
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I'll just quote this:

Lachean said:
How do you get that from what he said?
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You never answered him. What state resource or service has been used by a buyer buying a good or service provided by an out of state business? What reason for Nexus has occurred?

You are also trying to claim that the delivery of the product to your door did not use facilities paid with state tax dollars?
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Are you unaware of what USPS is?

So, I guess the delivery service used private roads to bring you the product you purchased, right?
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Which is irrelevant to the original transaction as its provided by a third party which pays taxes on its sales within the state. Not the sale of the actual product.

And the facilities you used to actually order the product? Telecom lines don't benefit from public sector facilities?
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To the degree of monopolistic tolerance yes. But that has never been grounds for nexus as the telecom lines are not owned by the sellers of the products.

You have to prove why nexus should be rejected despite being the foundation for interstate sales tax for decades.
 
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